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Trigeminal nerve inflammation. Update Post #25

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  • Trigeminal nerve inflammation. Update Post #25

    Anyone dealing with this? What are you doing to solve? I've heard people using MSM, how much and has it solved the problem? Any web sites that offer help.

    I've googled but can't seem to find a user friendly site. I've also searched for this particular nerve inflammation and nothing came up here. If you know of specific threads, super! I did just read French Fry's thread on head shaking and went to those web sites recommended as well.

    My horse has always had a mild tick when I ride. In recent years if I keep his muzzle hairs very short, the problem goes away. Recently the horse was put on U7. I only bring this up as his symptoms seem to have escalated. I'm not sure if the two go hand in hand or if there are more allergens this particular year.

    I'm dealing with a lot more frenetic head tossing and rubbing the side of his face on his legs during the ride. He also seems to be quite the jerk which he can be but not in this irrational manner. I've had nerve pain so I can understand his irrational manner if this is nerve pain.

    Incidentally on turn out, I see no symptoms. He is ridden in a full cheek snaffle on a loose rein. It's doesn't seem to matter if I gather up contact or not. This horse DOES have TMJ but this head shaking is totally different than his TMJ symptoms which we treat with a chiro. He was just floated Oct. 4 2009 by a vet. The previous dental treatments were by an equine dentist. He gets floated about every 7 months due to his TMJ. Again, this past Oct was by the vet as she was at the farm to euth a horse and we did the float at the same time for convenience.

    Horse is 10 year old TB/Perch/QH cross. We trail ride and do some light dressage work on contact but most riding is done on a loose rein. The U7 could simply be a coincidence as we're starting to bud and spring is here in NY state. There is a small amount of MSM in U7.

    Thanks in advance and any info is appreciated.
    Last edited by pines4equines; Apr. 29, 2009, 10:19 PM. Reason: Added an update
    Sorry! But that barn smell is my aromatherapy!
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  • Original Poster

    #2
    Hay

    Okay I just found this thread as well:
    http://www.chronicleforums.com/Forum...e+inflammation

    PS: Horse has not yet had his shots this year.

    PSS: I've found a few threads using different key words. His condition seems to be aggravated with stress while ridden. For example, when I ride alone, I don't seem to have as many symptoms. Add another rider or two and escalate the speed, and his symptoms escalate. (I do know the difference between exuberance and what he is exhibiting.)
    Last edited by pines4equines; Apr. 27, 2009, 10:34 AM. Reason: Added PS
    Sorry! But that barn smell is my aromatherapy!
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    • #3
      I just started dealing with this today in my filly who's had a mild case since she was a yearling. She does not seem affected while being ridden but I ride early in the morning. She is not affected outside, but once she comes in she does that whole wierd thing as if a bee is in the stable and then tosses her head. Eating is annoying for her and I think the metal feed pots make it worse. I'll have to go back to the plastic one. I have her on MSM too. I don't think hers is vaccine related as she had her yearly flu/tet booster a couple of months ago and that's all she ever gets. I was thinking of trying a nose net if problems escalate. A whole fly mask is out of the question with this one but thats a whole nother thread!

      Terri
      COTH, keeping popcorn growers in business for years.

      "I need your grace to remind me to find my own." Snow Patrol-Chasing Cars. This line reminds me why I have horses.

      Comment


      • #4
        There was an article in Practical Horseman about this-- I don't remember now which month, but in the past three. Perhaps try their website and then see if you can get a back issue?

        Comment


        • #5
          What makes you so sure that the nerve is the problem? Sounds more like an allergic headshaker to me but they can appear similiar.
          McDowell Racing Stables

          Home Away From Home

          Comment

          • Original Poster

            #6
            Hay

            I actually don't know but one thing that is a bit weird is the rubbing of his face on his legs during the ride. He tends to rub more of the area above the muzzle under the eye rather than his muzzle.

            And also, he is more of a head shaker in stressful situations. When I ride alone and we are completely unstressed, he is a different horse? He does have the tick which I've fixed in previous years with clipping his muzzle hairs closely but he doesn't have this furious head rubbing on his legs thing. It seems to get worse as the stress increases. (I mean trail riding with other horses is about as stressful as this horse's life gets.)

            Again as mentioned in original post, he is seems worse in a stressful situation. More horses going out with us, any speed during the ride, etc. (And, it's not during the speed.) When I go by myself, we amble along and nothing over a trot. Lots of stopping to sniff the flowers kind of ride.

            Thanks again!
            Sorry! But that barn smell is my aromatherapy!
            One of our horsey bumper stickers! www.horsehollowpress.com
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            • #7
              I'm dealing with symptoms that sound quite similar to your horse's. I found that Practical Horseman article to be really informative. I got the horse a nose net, which seems to help, but also kind of distracts him while I'm riding. I've noticed that he seems to get much more irritated on the trail where the grass is taller - he is pretty much fine in the ring, but hacking out, he gets itchier as the ride progresses.
              "A canter is a cure for every evil." -Benjamin Disraeli

              Comment


              • #8
                I have a friend who has trigeminal nerve pain. She took anti-convulsion medication for it for 2 years and it went way...mostly. Not related if your horse has allergies. But maybe something to mention to the vet.
                “If you are irritated by every rub, how will your mirror be polished?”
                ? Rumi






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                • Original Poster

                  #9
                  Hay

                  There's another head shaker thread going around. I'll try the facial net first and if that doesn't resolve the issues then I'll come back. It's just weird that he's a normal horse in a no-stress situation. But I'll be out by myself on Wednesday, I'll re-analyze the situation better then too.
                  Sorry! But that barn smell is my aromatherapy!
                  One of our horsey bumper stickers! www.horsehollowpress.com
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                  • #10
                    All headshaking is related to a disorder with the trigeminal nerve - the triggers (light, allergies, etc) just differ.

