• Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.

Announcement

Collapse

Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.

Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 1/26/16)
See more
See less

Nerve Block and Abcess-update...nasty abcess

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Nerve Block and Abcess-update...nasty abcess

    Ok, so my horse has a new mistery lameness, five days standing. Maybe has gotten a little worse, but I only trotted him out 3 of the 5 days so I can't really decide. Ran him up to the vet today, who did a nerve block above heels. No results, still lame. Nerve block at fetlock, no results, still lame. We are giving him a week of bute and sweating, then going from there if no progress with xrays. But, vet mentioned that it is possible to have an abcess that the block didn't penetrate. Is anyone familiar with this? Or is he trying to make me feel better? We can't find anything on exam thats tender/heat/swelling, so I am hoping for a deep bruise or abcess. Can a block "bypass" an abcess? Anyone have experience with this? Any help or suggestions is greatly appreciated.
    Last edited by Cheval Gris; Mar. 2, 2009, 01:16 PM.
    Honey Badger don't give a s*#^!

    "..a three-day event is not a test of speed and endurance, it is a test of character" ~JW

  • #2
    I'm not sure about that, but I once had a vet not use enough block to make the horse come sound, so he continued blocking up the leg, bypassing the problem in the foot...$400 later I had to go to another vet who used enough block and waited a longer period of time. He got a proper diagnosis.
    JB-Infinity Farm
    www.infinitehorses.com

    Comment


    • #3
      Painted Hill in gray

      Ran him up to the vet today, who did a nerve block above heels. No results, still lame. Nerve block at fetlock, no results, still lame.


      If you ever have any doubts, check the block. All it takes is a ballpoint with the pen retracted. Poke the "blocked" area. No response? It's blocked. Response? It ain't.

      We are giving him a week of bute and sweating, then going from there if no progress with xrays. But, vet mentioned that it is possible to have an abcess that the block didn't penetrate.

      Whoa! Say what?

      Is anyone familiar with this? Or is he trying to make me feel better?


      I dunno if he's trying to make you feel better or not - but from here, it sounds like he's doing the CYA Watusi.

      We can't find anything on exam thats tender/heat/swelling, so I am hoping for a deep bruise or abcess. Can a block "bypass" an abcess?

      In most cases, not if the block is correctly done.

      Anyone have experience with this? Any help or suggestions is greatly appreciated.


      After he blocked the digital nerves, did the vet do a ring block below the fetlock before he blocked the palmar nerves?
      Tom Stovall, CJF
      No me preguntes cualquier preguntas, yo te diré no mentiras.

      Comment


      • #4
        Why not x-rays while already there?
        That is first here, before blocks, as it is less invasive.

        Comment

        • Original Poster

          #5
          Ok, so all I know as this is new to me, is that they blocked the heal first. When they did hoof testers before block, he had a somewhat tender spot in one area, but vet didn't feel as though the horse gave enough of a reaction to indicate an abcess, but there definately was a reaction. When that block did nothing (they took a key and poked around coronary band/heels and he definately felt it) they reblocked the area, that didn't change, then moved up around the fetlock. Waited 15 min or so, trotted on lunge, and no change. The vet who did the block is just out of school and senior vet did not watch the block, so it is possible it was done incorrectly. However, he said we can continue up the leg with blocks, or treat with bute for 5 days and watch the progression. So, I said, lets try bute for a couple of days. But, he did say if it does not improve he would be checking for a high suspensory...this has my head spinning, as he is not on stall rest, and vet could not find any tenderness in this area. We just started trying to build more heal on this guy, but i am sketchy to put wedges on a horse without xrays to evaluate horses angles at this point. (wedges were recommended today at next shoeing.)
          Saturday he was out schooling xc sound for 3 hours, monday he was lame at trot.
          Honey Badger don't give a s*#^!

          "..a three-day event is not a test of speed and endurance, it is a test of character" ~JW

          Comment


          • #6
            Possibly not done incorrectly but still didn't hit the appropriate nerve. I know from experience with my own jaw.

            It would have helped if the Sr. had come out. Sometimes green practitioners get to looking for zebras, when they hear hooves in the night, when it's just a little old stray pony.

            A wedgie on the wedges! Sounds too much like you're getting a shotgun approach.
            Some riders change their horse, they change their saddle, they change their teacher; they never change themselves.

            Remember the horse does all the work, we just sit there and look pretty.

