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Controlled substances, the DEA, and your vet

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  • Controlled substances, the DEA, and your vet

    Did you know that your vet is prohibited from carrying controlled substances in their vehicle? Can you imagine your vet not being able to treat your horse's pain effectively when you call for an emergency? There is a bill pending in congress that will correct this. I encourage you to read about the bill and send a letter to your representative regarding this! The page link below is from the American Veternary Medical Asso. http://capwiz.com/avma/issues/alert/?alertid=62592206


    thanks !!

  • #2
    Thanks for the link! I have a very difficult time with "legalese" but does the info you provided indicate that it is actually illegal at the moment for vets to carry these drugs, and that the bill is to amend that? If so, is that a recent change, or have vets been operating technically "in violation" all this time?
    Click here before you buy.

    Comment


    • #3
      This came across my Facebook page a few days ago, and frankly I find it a little confusing.

      The Controlled Substances Act has been around for a long time. Here it is -
      http://www.fda.gov/regulatoryinforma.../ucm148726.htm

      This is the proposed amendment -

      http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c113:H.R.1528:

      Deltawave, it is easy to work back from the Bill to Section 822(e) of the existing statute to see what they are trying to change.

      Though I would like to assume the AVMA and the Bill's sponsors know what they are talking about, it is not entirely clear to me that Section 822 makes it illegal for vets to transport controlled substances as part of their practice.

      Comment


      • #4
        I wrote a letter regarding this, in which I emphasized that my vet's truck IS his office. Some the interpretation of the enforcement of the current law seems to revolve around the concept of 'office' as a building, rather than 'the place where you customarily do business'.

        *star*
        "Avoid loud and aggressive persons, they are vexations to the spirit."
        - Desiderata, (c) Max Ehrman, 1926

        Comment


        • #5
          Considering that pentobarbital sodium and phenytoin sodium are controlled substances, I can't imagine a reality in which veterinarians are unable to transport controlled substances in their vehicles. In many cases it's truly impossible to load up a large animal in need of euthanasia and haul it off to the vet. I haven't read the legalese yet, so off I go...
          "Absent a correct diagnosis, medicine is poison, surgery is trauma and alternative therapy is witchcraft" A. Kent Allen
          http://www.etsy.com/shop/tailsofglory

          Comment


          • #6
            Evidently common sense is now a super power.
            The thing about smart people, is they look like crazy people, to dumb people.

            Comment


            • #7
              Deleted. I was wrong!
              Last edited by Jeito; May. 1, 2013, 01:58 PM. Reason: 'cuz it's no fun being beaten up on COTH

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Discobold View Post
                Fwiw, I think the people sponsoring the Bill may be creating drama by reading the current law too narrowly. JMHO.
                Umm, the all the drama here is coming from the DEA, who have been pushing the issue with DVMs.
                "It's like a Russian nesting doll of train wrecks."--CaitlinandTheBay

                ...just settin' on the Group W bench.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Ghazzu View Post
                  Umm, the all the drama here is coming from the DEA, who have been pushing the issue with DVMs.
                  Sorry, I didn't know that. And I also didn't mean to imply that I think the Bill is a bad thing. If the DEA is pushing this, then - yes! - by all means amend the statute All I meant to say is that I think the existing law is open to interpretation. Friendly discussion enriches all of us

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    The law has always been that controlled substances were not to be transported and used at sites that were away from the office/clinic location. Many DVMs were not aware that they were in violation - and the DEA had previously said that it DVMs using drugs in ambulatory/housecalls was "low priority for enforcement."

                    Recently, however, the DEA has been sending letters to practitioners who have a home address listed on their DEA Registration "reminding" them that transporting controlled substances is illegal. If they begin to enforce this existing law than ambulatory and housecall practitioners will only be able to transport a prescribed dose of a controlled substance for a specific patient that they have already examined. So if they know that they need to sedate a patient at your farm for castration, they may bring ONE dose of what they need - can't bring more, can't bring the bottle in case it goes out of the vein and another dose is needed, ect. While they are there, if something comes up in another patient (can we castrate this one too?), they would have to go back to the clinic for another dose for that specific patient.

