• Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.



Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.

Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 1/26/16)
See more
See less

Heart murmurs...elevated resting heart rate

  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Heart murmurs...elevated resting heart rate

    So as some of you may know, I have an older TB gelding with a heart murmur. The heart murmur was first found out about when my vet was treating his lymphangitis...which was about a year ago. It was the loudest she had ever heard and was very concerned he could "drop dead any time now" . The vet had me freaked out and a mess, but I came to COTH, asked questions, and managed to calm myself down (thanks guys!). At that point his heart rate was "normal", I believe the vet was getting it at about 35 bpm. She gave me signs to watch out for, fluid in his chest, legs swelling, exercise intolerance, and difficulty breathing. But through the rest of the summer, fall, winter, he seemed completely normal. Up until about a month ago the horse was bouncing off walls.
    The vet was out in early April and noted that his HR was up a bit. But vet and I didn't really think much of it because this is a horse that gets nervous easily and doesn't particularly like vets. Then horse went off his feed about a week ago, the same day the vet was coming to finish up with spring shots. She did a once over, noted that his HR was definitely high, she said she caught it as high as 62 bpm, but was mostly in the mid 50's. Didn't necessarily say that going off his feed had anything to do with the HR increase, but since he wasn't acting colicky and is on a free choice forage diet (so IMO pretty much ruling out ulcers) I started to panic again, and realized that over the past few weeks he had been *calmer*. I couldn't remember the last time he had really run just to run, he was much better ground tying (can't straight tie or x-tie as he pulls back), and overall a little less up. I attributed it to the heat and possibly just some old age, creaky arthritis issues (he's OT and retired at age 13!), but with the elevated HR I panicked again. So the next day, when he started acting colicky again, (after he ate his morning grain) I didn't know what to think. I had a vet out who tubed him with oil and a water electrolyte mix, and said to withhold food for 24 hours. Did that, brought him back onto food slowly (he is just back to a normal diet a week later), and now he seems fine, eating normally, etc.
    However his heart rate is still high, as in high 40's-low 50's high. I've been watching him closely, and while I wouldn't say he is exercise intolerant, he would much rather just hang out, graze, etc, than run around with his pasture buddy. I've been taking him on some trail walks (in hand) just to see if he would get tired, and he doesn't seem to be, the only time he seemed to be breathing heavy is after walking up and down a pretty steep hill, and even then he was still ready to *go* just breathing harder. He will still follow me around the ring and over jumps without fuss. He doesn't seem to have any fluid build up in his chest or legs, his respiration seems normal as well.
    He has lost a bit of weight, but I think that is from half starving him for almost a week due to the colic. It isn't weight loss anyone else has noticed, just me. His coat is shiny, he's bright eyed, and doesn't seem in any distress. I don't know what to think at this point.

    The vet will be coming back out in the next week or so to re-check his heart rate and give him a once over (along with the rest of his spring shots) so I plan to mention what I've said on here to her, but she isn't very knowledgeable about heart murmurs so I tend to take whatever she says with a grain of salt.

    I just don't know what to think here. Part of me says I should be mentally preparing for when it's "time", and the other part wants me to blow it off as nothing.

    So what are my options at this point? Wait and see? Any drugs? I love this horse dearly but I can't spend a ton of money on him. He's 20, retired, has behavioral issues, and lymphangitis flare ups that have happened every year at the same time since I've had him. He lives the good life, I want to keep it that way. I won't trailer him to any big vet clinics because of his overall mental issues, he gets stressed by new situations and doesn't trailer well.

    Sorry for the novel btw, just wondering what everyone's opinions are and if anyone has ever gone through something similar.

    I just have a gut feeling that he's getting closer to the "time".
    come what may

    Rest in peace great mare, 1987-2013

  • #2
    Yes, I did have something similar happen with my beloved TB Cupola. He was doing great into his early 20s, I was riding him about 3-4 times per week, and everything was fine. He did present with more 'calmness' or lethargy, but this was only noticeable really in retrospect, and it came on slowly. One day he had a sinus infection...a new vet in the practice came out and mentioned he had a heart murmur that no one had heard before. We tentatively thought bacteria might have migrated to the mitral valve, and in treating the sinus infection, it might resolve. We tried multiple rounds of antibiotics, all of which unfortunately caused extreme reaction requiring nearly daily emergency visits, giving fluids, banamine, etc. to manage colic responses to drugs.

    After three weeks, the heart murmur was much worse. I had a cardiac expert come to the barn to do an EKG and we learned that what we thought was the sound related to a heart murmur was not that at all.

    With a continued elevated heart rate, I'd get someone out who knows more than just a little about heart murmurs to determine whether that's what it is or if there is something else going on.


    • #3
      I'll be watching this post intently as my 4 year old just got diagnosed with a Grade 3 murmur today. Regular DVM says most likely retire her but I'm waiting to get her down for an ultrasound with a specialist to confirm. She was tiring and getting winded more easily then I thought normal for her age so I had her checked. I'm so devastated and pouring through the brilliant minds of COTH trying to calm down. I can't believe this is happening:-(
      Please excuse the typos...I'm always on my iPhone and autocorrect is not my friend. Yes I mean mares autocorrect...not mates.


      • #4
        You cannot say what is wrong with the heart without an ultrasound. The grade/loudness of a murmur correlates VERY VERY poorly with the severity of whatever the specific lesion is.

        Without an echocardiogram, it is IMPOSSIBLE to say for sure what might be the treatment options or the prognosis.

        To make prognostic or treatment declarations based upon listening to a murmur is like listening to a car's engine running and saying how many miles are on it or what might (or might not) be wrong with the radiator. Does not compute.
        Click here before you buy.


        • #5
          SAcres- I fully appreciate not wanting to trailer a nervous horse. I'd be looking for someone to come out to the barn to do an ultrasound so you have some real information about what his problem is and if there are treatment options available.


          • Original Poster

            Does anyone know of someone in SE PA that might be willing to come out? I don't want to spend a ton of money but it might be worth the peace of mind just to know what is going on, how fast the progression might be, etc, etc.
            Deltawave, I do realize it is impossible to diagnose exactly what is going on with the heart but my options are limited due to this horse's er...mental state. I refuse to trailer him somewhere unless he is sedated. But I do think someone is worsening with his heart because he didn't use to have such a high heart rate.

            So sorry that is happening to you Keg, I can't imagine how devastating it must be. I was so broken up finding out my completely retired horse (who I got as a companion and never really rode) had a heart murmur. It's a terrible situation to be in. From what I've read though, a lot of horses live good lives even with murmurs, so there is hope for your horse!
            come what may

            Rest in peace great mare, 1987-2013


            • #7
              Ric Birk or Mary Durando, both vets with excellent "chops" in equine cardiology. Cohorts (along with me, although my role is small) on the Cardiovascular Research Initiative that the USEA is doing and very well-versed in equine echocardiography.


              Conveniently located in SE PA.
              Click here before you buy.


              • #8
                Deltawave is very correct. You should do the cardio eval to understand the full extent of the problem.