• Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.



Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.

Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 1/26/16)
See more
See less

Any research on what fades a horses coat?

  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #41
    Originally posted by D Taylor View Post

    Then google "color genetics" and "fading black"...cuz your dark bay in really just a black horse with the agouti gene. Unless he is a brown that phenotyically (looks) expresses as a dark bay. That should give you another 1-2 hrs of reading.
    Brown is still black with a modifying allele at the agouti locus.


    • #42
      Wet it. Start small. Be patient.
      "Kindness is free" ~ Eurofoal
      The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances.


      • #43
        Not to hijack, but what about a palomino?? He's shedding and his new coat is this fabulous golden color. But he never stays that color, it fades!


        • #44
          It's all related. But, cream adds another dimension that you can't control, and that's another genetic amount of fading.

          But yes, it's still related to melanin production, so if you want to start asap on the copper zinc, you might see a difference. It's allllmost too late though.
          The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances. - ET


          • Original Poster

            If I can figure out how to get him to eat the dang stuff maybe I will see results!!


            • #46
              Try keeping a lightweight sheet with a neck cover on him any time he is out in the sun. Most show horses in Australia are continually covered to stop them bleaching.


              • Original Poster

                He is out with other horses who will eat the sheet and in the summer it is over 105 degrees here, so sheets are a no no.

                Even in the winter he sweats in his sheet! I did think about getting a neck cover for it. (it's a rhino turnout)


                • #48
                  I was intrigued by this thread, as my bay 24-7 pasture-kept TB always ends up bleached-blonde buckskin by July. I looked into some coat and hoof supplements after reading this thread. I decided to try the Focus Hoof, as it contained zinc and copper, and fit more comfortably in my budget than some other options (would have liked to try Grand Hoof but couldn't cough up the $$$).

                  I will try to remember to come back in six months with an update! Hopefully his feet will stand the summer fly-stomping better too.
                  Leap, and the net will appear


                  • #49
                    Hmmm not sure we are talking about the same type of sheet. Horses here wear their sheets all year round even in our summer.
                    Here is what my horse wears http://www.horseland.com.au/kool-coat-cotton-combo.html. Might be a problem if the other horses attack it though as it is very light weight and would tear.


                    • #50
                      How to get a horse to eat just about anything;
                      1) Feed them peppermint candy as treats.
                      2) Add a small amount of liquid peppermint extract to whatever you want them to eat. The smell is so strong it overpowers anything else.

                      I have fed paprika for years, it keeps my black horses black. It works rapidly no matter when you feed it because winter, spring summer or fall their coats are constantly turning over. But be careful if you show, anything with capsaicin will give a positive drug test. I quit feeding it about 2 weeks before any competition.

                      If minerals and paprika aren't giving you results, I'd suggest it might be your water. If you hose off a lot in warm weather and your water is hard, it can cause them to bleach out. You can fix this by following each hosing up with a dilute vinegar rinse.

                      PS I think your horse is cute.
                      See those flying monkeys? They work for me.


                      • #51
                        The sun fades the coat, but so does sweat. It isn't so much the salt, but the urea. Sweat has very, very low levels, but combined with the sun, it does a number on color

                        The non fading blacks (think Angus cattle, damn them!) apparently don't have any brown color in the hair at all, so when the black fades, only thing underneath to show through is...black. Or so I read somewhere, maybe via this very forum.

                        I have a nice seal brown mare, looks dazzling in the fall & spring, brindle in the summer. It stinks.

                        I used to ride a palomino & would love seeing his buttery coat come out in the spring. It faded, too. The gal that owned his brother used the paprika, but I never noticed that it worked. I don't think she was consistent with it, though.


                        • #52
                          I'll be honest, I didn't read through everything, but I have a black horse that bleached. Isn't it just because of...the sun?

                          He started going out in a sun sheet whenever not blanketed and now he is black 24/7/365.
                          Originally posted by rustbreeches
                          [George Morris] doesn't always drink beer, but when he does, he prefers Dos Equis


                          • #53
                            Yes, sun bleaches things quite well. But how much and how quickly something bleaches has to do with the quality of the pigment. Poor quality pigment, melanin in this case, fades worse than high quality melanin. Quality melanin requires ample copper, hence the nutritional link.
                            The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances. - ET


                            • #54
                              Roughly how much copper would one add? I'm approaching it by feeding Glanzen 3, flax and copper/zinc.

                              Drives me nuts, I have a bay roan and a buckskin who fade, and a bay who does not. I've fed added copper/zinc in the form of hoof supplements to no avail. Maybe I didn't provide enough cu zn? Glanzen 3 seemed to have more than most.


                              • #55
                                Can't say, since there are other factors involved, such as how much is in whatever concentrate you currently feed, whether your soil is high in iron, etc. I can only tell you I give a full serving of Poly Copper and Poly Zinc (since what makes Cu deficient likely makes Zn deficient as well), which is 310mg Cu and 670mg Zn.
                                The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances. - ET


                                • #56
                                  Originally posted by JB View Post
                                  Can't say, since there are other factors involved, such as how much is in whatever concentrate you currently feed, whether your soil is high in iron, etc. I can only tell you I give a full serving of Poly Copper and Poly Zinc (since what makes Cu deficient likely makes Zn deficient as well), which is 310mg Cu and 670mg Zn.
                                  Is there any way to oversupplement these minerals, thereby throwing off the nutritional balance? Any "downside" to adding them to an already balanced ration, IOW?

                                  Just for future reference, since I have a black filly (I don't plan to worry about it while she's young and growing, but it will be good info to set aside for later on...)
                                  "Hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things, and no good thing ever dies."

                                  "It's supposed to be hard...the hard is what makes it great!" (Jimmy Dugan, "A League of Their Own")


                                  • #57
                                    Yes, you can over-supplement them. Too much Fe inhibits Cu and Zn, but too much Cu and Zn inhibits Fe Inhibits other things too, so...

                                    But remember that these are important for more than just coat-fading. You need enough for a strong immune system and many other body piece-parts.
                                    The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances. - ET


                                    • #58
                                      ^^^^ health before coat color but ....

                                      The way got I got into paprika maybe 8-10 years ago was I bought a beautiful black mare in Germany and brought her home to Southern California. She was so dark in Germany, I mean like blue-black. She arrived in SoCal at the end of January. By May she was orange. I had blood pulled to check her copper levels, she was fine. But even rinsing didn't really work. A sun sheet worked but her neck bleached out and it still looked funny.

                                      I started feeding a picnic spoon of the cheapest paprika I could buy daily-problem solved.

                                      Here is what she looks like now mid-summer.
                                      Last edited by nhwr; Feb. 13, 2013, 01:36 AM.
                                      See those flying monkeys? They work for me.


                                      • #59
                                        I wanted to bump this, it's now the middle of summer and I wanted to see how some of your "experiments" worked out!

                                        Anyone tried something for fading and happy with the results?