• Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.

Announcement

Collapse

Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.

Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 1/26/16)
See more
See less

EPM Shake didn't work...on to Marquis...any advice??

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #21
    Ina 22yo horse I suspect an x-ray will show SOME arthritic changes regardless...and the last thing you want to do to a potential EPM horse is inject a steriod. I would not inject any horse that "might" have EPM.

    My guy was 18 when diagnosed. He was actually missed diagnosed and his hocks and stifles were injected with steriods, which, sent him into EPM overload. By the time we started the Marquis it was too late and I lost him.

    Prior to the injections his symptoms were fairly mild...would swap leads behind, refused to pick up the left lead most of the time, would trip on occasion (but not go down) and some slight weight loss. Once he was injected it wasnt 2 days and he started going down hill quickly. Unable to walk a straight line, would trip and fall, then the spinning and falling started. It was unsafe to even get the medicine in him.

    Its a nasty, nasty thing and I hate for anyone to have to go through it. We have A LOT of possums in the area but at no time did my "well known and established" vet mention EPM...it was actually a younger vet who came out to see the horse after the injections who said it...that was the first word out of her mouth when she saw him.
    Never Ride Faster Than Your Guardian Angel Can Fly
    Way Back Texas~04/20/90-09/17/08
    Green Alligator "Captain"

    Comment


    • #22
      Remember that IV tetracycline-family drugs can have fairly significant systemic anti-inflammatory effects, so an animal that "gets better on oxytet" may only be showing signs of reduced inflammation which may have nothing to do with any infection going on. This might include a nerve root compression from cervical spine injury, arthritis, etc.
      Click here before you buy.

      Comment


      • #23
        As you rule out other things, investigate "Pathogenes" website. I have had 5 EPM horses and my best success was with the testing and protocols from Pathogenes.
        I wish you the best.

        Comment


        • #24
          5 EPM horses diagnosed exclusively by Pathogenes, I'm guessing?
          Click here before you buy.

          Comment


          • #25
            Originally posted by deltawave View Post
            5 EPM horses diagnosed exclusively by Pathogenes, I'm guessing?
            Always the cynic, aren't you? Are you on Bayer's payroll?

            Funny how so many horses actually GET BETTER after diagnosis and treatment using the Pathogenes protocol.

            Comment


            • #26
              Always the cynic, aren't you? Are you on Bayer's payroll?
              Yes, thank you. And no to the Bayer part. I'm pretty vociferously on the record speaking out against ridiculous markups of proven drugs. Proven, of course, being the key word. And everyone is free to value that as highly as they wish. I place it pretty high.

              Better is better. But if a diagnosis is incorrect and the improvement might have happened anyway, taking credit (although it harms nobody physically) is ethically questionable in my book. Anxiously awaiting the peer-reviewed publication of the data they claim to be collecting so assiduously.
              Click here before you buy.

              Comment


              • #27
                Originally posted by deltawave View Post
                Yes, thank you. And no to the Bayer part. I'm pretty vociferously on the record speaking out against ridiculous markups of proven drugs. Proven, of course, being the key word. And everyone is free to value that as highly as they wish. I place it pretty high.

                Better is better. But if a diagnosis is incorrect and the improvement might have happened anyway, taking credit (although it harms nobody physically) is ethically questionable in my book. Anxiously awaiting the peer-reviewed publication of the data they claim to be collecting so assiduously.
                You are right, better is better. And my horse is one that DID get better after being diagnosed and treated using the Pathogenes protocol. Mind you, this was AFTER he had been NQR for several years. And AFTER the standard Western Blot came up negative for EPM. It was the PATHOGENES test that diagnosed him, and the PATHOGENES treatment that made him better. As stated several times before, he has been in solid work for the past 8 months - for the first time in 2-3 years - and is building muscle on his topline and in his haunches, and is really progressing well in his training (did some loverly piaffe yesterday! ).

                So if you want to keep waiting for "peer-reviewed data", that is okay with me. My proof is in the pudding, and I see him out dancing around the arena like a real dressage horse now.

                Comment


                • #28
                  1. They don't really do spinal taps for EPM anymore - they do a blood titer that is sent to UC Davis and is quite accurate as to exposure levels. Treatment is often based on the results of this test. The test is around $100, I believe, and is well worth doing.
                  My horse was tested via UC Davis recently, with the results coming back as negative. I took him to a large, well known clinic for a comprehensive neuro workup, which included a spinal tap. The spinal tap came back positive. Both my regular vet and the specialist at the clinic indicated that a spinal tap is the best test for determining EPM status. This was only a month ago.

                  FWIW, we did digital neck X-rays in the field, with additional images taken at the clinic. We also scoped the horse and would have moved on to the myelogram if that had been deemed necessary.

                  All that said, this is a promising young horse. If I had a 22-year-old, yes I would pursue neck radiographs, and if those did not show significant degeneration or narrowing, I would probably just try the Marquis. That does not sound like an unreasonable course of action IMO.

                  Comment


                  • #29
                    Hey guys... can we NOT turn this in to yet ANOTHER p****** match about Pathogenes?

                    If you want empirical data go with Marquis.

                    If you are willing to give something a shot that hasn't been completely through the peer review process, but has quite a bit of anecdotal results go pathogenes.

                    And if you want to read about ALL of the other catfights on this board about it, type "pathogenes" into a search engine.
                    The ninja monkeys are plotting my demise as we speak....

                    Comment


                    • #30
                      Couldn't have said it better myself. Different strokes for different folks!
                      Click here before you buy.

                      Comment


                      • #31
                        I learned about Dr. Sioban Ellison and Pathogenes with EPM horse #4. He had had multiple rounds of suspension and Marquis, with little improvement. After her testing and med protocol, though now retired, he is the most normal he has ever been.
                        I wish I has know about her research years ago.
                        Of the five, two died as a result of their EPM (one confirmed at necropsy), one lived a long and productive life and died of colic(she was diagnosed by CSF tap), I still have one and the last one is in a new home and I am not sure of his status.
                        I feel so lucky to have been lead to Pathogenes for the sake of the horse who has benefitted. My vet is now a believer and has a couple of success stories as well.
                        I think I had horses on a possum farm, not the other way around!
                        I wish the best for anyone who is dealing with this.
                        Last edited by csb; Jan. 1, 2013, 09:41 AM. Reason: Add info

                        Comment

                        Working...
                        X