• Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.

Announcement

Collapse

Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.

Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 1/26/16)
See more
See less

Barefoot experts -- Is there ever a horse who shouldn't go barefoot?

Collapse
This topic is closed.
X
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #21
    I don't see any problem with using a trimmer and a farrier. As long as there are no over-inflated egos involved. I have two horses, one gets trimmed by the barefoot specialist (a former New Bolton farrier who no longer shoes) and one shod by a farrier. If my barefoot horse needed shoes, the farrier would put them on, and if I decided to take the shoes off the shod horse I would put him in the hands of the trimmer. It would be more convenient to only use one person, of course, but for various reasons I choose not to.

    Comment


    • #22
      I do adore my barefoot critters, including the "therapeutically" barefoot previously foundered pony. However, as much as one can adore the barefoot ideal, some horses just can't cut it. It sounds like your fellow might be one of those... but you don't honestly know till you try. There are ways to make the transition to bare, so chat further with your trimmer and farrier.

      I don't have a problem with a little tender when getting used to barefoot. I go by the principal that I can't run on gravel at the beginning of summer, but by fall my feet are tough as nails. Same principal in my brain Good luck!
      www.muskokalakesconnemaras.com
      Wonderful ponies for family or show!

      Comment

      • Original Poster

        #23
        Originally posted by kcmel View Post
        I don't see any problem with using a trimmer and a farrier. As long as there are no over-inflated egos involved. I have two horses, one gets trimmed by the barefoot specialist (a former New Bolton farrier who no longer shoes) and one shod by a farrier. If my barefoot horse needed shoes, the farrier would put them on, and if I decided to take the shoes off the shod horse I would put him in the hands of the trimmer. It would be more convenient to only use one person, of course, but for various reasons I choose not to.
        Thank you. And along those same lines, why would I not use a barefoot trimmer who specializes in doing exactly what I'm considering trying ... versus a performance-horse shoer who spends 95% of his time dealing with shoes and maybe 5% with barefoot horses (this horse's present farrier). The other farrier I use (for my barefoot horses) is probably 50/50 shoes and barefoot. He's great -- but I've never believed in putting all my eggs in one basket and have always split my business between farriers, choosing which person is best suited for which horse (e.g., farrier with really bad back does not trim my miniature horses!). Everyone has always been fine with that -- and how nice to have more than one person to call in an emergency.
        R.I.P. Ollie (2007-2010) You were small in stature but huge in spirit. You will never be forgotten.

        Godspeed, Benjamin (1998-2014). A life well-lived. A horse well-loved.

        Comment


        • #24
          I have a number of horses without shoes. I have also done shoes/no shoes when that worked. I have also had a string of horses go from all shod to all barefoot suddenly. (It's an odd combination of circumstances but it happened....)

          Any hoo, IF you have the time, the access, and the wiliingness to sweat, then 99% of horses could go without having a shoe nailed to their feet continually.

          By which I mean that IF you have the time to put durasole on them 6x/day and if you have the access to put on/take off hoof boots, and if you can be patient enough through trying out many different boots/foot coverings (casting tape, custom hoof boots,etc) until you find a hoof covering that works and if you want to learn to trim your own horse, then yes you have a situation that you can work it out with most horses most of the time.

          I have horses that require no maintenance on their bare feet aside from regular trimming. (Love that.) BUT I also have horses that require chemical (formalin based) hoof treatment, boots, and management of their work load. And this is a pain in the butt. Overall, it is much, much cheaper than shoes. But it requires sweat, grunting, occasional cursing, and a potentially long break in period when you have to get the details all figured out.

          I had one horse that the owner refused to pull the shoes on. Retired, comes and goes from field to stall as his main employment. BUT one year he pulled his shoes and pulled his shoes and pulled his shoes until we just couldn't keep nailing them back on anymore. So he got himself a pair of Cavalor boots. If it was too, too muddy, he stayed inside. He wore the boots every day to start. Then after a while he could go out in the mud barefoot, and the boots only went on if the fields were okay. Then eventually he was totally barefoot and good to go.

