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Who is feeding whole oats?

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    #21
    How long does it take for crimped oats to lose their nutritional value? Days? Weeks?

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      #22
      I am feeding an oat based horse grain plus toasted soybeans to my daughter's Mexican Mustang that she uses for gaming and to the underweight Tennessee Walking Horse gelding that we got in mid-March. The TWH was a rack of bones. Plus they get good quality hay. The TWH was a notorious cribber. We haven't seen any signs of cribbing for about 2 weeks. I think it's due to a number of things, one being ulcer meds, but I definitely think the oats and soybeans have helped. He has gained 70 pounds since mid-March (shows you how skinny he was) and now just looks ribby instead of scary-skinny. The diet is not making either horse hot. The soybeans are high in fat and protein with no sugar.

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        #23
        FG, it might be that his gut is just really not working optimally yet, or maybe that it never will. He might also have some chronic pain issues that need to be addressed before he will gain/sustain weight. Feel free to call me anytime and talk about it if you'd like. You know I love the RB's but that might not be right for him either.

        I personally would not feed oats to an aged horse who was having weight issues, I would get those aminos thru Tri-Amino (no starch, baby!) but that is me. Re: oats, if you are going to feed them you should feed them whole, not steamed, crimped or otherwise tampered with. The hull has something to do w/slowing down the release of starches and sugars from them (probably because they take longer to digest? Not sure).

        Sorry if this has been covered, I don't have time to read this whole thread right now!
        "Kindness is free" ~ Eurofoal
        ---
        The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances.

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          #24
          I started feeding my horses whole oats about six months ago, combined with a little beet pulp, BOSS and a vitamin/mineral supplement, plus free choice grass hay. Most of mine get about 2 to 2.5# of oats per day. I doubt if I would return to a commercial processed feed although I do like Triple Crown Low Starch and Legends Pleasure Pellets. They got too expensive and I decided to try what I'm feeding now. I like the results - they look good and act like they feel good.
          Susan N.

          Don't get confused between my personality & my attitude. My personality is who I am, my attitude depends on who you are.

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            #25
            Originally posted by EqTrainer View Post
            Re: oats, if you are going to feed them you should feed them whole, not steamed, crimped or otherwise tampered with. The hull has something to do w/slowing down the release of starches and sugars from them (probably because they take longer to digest? Not sure).
            Agreed. This is true.

            NSC of oats is outrageous BTW, doesn't matter if it's the lowest of whatever. Barley I think is next in line? Horse are NOT meant to ingest NSC of 30% or whatever it is.

            It's something to do with where the food is processed. Sugars go to the small intestine, starches like that of oats, corn, and barley go to the large intestine where they can ferment and cause issue.

            As for my statement on Alfalfa--it can be fed as 1/3 of the diet. But a diet of only alfalfa and oats ain't so great. All that alfalfa crews up the Ca ration.

            As for horses that do "fine" on the diet. Their bodies learn to live. Just as our horses have learned to live in stalls 1/2 the day.

            Horses are NOT meant to eat oats, barley and corn. They are meant to eat GRASS. If further diet is needed due to sports and such the best way to go about it is to get the vitamins/minerals and others from a premium bag/concentrated feed. And feed as little as possible to get the job done.
            How oats could be good is beyond me. They have little calorie content and must be feed in bulk to get the job done (in most cases). That being said I put 1 cup of either oats or sweet feed in my horse's feed. But 1 cup is worth nothing except for texture and taste purposes. It's not even a lb.

            Think what you will or read the published literature and study, NOT the internet which is full of testimonials.
            http://kaboomeventing.com/
            http://kaboomeventing.blogspot.com/
            Horses are amazing athletes and make no mistake -- they are the stars of the show!

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              Original Poster

              #26
              Thanks all for the responses.

              Win is certainly in a better place than he has been, in a long time, but I am not entirely content and not sure the current feeding program is a great idea longterm.

              EqT your point about chronic pain is a good one, it has been bouncing around in my head the last week or so. Also the fact that his digestive system is not up to par.... I've been considering treating him for ulcers but wonder if a feed change is a better option first.

              I'm stabbing in the dark. I know that while he looks good, his system is still in serious recovery mode. It is easy to think he is "just fine" given his current state but I feel like as far as his feed goes, there is room to simplify and optimize.

