• Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.



Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.

Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 1/26/16)
See more
See less

Horse won't trot...is he lame?

  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts
  • Original Poster

    This is my worst nightmare...but could this be EPM?


    • #82
      Is the diet helping?

      Did you try the diet and see any difference? Before you posted the video I would have suggested cavaletti to encourage trotting. It helps a lot with cadence, etc, and can be a help with one that wants to pace or canter while they get stronger. But on the video I also thought owie front feet.

      This must be very frustrating. Thanks for sharing so we can all learn something.


      • Original Poster

        He is on the diet now. About 1 week in so too soon to tell. About half the people who watch the video think its in the front and half think its in the back. Even the vets can't figure out which legs. I've had a couple people suggest EPM which scares me to death. He passed his neuro exam but I guess a test wouldn't hurt. I'm driving myself crazy on this one.


        • #84
          The videos clearly show your horse landing toe first. This is abnormal locomotion and nearly always linked to caudal foot pain.

          Can you post some pictures of your horse's feet showing the bottom in closeup? Also pictures from the side at ground level - horse standing square?


          • #85
            Looks to me that he is off both front and hind though the hind may be compensatory in nature. Perhaps its time to pull his shoes, turn him out and let tincture of time have a chance to work.

            When idiopathic lameness is present, EPM is always a suspect.


            • Original Poster

              Wouldn't the nerve block rule out foot pain? I think it was a good nerve block. I watched them poke him with a ball point pen. Also he doesnt react to hoof testers anywhere on the hoof. I will take pictures this afternoon and post them. Hoof pain would make sense but the last vet said we had ruled it out.

              Thanks so much to everyone posting replies. You have no idea how helpful you've been.


              • #87
                The nerve block can give you a false positive or false negative. I would also do Abaxial Sesamoid block to make sure.

                Did your horses hocks gets radiographed?


                • #88
                  Originally posted by mrg8302 View Post
                  Wouldn't the nerve block rule out foot pain?
                  Yes but if it's long term chronic then the horse is acclimated to moving abnormally due to muscle memory. Though there should still be some observable change in the stride.

                  I think it was a good nerve block. I watched them poke him with a ball point pen. Also he doesnt react to hoof testers anywhere on the hoof. I will take pictures this afternoon and post them. Hoof pain would make sense but the last vet said we had ruled it out.
                  I thought there was a diagnosis of "thin soles" at some point in the history. ???

                  Thanks so much to everyone posting replies. You have no idea how helpful you've been.
                  Get some hoof shots posted. Then you'll have enough opinions to be really confused.


                  • Original Poster

                    Ok here are some pictures. His right front has a gouge from where he clipped himself during training (learning to lunge at the trainer). His left front looks beat up because that is the shoe he pulled and had to be reset. I also included his original hoof x-rays from October. This is when he was diagnosed with thin soles and before he had shoes on. He was positive to the hoof testers at this time. We put shoes on him and put him in the pasture for 6 weeks. After that we took him back to the vet for a follow up and he was negative to hoof testers and has been ever since.



                    • #90
                      Are those laminitis rings on the black and white foot?


                      • Original Poster

                        Well I don't know what they are caused from. But none of the vets or the multiple farriers have mentioned them? I sure noticed them though. But wouldn't laminitis show up on X-ray? And make him sore with the hoof tester?


                        • #92
                          Originally posted by mrg8302 View Post
                          Well I don't know what they are caused from. But none of the vets or the multiple farriers have mentioned them? I sure noticed them though. But wouldn't laminitis show up on X-ray? And make him sore with the hoof tester?