          He's an older OTTB and I am really quite amazed at how his feet have changed. They got much bigger and the wall thickened a lot. The soles got a little bit thicker, but really not much improvement there. But owner had the option to be flexible with turn him out/leave him in/do whatever works today. And that is a big part of it. You have to be patient and maybe leave the horse in a stall for a few days. Or not ride it. Or not jump it. Or try other hoof boots when they rub. Or try and shorten the horse's toe yourself when they outgrow the glove boots in two weeks. Etc.
          "Friend" me !

          http://www.facebook.com/isabeau.solace

          Comment


          • #25
            now he wears a beveled-toe, wide steel shoe with wedged pads.
            maybe you should take it real slow- see if you can move him to a regular shoe with no wedge and no pad first, and if he's fine there, then try the move to barefoot?
            If he's been wearing pads and wedges for years, his feet are going to need a lot of time to toughen up, and his legs will have to re-adjust to going without the wedges.

            Comment


            • #26
              I pulled the shoes on my 21 year old, semi-retired thoroughbred last fall. He was coming out of wedge pads that he had been in for over a year. His hooves chipped up quite a bit from where his old nail holes were so they looked rough the first cycle but have continue to improve and he seems quite comfortable. I'm trail riding him a little bit in cavallo sport boots and they are working great. I definitely think it's worth a try.
              http://pony3express.blogspot.com

              Comment


              • #27
                I'm a bit confused about what different people are referring to as "sore" or a little "ouchy". In my experience a horse should never be actually lame or consistently sore on all surfaces from pulling shoes. If it is a case of a horse being tender on gravel or rocky ground or something specific like that I wouldn't call that unable to go without shoes. That may be part of the transition period for many horses while a new hoof grows in with concavity to lift the sole up off the rocks. Remember that it takes 6 months to a year for a new hoof to grow in. Boots are very helpful during this time. The critical element is a very accurately balanced trim done regularly.
                "The captive bolt is not a proper tool for slaughter of equids they regain consciousness 30 seconds after being struck fully aware they are being vivisected." Dr Friedlander DVM & frmr Chief USDA Insp

                Comment


                • #28
                  Im talking about gravel etc. none have been sore on good footing or grass.
                  www.muskokalakesconnemaras.com
                  Wonderful ponies for family or show!

                  Comment


                  • #29
                    Originally posted by ptownevt View Post
                    I'm a bit confused about what different people are referring to as "sore" or a little "ouchy". In my experience a horse should never be actually lame or consistently sore on all surfaces from pulling shoes. If it is a case of a horse being tender on gravel or rocky ground or something specific like that I wouldn't call that unable to go without shoes.
                    Sound is as sound does. Gimping across rocks/gravel is not a definition of sound. If wearing shoes allows the horse to move freely and without pain on rocks/gravel, then regardless of what you call it, it tells you he needs shoes and/or some alternate form of hoof protection. And regardless if that protection is removed once every six weeks or so, or is removed daily, that horse is not barefoot and anyone who says he is, is fooling themselves into some self-serving/bastardization of the concept of 'being barefoot'.
                    That may be part of the transition period for many horses while a new hoof grows in with concavity to lift the sole up off the rocks.
                    Any [alleged] transition period that lasts more than a few days is telling the human connection that they screwed the pooch and that they damn well need to do something different.
                    Folks, you need to get it through your non-horseman/woman head's that its not about what you want, rather it is about what the horse needs....
                    Remember that it takes 6 months to a year for a new hoof to grow in.
                    So what? Sound is as sound does. Nothing more, nothing less.
                    Boots are very helpful during this time.
                    If he needs boots, he isn't barefoot. If he isn't barefoot then why muck about with boots when shoes are a better option? Remember, its about the horse, not you.
                    The critical element is a very accurately balanced trim done regularly.
                    A proper/correct trim notwithstanding, the critical element is using one's brain and giving the horse what it needs.

                    To paraphrase a phrase from the BUAtistas, "Boots are a bandaid........." lol
                    Last edited by Rick Burten; Mar. 12, 2013, 09:37 PM.

                    Comment


                    • #30
                      Rick,
                      You have said a bunch here but, I have a question,
                      If boots are a bandaid to the horse, what are shoes to the horse?

                      IME, if you want a horse to work on gravel/stone, give him the time to live on that gravel/stones. Many horse owners do not or can not provide suitable footing for the horse to live on. Those horses will probably never glide across the gravel, shoes or not.
                      Charlie Piccione
                      Natural Performance Hoof Care

                      Comment


                      • #31
                        Originally posted by Charlie Piccione View Post
                        Rick,
                        You have said a bunch here but, I have a question,
                        If boots are a bandaid to the horse, what are shoes to the horse?

