• Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.

Announcement

Collapse

Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.

Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 1/26/16)
See more
See less

Pentosan: Side effects? And effective with the old ones?

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #21
    Originally posted by Mozart View Post
    Hmm..can I get some for myself???
    That's a thought! Hmm...

    Comment


    • #22
      This thread just helped me make my decision to put my horse on pentosan. He went lame in July and x-rays showed a chip in the ankle and some ring bone as well.

      The chip was removed about 9 weeks ago and he's on the last part of his recovery which is a month of regular turn out and "go be a horse" therapy. The surgeon is optimistic about his recovery but did say that we might need to do some joint maintenance/injections periodically.

      From what I've read here it sounds like the risk vs the benefit comes out mostly on the benefit side. I have a bottle that I got just a day before his surgery so I didn't start him on it. I'm going to start the loading dose this weekend. I'll be keeping my fingers crossed.
      "Some people are born on third base and go through life thinking they hit a triple” – Barry Switzer

      Comment


      • #23
        There have been 14 reported cases of bleeding since 2007. However, that is where the manufacturer has warnings as the risk of bleeding is directly associated with the dosage. Additionally, they do not recommend it for horses with bleeding issues.The company researchers stipulated that given the drug will cause increased risk in bleeding, it should not be administered within 24-48 hours of strenuous exercise where the horse is at risk for injury. After 48 hours, the anti-clotting effect wears off.

        Details were at Biopharm Australia (the drug maker) but it is no longer available.

        Vets are lukewarm because PPS is basically the same as Adequan in its function. Since it is not approved in the US for what you all intend, it can lead to liability and malpractice issues.

        We don't get the risk information in the US as the compounding pharmacies don't actually have to do anything to prove efficacy or safety. Biopharm's work is based on studies done in Australia and Europe over the past 5 years.

        Comment


        • #24
          That was my vet's concern with it, the compounding issue. He is a well respected lameness/sport horse vet but is not a fan of Pentosan. I'd like to try it but am hesitant. Are you guys using PentAussie or just "pentosan"?

          Is this similar to the MAP5 vs. Adequan issue?
          No Trouble
          2/2/05 - 7/29/13
          Rest In Peace my quirky brave boy, I will love you forever.

          Comment


          • #25
            I use PentAussie specifically.

            Comment


            • #26
              Several horses in my current barn are on Pentosan and seem to be doing really well on it. I would not hesitate to use it on a horse having issues with stiffness, difficulty warming up, and that sort of thing.

              There is an FDA approved human version, called Elmiron. It's been around for years, although for an entirely different application.
              **********
              We move pretty fast for some rabid garden snails.
              -PaulaEdwina

              Comment


              • #27
                I have given it to two of my horses in the neck and both horses necks swelled up and got sore. Vet advised me to give it in the peck muscles or lower down on the neck near the junction of the shoulder. They didn't swell there. I did see improvement in one of my horses two with a known old fracture.

                Comment


                • #28
                  I never give injections > 1-2 cc in the neck..
                  Click here before you buy.

                  Comment


                  • #29
                    Originally posted by deltawave View Post
                    I never give injections > 1-2 cc in the neck..
                    Why? Is there something written on this? Vets regularly give and advise to give doses of 20-30ccs in the neck with redirection every 5ccs or so. Removing the two sides of the neck when rotating daily medication such as a series of penicillin would seem to be be unfair to the horse and make them more sore in the remaining injection sites.

                    Comment


                    • #30
                      It is my own personal preference, that's all. God gave the horse vast tracts of muscle (hamstring, pectoral) that are not as touchy and prone to making them stiff and sore. So I avail myself of that real estate, reserving the neck for vaccines and the like. Obviously I would use the neck if there were no remaining options, but IME neck injections seem to be disproportionately likely to make them sore and uncomfortable as opposed to similar-sized injections in the larger muscles. Maybe it's because the neck muscles are in use non-stop (whereas a horse can "rest" a hind leg) or the muscle sheets are thinner and touchier in the neck. In any case, I stated what I stated with no authority whatsoever other than my own personal way of doing it.
                      Click here before you buy.

