• Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.



Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.

Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 1/26/16)
See more
See less

kissing spine vs. hormonal problems

  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • kissing spine vs. hormonal problems

    A little history - 11 year old pony mare always gets a little pissy in the winter. Behavior includes kicking out when you add leg, doesn't want to go forward, will get crooked to try to avoid an upward transition, etc. However, this behavior is not every ride and once you get her moving forward or lunge her first, behavior subsides and all is well. This has been going on for the past 3 winters. This winter the behavior is radically worse - kicks out all the time at your leg, doesn't want to go forward in any gait, bucks like mad, etc. However, the behavior isn't quite as bad if you lunge her first and if you can actually get her moving and ride through the antics, she settles into the gait and goes forward. If you take a walk break or stand, the behavior starts all over again. She's pretty much unrideable because of this. Doesn't do any of this on the lunge line or while being free lunged. She's happy to trot and canter.

    The pony is not lame. She is symmetrical, tracks up well and is happy and eager to jump once you can get through all of the other crap (and she had her hocks done in October). She was on 5 weeks of ranitidine with no change in behavior. Chatted with vet who suggested Robaxin. After 5 days of Robaxin, she was worse so we scheduled an evaluation with the vet and also gave her a depo injection. She was ridden on day 8 of Robaxin which was 1 day after the depo, and she was considerably better. Ridden again day 9 of Robaxin, day 2 after after depo and there was only 1 bronc episode and after standing for 10 minutes went happily back to work. All of this in 20 degree weather. Vet was out today and took back films and found 4 vertebrae in the saddle area with severe impingement - really no space in between the vertebrae. After discussion of the film results and the improved behavior, we have decided to take her off the Robaxin, put her on Regumate and see what happens before taking any action on the kissing spine.

    Has anyone had a situation like this, what did you do and what were the results?

  • #2
    Is she on grass during the summer?

    Vitamin E degrades very quickly in cut hay and also plays a role with neuro stuff.

    I would wonder if her kissing spines bother her more in the winter due to a Vit E deficit?


    • #3
      Originally posted by skyy View Post
      Has anyone had a situation like this, what did you do and what were the results?
      Yes and you really don't want my answer.

      I have heard of people 'successfully' rehabing a horse through kissing spine but it takes very correct attention to detail in training and there is little down time.


      • Original Poster

        I guess what I'm really asking is has anyone had a problem diagnosed as kissing spine related that actually turned out to be hormonal? Obviously, I'm hoping that it is hormonal but since we went looking for a back problem dumb luck had us find what could be a problem (kissing spine) or it could be totally unrelated.


        • #5
          well there are studies on race horses that show many have KS and perform just fine so it certainly could be...but 4 kissing vertebrae just under the saddle seems....like KS.


          • #6
            Originally posted by skyy View Post
            I guess what I'm really asking is has anyone had a problem diagnosed as kissing spine related that actually turned out to be hormonal? Obviously, I'm hoping that it is hormonal but since we went looking for a back problem dumb luck had us find what could be a problem (kissing spine) or it could be totally unrelated.
            Your pony has Kissing Spines - based on the films your vet took. There are a lot of horses that can work through it but it takes a lot of work and there are others that get retired to pasture pet status. It can be extremely painful (ask my mare about it ). I too thought originally it was hormonal and took her in to be checked. Ended up doing a full lameness exam including xrays of the back - once we saw the xrays it all made sense - it was her back that was hurting her pretty badly when ridden (yet she is completely fine tearing around the field). I'd put the pony back on Robaxin to help relieve the muscle tightness which can happen with horses/ponies who have Kissing Spines. There are a lot of horses out there who with proper training are successful but there are others who no matter what are never comfortable. Your pony is clearly trying to tell you something isn't right...
            "When a horse greets you with a nicker & regards you with a large & liquid eye, the question of where you want to be & what you want to do has been answered." CANTER New England


            • #7
              My horse has what I suppose would be called kissing spine, though those words were not uttered at the vet clinic. The vet did say something along the lines of "horses with 'this condition' can suddenly explode" so maybe it is like referring to Macbeth in a theater?

              He also had more pressing issues in his neck vertebra near the shoulder and SI so we treated those, the idea being that if we allowed him to use the ends of the spine better, that we could bring the topline up so the spinous processes weren't as close. Once we were back to riding, the protocol consisted of riding him through (on the bit, with his back up, whatever you want to call it) to build and retain muscle that would allow the topline rounding. I also canter before I trot.

              There are still days that are better than others. Cold and/or damp weather, or our version of cold, seems to make it worse, but I figure that makes sense with arthritis in his neck (and likely elsewhere). He will still act grumpy about going forward at times, but it is not nearly as bad as before the treatment and rehab.

              The horse is never on fresh grass as we live in southern California which is essentially a desert. He does get supplemented with vitamin E.

              None of the above answers your most pressing question, I realize, as this is a gelding.
              The Evil Chem Prof


              • #8
                I have more KS experience than I would like.
                1) It usually only gets worse - not intermittent or improved by lounging
                2) Behaviour when grooming and tacking up tends to be poor
                3) Robaxin doesn't help
                4) nSAIDs don't help much
                5) Hocks tend to be sore
                6) Injecting the KS locations followed by rehab can be successful
                7) I have not seen any seasonal effect

                If you want more treatment details, I'm happy to provide them


                • #9

                  This may be helpful. Depending on where you live...he is located in Georgia


                  • #10
                    In order to rule out a "hormone problem" one must first be clear about what that MEANS. What hormones, exactly? Even geldings have hormones. Is the mare showing signs of estrus? Has she had an exam to check and see if her ovaries are enlarged or sore? (which is an OVARY problem, not a "hormone" problem) Regumate or Depo Provera can suppress estrus behavior but an ovary that's enlarged, inflamed, or full of cysts is not going to shrink and be normal in a few days or even a few weeks.

                    Just like a complex lameness presentation, one can't be accurate without looking at the whole picture. Just blaming everything on "hormones" is like saying "my horse is lame" with no specifics. Quite a difficult thing to figure in either case without a little more precision.
                    Click here before you buy.


                    • #11
                      My gelding has had almost the exact behavior you describe, except for the part where you say you're able to work your mare through to jumping (sometimes), but my gelding pretty much shut down. We're treating a suspensory injury right now, which may or may not have contributed to his behavior in the past - we'll know when he goes back to work later this spring. We tried a whole bunch of things before we found the suspensory problem, with no real success, but never went as far as back xrays so I have no input on the kissing spines. I do know he's a much nicer horse to be around these days, after several months of lockdown, so I have hope that whatever was bothering him has had a chance to heal...