                        IME, if you want a horse to work on gravel/stone, give him the time to live on that gravel/stones. Many horse owners do not or can not provide suitable footing for the horse to live on. Those horses will probably never glide across the gravel, shoes or not.
                        If you've got a cut on your foot a band aid can be a Good Thing. Preventing the cut is a better thing.

                        G.
                        Mangalarga Marchador: Uma Raça, Uma Paixão

                        Comment


                        • #32
                          Originally posted by Guilherme View Post
                          If you've got a cut on your foot a band aid can be a Good Thing. Preventing the cut is a better thing.

                          G.

                          Comment


                          • #33
                            Originally posted by Guilherme View Post
                            If you've got a cut on your foot a band aid can be a Good Thing. Preventing the cut is a better thing.

                            G.
                            How is a cut prevented in a hoof?
                            Charlie Piccione
                            Natural Performance Hoof Care

                            Comment


                            • #34
                              Originally posted by Charlie Piccione View Post
                              Rick,
                              You have said a bunch here but, I have a question,
                              If boots are a bandaid to the horse, what are shoes to the horse?
                              Hi Charlie, I said I was paraphrasing the BUA....... Shoes for the horse are an orthosis that aids in protection, traction(or lack there of) and gait alteration whether therapeutic or otherwise. Hoof boots are, again paraphrasing the BUAtistas, a necessary evil, especially when the ham fisted butcher who removed the 'traditional shoes" messed things up such that the horse now needs a bandaid, or the horse owner, in his/her ignorance or stuipidity, tries to fit a round peg into a square hole by removing/have removed, the horse's defense against things in the environment that can inflict/cause pain, suffering, damage, to the hooves.
                              IME, if you want a horse to work on gravel/stone, give him the time to live on that gravel/stones.
                              How much time. What if, even after that interval, the horse is still sore/gimpy/lame?
                              Many horse owners do not or can not provide suitable footing for the horse to live on. Those horses will probably never glide across the gravel, shoes or not.
                              Wanna bet? Say, $10,000.00 ? After due consideration, forget that challenge. Its a sucker's bet and would be like me stealing candy from a baby.

                              Comment

                              • Original Poster

                                #35
                                Originally posted by Rick Burten View Post
                                Hi Charlie, I said I was paraphrasing the BUA....... Shoes for the horse are an orthosis that aids in protection, traction(or lack there of) and gait alteration whether therapeutic or otherwise. Hoof boots are, again paraphrasing the BUAtistas, a necessary evil, especially when the ham fisted butcher who removed the 'traditional shoes" messed things up such that the horse now needs a bandaid, or the horse owner, in his/her ignorance or stuipidity, tries to fit a round peg into a square hole by removing/have removed, the horse's defense against things in the environment that can inflict/cause pain, suffering, damage, to the hooves.
                                Having started this thread, I have to ask -- are you really calling me stupid and/or ignorant?
                                R.I.P. Ollie (2007-2010) You were small in stature but huge in spirit. You will never be forgotten.

                                Godspeed, Benjamin (1998-2014). A life well-lived. A horse well-loved.

                                Comment


                                • #36
                                  Rick,

                                  I no longer bet any thing to do with horses. Last horse was when Animal Kingdom ran the derby. I won that one, lost it all the next time he ran. So I am done.
                                  But thanks for the offer, be carefull with that bet.
                                  Charlie Piccione
                                  Natural Performance Hoof Care

                                  Comment


                                  • #37
                                    ljc

                                    Rick would never direct a comment like that to an individual. It is sent out as being specific to a group and the people who follow, blindly.
                                    Charlie Piccione
                                    Natural Performance Hoof Care

                                    Comment


                                    • #38
                                      Originally posted by ljc View Post
                                      Having started this thread, I have to ask -- are you really calling me stupid and/or ignorant?
                                      No ma'am. Not now, or in the past.

                                      Comment


                                      • #39
                                        Thanks for the kind words, Charlie.

                                        To return the favor, I offer you this:

                                        Q: How do you make $5000.00 wagering at the track?

                                        A: Start by wagering $10,000.00.....

                                        And, though I am not a gambler, if I wanted to make money at the track, I'd do it by shoeing the race horses......

                                        Comment


                                        • #40
                                          Originally posted by Charlie Piccione View Post
                                          ljc

                                          Rick would never direct a comment like that to an individual. It is sent out as being specific to a group and the people who follow, blindly.
                                          Honestly, you sound like a blind follower of Rique.

                                          What forums have you been reading??

                                          Comment

                                          Working...
                                          X