              The BS rep I talked to wanted me to switch him to 6lbs of Demand (16% protein) and 1lb Winning Touch Sunshine (30% protein) a day.... but for some reason it didn't sit right with me so I've kept him on the mix of Senior, Sunshine and Omegatin he's been on.... Tried the LS for awhile but he fared far better on the Senior than the LS. *sigh*.
              We couldn't all be cowboys, so some of us are clowns.

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                #27
                Originally posted by FlashGordon View Post
                Also the fact that his digestive system is not up to par.... I've been considering treating him for ulcers but wonder if a feed change is a better option first.

                I'm stabbing in the dark. I know that while he looks good, his system is still in serious recovery mode. It is easy to think he is "just fine" given his current state but I feel like as far as his feed goes, there is room to simplify and optimize.
                Pellets mixes are best for ulcer tummies. Oats and anything whole is more upsetting to the digestive tract.
                http://kaboomeventing.com/
                http://kaboomeventing.blogspot.com/
                Horses are amazing athletes and make no mistake -- they are the stars of the show!

                Comment


                  #28
                  Androcles, around here those are called Race Horse Oats.

                  Just enough Veggie oil to tamp down the dust.

                  I prefer triple cleaned plain.

                  Purpl... Dr. Harmon is where I get my info from. <shrugs> That's research, IMO.
                  InnisFailte Pinto Sporthorses & Coloured Cobs
                  ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

                  Bits are like cats, what's one more? (Petstorejunkie)

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                    #29
                    We feed soaked whole oats and beet pulp supplemented with Fat Cat/Weight Builder, MSM and Accel Multivitamin.

                    Hay is free choice for the big girl and rationed for the minis. (the minis also do not get the Fat Cat)

                    This has been working just superbly. I've been quite pleased with all of the horse's condition and energy level on this regime.
                    http://www.foxhuntingfriesian.blogspot.com
                    http://www.isherwoodstudios.blogspot.com

                    Comment


                      #30
                      Don't know if it's worth anything, but the TB I was trying to bring back last spring (Jersey!) was getting oats as part of his diet once he began to stabilize. Along with a local coop's high fat/low carb feed and some TC 30%. He progressed really well on that diet. We (well, his more expert caretaker and his vet anyway!) think he had real issues being able to utilize his feed. His whole system was entirely out of whack. He's had a few changes throughout the last year and is now mostly getting alfalfa pellets, with some rice bran and a ration balancer from the coop.. less than 1/2 of what he used to eat! It took some time and effort to get alfalfa incorporated into his diet.. I tried originally when he was crashing and it caused edema (sheath, stocking up). He's now doing fantastic and I'm planning to have him come home in June!

                      My other two are on a mainly alfalfa and oats diet. The 17 yr old TB is ulcer-y (already treated with Ulcergard with marked improvement) and gets about 2 lbs of oats, 3 lbs of alfalfa cubes and 1 lb of TC Senior a day. It's the only setup I can get him to finish completely and that doesn't get him cribbing afterward. Plus he's trim and fit, instead of his tendency to be fatty.

                      My other is a 6ish year old paint, 15.1/15.2h, sort of an Arab-y build. I only started with him about four weeks ago and have him on 1.5 lbs oats, 2 lbs alfalfa cubes and 1 lb TC Senior a day. With the new food and some work, he's lost his big haygut and yet filled out elsewhere (shoulders, topline). Looking less like the auction-reject he was and more like a real horse!

                      I'm glad to hear Win's doing so well that his biggest concern is fine tuning the diet That's big improvement!

                      Comment


                        #31
                        FG- I have been on the same opinion.... so my gang is getting 1 lbs TC 30, 4c oats, 2c boss + pasture and hay. In the winter I add beep and rice bran and more hay and sometimes some alf cubes in a hot mash.. Everyone is shiney and the two shorties are at perfect weights for them. Mir is a little thinner than I'd like, but we are working on that. i don't miss soaking beep in the summer.
                        If i'm posting on Coth, it's either raining so I can't ride or it's night time and I can't sleep.