            Comment

            • Original Poster

              #7
              I think I have provided most of the info here. Horse has never been lame/injured. sort of why I prefered taking a conservative approach to start with,(on top of the fact there is no acute incident here unless he did something in the pasture) not wanting to spend 500$ on xray/us only to find in three days an abcess come out. Senior vet did all examining and possible diagnosing. He said possible high suspensory, possible soft tissue bruise, possibly because he has low heals, etc etc. I did leave one thing out. Had him chiro'd for the first time last week, five days before schooling. Could he have a lameness from this? She spent more time on hips and head. I just wonder if its not something really high. Or again, something brewing in the foot. I didn't want to become a member of the mystery lameness club.
              Honey Badger don't give a s*#^!

              "..a three-day event is not a test of speed and endurance, it is a test of character" ~JW

              Comment

              • Original Poster

                #8
                Nerve block and abcess

                Posted over in horse care too, but figured I would share with my fellow eventers for more input.


                Saturday, schooled xc a couple hours, horse sound, no problems. went home sound, had sunday off...went to ride monday, lame. Now five days standing. Maybe has gotten a little worse, but I only trotted him out 3 of the 5 days so I can't really decide. Ran him up to the vet today, who did a nerve block above heels. No results, still lame. Nerve block at fetlock, no results, still lame. We are giving him a week of bute and sweating, then going from there if no progress with xrays. But, vet mentioned that it is possible to have an abcess that the block didn't penetrate. Is anyone familiar with this? Or is he trying to make me feel better? We can't find anything on exam thats tender/heat/swelling, so I am hoping for a deep bruise or abcess. Can a block "bypass" an abcess? Anyone have experience with this?
                I think I have provided most of the info here. Horse has never been lame/injured. sort of why I prefered taking a conservative approach to start with,(on top of the fact there is no acute incident here unless he did something in the pasture) not wanting to spend 500$ on xray/us only to find in three days an abcess come out. Vet said possible high suspensory, possible soft tissue bruise, possibly because he has low heals, etc etc. I did leave one thing out. Had him chiro'd for the first time last week, five days before schooling. Could he have a lameness from this? She spent more time on hips and head. I just wonder if its not something really high. Or again, something brewing in the foot. I didn't want to become a member of the mystery lameness club.
                Any help or suggestions is greatly appreciated.
                Honey Badger don't give a s*#^!

                "..a three-day event is not a test of speed and endurance, it is a test of character" ~JW

                Comment


                • #9
                  I think I am experiencing the exact same thing right now.

                  Yearling - had an abscess that came out the sole and we kept him wrapped/booted for about a month. The wrap came off and I didn't realize that there was still a slight opening in the sole. 48hr later - he's three legged lame. Vet comes out and blocks the foot and he's still lame. He presents EXACTLY like he has heel pain. He reacts to palpation on the heel. However, vet is worried that he's unsound after a foot block. I 100% think that he's brewing another abscess out the heel and the block was incomplete. My trainer agrees.

                  Yearling doesn't flex lame on any joint, doesn't palpate sore (except for the heel) and totally presents an ouchy foot.

                  Bute doesn't touch it - so I am soaking and applying ichthamol.

                  Does that help?

                  Comment

                  • Original Poster

                    #10
                    Very inexperienced here with abcesses, been lucky over last 10 years. Would bute help an abcess? He passed all flexion tests. I guess now I am just worried it could be a high suspensory. But again, no tenderness in that area. I am highly suspicious of deep abcess or bruise, but again, not experience much with these. Like I said, he did have one point that was pretty tender with testers before block, but vet didn't think it was enough. Go figure, his first recognized is in three weeks.
                    Honey Badger don't give a s*#^!

                    "..a three-day event is not a test of speed and endurance, it is a test of character" ~JW

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Painted Hill View Post
                      Saturday he was out schooling xc sound for 3 hours, monday he was lame at trot.
                      Is he fit enough for this? 3 hours is a lot and fatigue definitely increases risk of soft tissue injuries. No I wouldn't be blaming the chiro who worked on him if a week later he was sound schooling xcountry for 3 hours.

                      My 2cents but I'd be guessing soft tissue if 2 days after a hard school my horse came up lame.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Fingers crossed for you. My horse was lame for 13 days (and counting...though tonight he looked REALLY good!) with a big severe bad bruise that took awhile to realize. He was obviously lame but not three legged and you could sorta find a spot with hoof-testers initially, but later you could definitely feel the spot!