                          Most likely but there could be exceptions. You may just want to give this horse some time. If you are going to invest in yet another opinion I would suggest going to a vet school and making sure the head surgeon is present. I wonder if your horse would trot on a tred mill? If thin soles was a previous diagnoses then could not see some pads doing any harm. Previously I was concerned about some minor navicular changes on my of my horses with lameness. The lameness specialist I used dismissed them as there was no response to hoof testers. I asked that question to head surgeon at WSU he said it was possible to have navicular pain on a horse that has no reaction to hoof testers and that a negative PDN block does not preclude hoof pain. I had also asked a contact I had in head of orthopadics in England whom also told me a horse with heal pain may not react to hoof testers. I had asked another contact at CSU whom concurred. Not suggesting that is an issue with your horse just that hoof testers are helpful but not always reliable.


                          • Original Poster

                            I'm trying to contact another vet that works with racehorses and lots of lameness issues. Hopefully he can come out this week. I'll ask him about the lines in the hoofs. After that, I'll probably pull his shoes and leave him alone for now. Give my wallet and my mind a rest for several months. The crazy thing though him running around the pasture, bucking, sliding to a stop inches before the fence...he can't be hurting too bad if he is doing that. I'm thinking of putting him out with my other 2 horses...maybe will be good for his mind. It's been 4 months since he was gelded so he should be ok to go out with mares.


                            • #94
                              I don't know how far you are from a vet school but vet schools often provide more workup for less money than a local vet. Our vet school jogs and lunges the horse on a soft surface and pavement, videos some exams, has a top notch ultrasound and high quality digital films. I had a mini lameness exam, including X-rays for $240 recently. Then we went to the hospital farrier. I left with a sound horse. Admittedly, I probably overreacted when I made the same day appointment an hour after my horse became lame, so it probably wasn't a difficult diagnosis. I panicked when he was lame, thinking it was something bad.


                              • Original Poster

                                I'm about 4 hours from Texas A&M so that is an option. However they are not cheap. But it is something for me to think about. It may be something only a vet school has the technology to figure out.


                                • #96
                                  I would take the horse to Texas A and M. Get a friend to go with you as you may forget to ask all of your questions if you go alone. Tell them that money is an issue. Bring all of your old x-rays so they don't have to repeat all of them. Ask your vet who is the best vet to see there. Years ago, we used to see a Robin Dabareiner, who was a vet at our vet school who later went to Texas A and M. I don't know if she is still there. She was hyperactive and disorganized, but a really good diagnostician. She took one look at our TB, said he had navicular, and injected him. 2 days later, he was sound. Almost 20 years later, his navicular disease is still well controlled. If your vet can't match you up with a good diagnostician, ask the appointment secretary who is the best person for you to see. Explain what you are looking for and she may be able to match you with the right vet.


                                  • #97
                                    I too would get a 2nd opinion on the x-rays and lameness - the xrays honestly scare me a bit. Lot of lucencies and rough edges. I'm not a vet, but having worked on a TB breeding farm, we xrayed all the weanlings/yearlings at least 2X/yr and when I worked at the track, we were obviously xraying a lot... and frankly, I wasn't impressed with your boys xrays - the right seems worse than the left. BUT since I'm not a vet, obviously I can't be positive - but something about them worries me.

                                    Based on what I saw on the videos, I definitely think it is his front end that is worse and his hind end is awkward because he is compensating.


                                    • #98
                                      Originally posted by mrg8302 View Post
                                      Ok here are some pictures. . .
                                      Oh dear! How long has it been since this hoes has had its heels trimmed?


                                      • Original Poster

                                        5 1/2 weeks ago he had those shoes put on. A farrier just looked at him last week and said he didn't have enough growth to work with. He said to wait 2 more weeks. Why? What do you see?


                                        • In my opinion, your first step should be to find another farrier. Your horse needs his feet done by a competent professional. Check around for recommendations on good farriers in your area...may need one experienced in therapeutic work. If you decide to haul him to A&M, be sure they have one of their farriers available to work on him. You'd be surprised how often issues like you're seeing with your gelding are a result of poor trimming/shoeing.

                                          If you can't find good recommendations, maybe call A&M and ask who they recommend in your area. Good luck with your guy.