                        Comment


                          #32
                          I made a change to ration balancer and whole oats. Most of the tb's feed program looks like this:
                          am- 2lb of oats/1lb rice bran
                          pm- 2lb of TC 30, 2lb of oats/2lbs of beet pulp

                          Unlimited timothy/orchard grass hay with alfalfa hay in the am. About 10lbs of alfalfa hay per horse a day. I add more beet pulp if needed but they look amazing and no change in energy. I noticed they started adding more muscle on this diet than before and I am feeding less. Whole oats are cheap at $8 a bag and the ration balancer is expensive but feed at such a small amount it works out to be less in the long run than my previous feed program (legends pelleted peformance, beet pulp and rice bran).
                          http://www.benchmarksporthorses.com/

                          Comment

                            Original Poster

                            #33
                            Now the question is, what RB do you all prefer?

                            I can have the Progressive shipped in, but can get Nutrena (do they make an RB?), Blue Seal (don't think they have an RB aside from Sunshine), Purina and Triple Crown locally.

                            Thanks all for the input... MD I am definitely glad that we are just "fine tuning" things now like feed, and trimming. Amazing how he has recovered. How is your guy doing?!?
                            We couldn't all be cowboys, so some of us are clowns.

                            Comment


                              #34
                              As I had said we went from oats to higher fat and lower NSC and my horse is doing much better...We use rice bran as our fat source, 2 lbs per day and I am using an organic RB...It is by KAm animal called finally feed and the change has been something short of amazing. The feet are growing in better and his tail is full and long, never was before, and he has an awesome coat too. Pennefields has good products also. either the all phase or the fibregized are good to balance out the diets.....The organic is not heat treated so the nutrients are what they are.....I like it and so does my horse!
                              Mai Tai aka Tyler RIP March 1994-December 2011
                              Grief is the price we pay for love- Gretchen Jackson
                              "And here she comes. Is it a bird? Is it a plane? No, it's ZENYATTA!"

                              Comment


                                #35
                                Actually Jersey is doing great! He is still getting time off and living with his caretaker.. will have been a year in June and she's done miracles with him. I'll be moving him, with my two others, to a new, quiet private farm on June 1 and he'll be going back under saddle at that point (!!!!!). I'm super excited.

                                I've known folks to have success with both TDI 10 (non-soy, wheat based ration balancer we can get at the local coop) and TC 30. I am considering switching the boys from TC Senior to 30. I used Buckeye Grow'n Win with Jersey last year, for a few months, and was happy with that too. It was hard to evaluate the benefits of a feed when the horse was trying to.. decline.. but it was high quality and really helped keep him from decling further when he really needed it. TC is much easier for me to get, and I've had success with that, so I tend to use their products.

                                I'm so happy for you and Win to be a great spot to be going into spring and summer. You both deserve some really fun opportunities this year, so I hope you get into a position to do some! Win really seems to have hit the jackpot. And you too - you seem quite taken with him, and no one could really ask for more.

                                Comment


                                  #36
                                  I feed rolled oats but most of our horses don't need it. Sometimes I sprinkle a little on their meal for taste/palatability.

                                  Alfalfa pellets and beet pulp form the basis of our horses' diet. Well, not really -- local grass HAY forms the basis of their diet! They get a pan of "grain" at night but it is quite low in actual grains.

                                  We mix equal quantities of alfalfa pellets and beet pulp pellets and soak in water. We serve up about 2-3 cups (soaked volume) and add Nutraflax and a local vit/min supplement. That's it for most of the horses (the easy keepers). We add rice bran, rolled oats and/or canola oil for horses that have additional needs (weight gain, lactation, growth).
                                  Shall I tell you what I find beautiful about you? You are at your very best when things are worst.
                                  Starman

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                                    #37
                                    RIP Kelly 1977-2007 "Wither thou goest, so shall I"

                                    "To tilt when you should withdraw is Knightly too."

                                    Comment

                                      Original Poster

                                      #38
                                      Thanks guys for all of the great input! Win has been on a mix of BS products since January, and while he looks pretty good right now, I have this feeling that it is not the best diet for him! So now that he is relatively stable I think it is time to tweak things.... the info in this thread is very helpful.

                                      MD, I am so glad Jersey has improved, and it is pretty exciting that he may start some under saddle work this summer! You will have to keep me updated, with pics, of course!

                                      Yes the old gray horse, who I brought home because I had to, not necessarily because I wanted to... has become a good buddy. He is a goofy horse but I love him for it. Nothing makes me happier than watching him race his buddies, buck, roll, and act like a complete idiot in his turnout.

                                      (Though hopefully he remembers what to do when I put a saddle on his back! )
                                      We couldn't all be cowboys, so some of us are clowns.

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