                        Good luck for your pony!! Hope he feels better soon.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Sounds more like a bruise or something than an abcess, per se. I agree with x-rays before blocking. However, usually, an abcess flairs up very quickly (overnight) and makes your horse look like he is going to die - three legged lame.

                          And bute is the last thing you want to do with an abcess - according to my vets. Since it decreased the inflammation, it hinders the abcess from breaking through, and can hide the fact that the abcess may be deeper than thought. (I learned this from experience and missed a summer of showing because of it...)

                          A bruise, on the other hand, may not be as painful as an abcess...

                          Good luck!
                          co-author of 101 Jumping Exercises & The Rider's Fitness Program; Soon to come: Dead Ringer - a tale of equine mystery and intrique! Former Moderator!

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Painted Hill: we need to start the clique of "My horse is lame and I don't know why" See my post about the 3 week plus possible abscess ordeal!
                            RIP Mydan Mydandy+
                            RIP Barichello

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Painted Hill View Post
                              Would bute help an abcess?
                              No, in fact, its contra-indicated.

                              He passed all flexion tests. I guess now I am just worried it could be a high suspensory. But again, no tenderness in that area. I am highly suspicious of deep abcess or bruise, but again, not experience much with these. Like I said, he did have one point that was pretty tender with testers before block, but vet didn't think it was enough. Go figure, his first recognized is in three weeks.
                              You might want to consider a second opinion from an equine lameness specialist veterinarian.

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                This JUST happened to us. A client's horse came up lame, wasn't really reactive to hoof testers. We take him to the vet. He doesn't block to anything. Ended up doing a front end bonescan...to find the abscess!!! A very expensive way to locate them, but we rather it be that then something horrible, as we were fearing. He did actually block to his foot a couple of days later.
                                Amanda

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  yellowbritches..that sounds like my mare! She was 24 or 25 at the time, and had a long history of founder and recurring issues due to that. She became lame and I thought...oh, abscess but then... it seemed to take FOREVER and got to the point where she was three-legged lame and almost groaning. She was down more than up.... (it sounds awful and it was but this was only one morning) so I called the vet in tears thinking....this is it, time to say good bye.... and then after I walked out to spend some time with her just in case.... and she was up and grazing... and I noticed this huge wad of gnats around her foot.... Get out there and it finally bust through the coronary band and was NASTY!!!! But she felt instantly better Called back and cancelled YAY!!!!

                                  Fleckers is still pretty sore today, but he had his bruise dug out by my vet. She said about 7-10 days before he gets enough granulation tissue to reshoe and ride. We're on day 4 and... he is getting better but still sore. But atleast now I know what it is!! So much better

                                  Hope your pony is better!

                                  Comment

                                  • Original Poster

                                    #18
                                    Yes, horse is fit enough-been gearing up for first recognized for a year and half. Likely the fittest BN there, if we make it . Schooling with several horses takes a couple hours to complete, you aren't actually working 3 hours! Bruise sounds like my best hope. High suspensory my worst. Not knowing really sucks. I would feel really dumb to do a bunch of xrays and ultrasound a couple days in just to find a bruise. I hope its not irresponisble giving a few more days to see what occurs. He is only off a little at the trot, not 3 legged. Errr.
                                    Honey Badger don't give a s*#^!

                                    "..a three-day event is not a test of speed and endurance, it is a test of character" ~JW

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      I had a client spen a few hundred for a vet to block her horse. The vet could not even decie what leg the mare was head bobbing lame on.

                                      I spent a total of 15 minutes with the mare. Had her on hard ground and flexed an trotted her. Became clear as a bell to owner and the 5 people waching she was sore in the knee.

                                      I do not understand spending a fortune for blocks before not even trying to pinpoint the problem area by flexing and trotting off. But I guess vets need to make a good living.

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        Originally posted by 2enduraceriders View Post
                                        I spent a total of 15 minutes with the mare. Had her on hard ground and flexed an trotted her. Became clear as a bell to owner and the 5 people waching she was sore in the knee.
                                        It is interesting that you performed a diagnostic test(s} on this horse and then based on that, issued an evaluation. Are you perhaps, a veterinarian? Are you a trained, accredited diagnostician?

                                        Just wonderin' is all.............

                                        Comment

                                        Working...
                                        X