                      Comment


                      • #31
                        This thread certainly helped convince me to give it a try on my 13 year old with pretty awful arthritis too.

                        Do you guys buy a vial and give it yourself each month? How much do you give each month? How much does it cost? I think I saw someone once say it's only $10 a month, but that doesn't seem right?

                        Comment


                        • #32
                          It is given once a week for four doses then as needed. I pay roughly $26 per dose with shipping and give it myself.
                          McDowell Racing Stables

                          Home Away From Home

                          Comment


                          • #33
                            I pay $160 for a 50 cc vial, which is enough for 8 doses for my big girl (6cc per dose). If I'm using it on one of my smaller ones it's only 5cc/dose so I get 10 per vial. So the cost is $16-20 per dose, and I know people can get it much cheaper (I've heard prices from $100-140 for the same size vial) but I have a standing Rx and so it's just easy for me to get it from the same place when I need it.

                            Yes, I give it myself but am extremely careful about cleaning the bottle top each time and since it's a multi-use vial I also clean the skin fastidiously before I inject and inspect the drug as I draw it up for any cloudiness or signs that it's contaminated.
                            Click here before you buy.

                            Comment


                            • #34
                              One of my best friends is a bet, when she gets home I'm going to have her check to see how much she can get it for (and then I'll give it myself). Horse is a little over 1000lbs, so I think I'll need the 6cc.

                              Comment


                              • #35
                                Just because a vet may not have heard of something or may not prefer a specific therapy doesn't mean that vet's all in it for the money of hock injections. Some vets just don't prefer Pentosan. Adequan is approved, bombards the vets with information, and vets are used to it/have good experiences. Doesn't make them just out to make a buck.
                                ~Veronica
                                "The Son Dee Times" "Sustained" "Somerset" "Franklin Square"
                                http://photobucket.com/albums/y192/vxf111/

                                Comment


                                • #36
                                  Originally posted by deltawave View Post
                                  Pentosan is related to heparin (an anticoagulant) chemically and can have weak effects on the clotting system, so a horse could theoretically be more prone to bleeding from some sort of cut or injury that might not bleed much otherwise in the day or two following a Pentosan injection.
                                  I started two horses on it (a 22 year old and a 4 year old, both recovering from injuries) several weeks ago and both are feeling pretty good!

                                  Just FYI, the older horse is due for joint injections and vet said to make sure he does not get Pentosan within 48 hours either side of the joint injections due to the slight anticoagulant effect of the drug.

                                  I asked my vet about the differences between Pentosan, Adequan and Legend. He said they each work a bit differently and that one reason why one works for one horse and not another has to do with the type of inflammation. He likes Pentosan but said he thinks the best one-two punch comes with giving both Adequan and Legend together. Which is pretty expensive...

                                  Comment


                                  • #37
                                    Laurierace & Deltawave, where are you ordering your Pentosan from? My vet told me to stick with Pentaussie and not get the compounded kind from Wedgewood. Cheapest per 6cc dose I've found so far is $40/dose from HorsePreRace. Thanks!

                                    Comment


                                    • #38
                                      Abba Vet. It is the Wedgewood product, however. I'm comfortable with it, and have weighed the risks and benefits.
                                      Click here before you buy.

                                      Comment


                                      • #39
                                        Originally posted by deltawave View Post
                                        Abba Vet. It is the Wedgewood product, however. I'm comfortable with it, and have weighed the risks and benefits.
                                        Thanks! I was thinking I'd order it from a compounding pharmacy but my vet said he is nervous about injectables coming from a compounding pharmacy. The cost from Abba is much lower than buying Pentaussie though, which sure makes it tempting.

                                        Comment


                                        • #40
                                          If my vet would write a script I would go to Wedgewood directly but he doesn't so I get it from Abba who gets it from Wedgewood. FYI Abba has been my vet for 20 years which is why he won't write a script to go elsewhere but I don't need one to order from them.
                                          McDowell Racing Stables

                                          Home Away From Home

                                          Comment

                                          Working...
                                          X