                    I have been dealing with this in my event horse for the past 5 years or so, and have tried everything under the sun. He's on a program now that keeps him comfortable and show-able, but it took me a good 4 years of trial and error.

                    One thing I have found to really help is chiropractic. If the horse's atlas or jaw is out it puts additional pressure on the trigeminal nerve. I get my horse adjusted every 6-8 weeks, and it makes a HUGE difference in how severe his symptoms are.

                    Comment

                    • Original Poster

                      #11
                      Hay

                      Thank you eventinglvr. He is due for an adjustment.
                      Sorry! But that barn smell is my aromatherapy!
                      One of our horsey bumper stickers! www.horsehollowpress.com
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                      • #12
                        These symptoms are described in Dr. Robert Cook's book, Metal in the Mouth and shows how the bit sits right where the trigeminal nerve branches and gets irritated by the bit. Especially what you say about the muzzle rubbing, he claims to be caused by the bit. As well as your other symptoms. I would guess the 'stressful' situation results in more use of the bit for stopping, aggravating the situation. Out of curiousity you might want to try riding without a bit and see what if anything happens.

                        A relative in my family took anti-convulsive meds for years for trigeminal pain and it did not help.

                        Comment

                        • Original Poster

                          #13
                          Hay

                          Androcles:

                          THANK YOU! I recently adjusted the bit only because I cleaned the bridle top to bottom. I had just renoticed this past weekend that it was higher in his mouth than usual. Several years ago, I realized this horse does not like the two wrinkle thing. Again, I noticed the two wrinkle thing this past weekend. I will do that immediately.

                          Gosh! Wouldn't be great if that solved the problem? A freebie fix...It just can't happen...you usually have to empty your wallet to solve a horsie problem. Thank you again and wouldn't that be super if that was the problem and I solved it by simply lowering the bit?

                          Stay tuned...
                          Sorry! But that barn smell is my aromatherapy!
                          One of our horsey bumper stickers! www.horsehollowpress.com
                          Add Very Funny Horse Bumper Stickers on facebook

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by pines4equines View Post
                            Androcles:

                            THANK YOU! I recently adjusted the bit only because I cleaned the bridle top to bottom. I had just renoticed this past weekend that it was higher in his mouth than usual. Several years ago, I realized this horse does not like the two wrinkle thing. Again, I noticed the two wrinkle thing this past weekend. I will do that immediately.

                            Gosh! Wouldn't be great if that solved the problem? A freebie fix...It just can't happen...you usually have to empty your wallet to solve a horsie problem. Thank you again and wouldn't that be super if that was the problem and I solved it by simply lowering the bit?

                            Stay tuned...
                            You mean he doesn't have the problem at ALL with the bit lowered?!? or just less severe? I still suggest you take a look at the book to understand the anatomy of where the bit sits, if this is an issue for your horse. You definitely don't have to empty your 'walley' (to quote Deltawave, who is trying to become British apparently).

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Questions for 5chestnuts...

                              What is a double dose of Lysine?

                              How soon after starting the Lysine did you see the good results?

                              Is it necessary to include MSM and/or spirulina?

                              Thanks!

                              Comment

                              • Original Poster

                                #16
                                Hay

                                Androcles said: "You mean he doesn't have the problem at ALL with the bit lowered?!? or just less severe?"

                                Yes, he has the problem but less severe. It is funny all this head tossing around rubbing coincided with the weather change we had here however, it also coincides with the bridle cleaning and adjustments I did.

                                Again, wouldn't it be great if it's as simple as that?
                                Sorry! But that barn smell is my aromatherapy!
                                One of our horsey bumper stickers! www.horsehollowpress.com
                                Add Very Funny Horse Bumper Stickers on facebook

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  pine4equines,

                                  Sounds like your horse may be turning into a headshaker. I have a mare who started to develop symptoms last spring. It started out as an occasional tick undersaddle. In the 10 months since, she has gotten progressively worse so that she now does it just standing in her paddock (on bad days).

                                  Some horses are seasonal headshakers and some continue year-round. My mare happens to be a consistant (year-round headshaker). She's on about $120 of medication each month, several supplements and has become a repeat offender at the veterinary clinic.

                                  It is a very frusterating condition and not all horses respond to the same stimulus (mine, for instance, does not headshake in response to sunlight, allergies, ear mites, dental problems, bit issues, or behavioral problems. What causes sets her off is still undetermined).

                                  Try to get it under control as soon as you can...my mare has progressively gotten worse over time and I suspect some of that can be attributed to taking a conservative approach in the beginning (possibly nerve windup has contributed). My mare hasn't been rideable for months and it is really heartbreaking to watch her on a bad day. We've been able to keep her relatively comfortable most of the time and are hoping to find a combination of therapies that work for her but, from what I've been told, many of these horses progress to the point that euthanasia is the only humane option.

                                  Best of luck to you and your boy! There is some great research out there that I'd be happy to point you at, if you're interested.

                                  Comment

                                  • Original Poster

                                    #18
                                    Hay

                                    outwestpoloplayer said: "There is some great research out there that I'd be happy to point you at, if you're interested."

                                    Please do!
                                    Sorry! But that barn smell is my aromatherapy!
                                    One of our horsey bumper stickers! www.horsehollowpress.com
                                    Add Very Funny Horse Bumper Stickers on facebook

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      Originally posted by eventinglvr View Post
                                      have tried everything under the sun.
                                      Does under the sun include trying to ride without the bit?

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        The Practical Horseman article on head-tossing is in the April 2009 issue, page 55.

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