                    This will change veterinary medicine as we know it - it will not be feasable (multiple trip charges or increasing prices to cover the gas for the multiple trips?) to do ambulatory/housecall medicine, so patients will have to be hauled in to clinics. That doesn't always work for large animals....

                    PLEASE follow the link above from the AVMA and take a minute to write your representatives.....

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      :-)
                      Last edited by animaldoc; May. 1, 2013, 02:43 PM. Reason: Posted twice - oops!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by deltawave View Post
                        Thanks for the link! I have a very difficult time with "legalese" but does the info you provided indicate that it is actually illegal at the moment for vets to carry these drugs, and that the bill is to amend that? If so, is that a recent change, or have vets been operating technically "in violation" all this time?
                        They have been operating in violation all of this time. But the DEA recently informed the AVMA and the AAEP that they WILL enforce it.

                        What I wonder is how this effects other medical practitioners who operate in the field. How about civilian flight surgeons, and those who operate ambulatory motorized clinics?
                        Some riders change their horse, they change their saddle, they change their teacher; they never change themselves.

                        Remember the horse does all the work, we just sit there and look pretty.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Discobold View Post
                          Fwiw, I think the people sponsoring the Bill may be creating drama by reading the current law too narrowly. JMHO.
                          Tell that to the DEA!!!
                          Some riders change their horse, they change their saddle, they change their teacher; they never change themselves.

                          Remember the horse does all the work, we just sit there and look pretty.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by merrygoround View Post
                            Tell that to the DEA!!!
                            I already said "I'm sorry, I didn't know." I should have read the original link more carefully. Now I understand it's not the sponsors of the bill that are reading the law that way, but rather the DEA. Ghazzu already corrected me. I got it the first time. My apology was sincere.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Discobold View Post
                              I already said "I'm sorry, I didn't know." I should have read the original link more carefully. Now I understand it's not the sponsors of the bill that are reading the law that way, but rather the DEA. Ghazzu already corrected me. I got it the first time. My apology was sincere.

                              [sarcasm] You expect people to read an entire thread? On COTH? I don't think Hell has frozen over quite yet [/sarcasm]
                              Proud member of the Snort and Blow Clique

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Originally posted by lorilu View Post
                                Did you know that your vet is prohibited from carrying controlled substances in their vehicle? Can you imagine your vet not being able to treat your horse's pain effectively when you call for an emergency? There is a bill pending in congress that will correct this. I encourage you to read about the bill and send a letter to your representative regarding this! The page link below is from the American Veternary Medical Asso. http://capwiz.com/avma/issues/alert/?alertid=62592206
                                For those people like me who always PLAN on sending letters for items like this but then struggle with what to write or figuring out where it goes or even finding a stamp...the above link makes it SUPER EASY. You input your zip code, your representative comes up and you complete your info. You can add more or change the note or whatever you want, and send via email or print to send via snail mail. (I guess you still have to find your own stamp.)

                                Just a heads up for everyone. There is NO EXCUSE to not send your representative a note here. Click on the link above and get it done.

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Now that some vets have chimed in and reinforced that this is a real concern, I am bumping this thread AND planning to share on FB.
                                  Click here before you buy.

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    Simkie-
                                    It was easy. Done. Thanks.

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      Originally posted by deltawave View Post
                                      Now that some vets have chimed in and reinforced that this is a real concern, I am bumping this thread AND planning to share on FB.
                                      I'm sharing on Facebook too. And I just sent my representative a letter, "tweaking" the language in the form letter a bit (though it probably makes not one iota of difference - the tweaking, that is).

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        You're right, it was easy even for technophobic me. Done!

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