• Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.

Announcement

Collapse

Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.

Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 1/26/16)
See more
See less

Hind gut ulcers?

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Hind gut ulcers?

    What is the treatment and or diagnostic for hind gut ulcers.

    I do have a message in to my vet, but this is a busy time for them, and it is a non-urgent issue, so looking for ideas from Coth.

    Also wondering what symptoms you would expect if a horse has a hind gut ulcer.
    Freeing worms from cans everywhere!

  • #2
    Succeed makes a fecal test that is supposed to identify gastric ulcers and/or hind gut ulcers but I'm not sure how accurate it is; you'd have to ask your vet. My interpretation of what I've read is that it is more accurate for hind gut ulcers than gastric ulcers.

    A friend of a friend has a horse that gets sucralfate for hind gut ulcers. I've read of others treating with diet changes. Succeed (supplement) is advertised to help. I think other people feed oat flour in small amounts as a supplement. There should be a lot on COTH if you do some searches and you could also read some of the stuff on the Succeed website.

    Comment


    • #3
      I have a horse that we suspect has hind gut ulcers. Unfortunately there is no way to scope for them but they can be "confirmed" through bloodwork and a fecal blood test from what I understand. Succeed is supposed to be the best (and of course most expensive!) way to manage them but I've had great luck with Equishure from KER.

      http://www.kerx.com/products/EquiShure/

      My horse used to be a once a year "mystery colicer" (as in needing to be shipped to a clinic and put on fluids). He's be scoped several times and all the scopes were within normal limits. Since being in the Equishure the colics have stopped completely--it's the only thing that has changed in his management.
      Originally posted by EquineImagined
      My subconscious is a wretched insufferable beotch.

      Comment


      • #4
        I wouldn't trust the Succeed test at all. Blood doesn't mean hind gut ulcers, and lack of blood doesn't mean no hind gut ulcers It might be useful in conjunction with other tests/diagnostics, but even then it seems a waste.
        ______________________________
        The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances. - ET

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by JB View Post
          I wouldn't trust the Succeed test at all. Blood doesn't mean hind gut ulcers, and lack of blood doesn't mean no hind gut ulcers It might be useful in conjunction with other tests/diagnostics, but even then it seems a waste.
          That's exactly what my a home vet said--we did do the test because he had a sample one (free) and it did come back "positive". The clinic blew me off when told this. OP I also forgot to mention that my horse was also on Sucralfate for a couple of weeks following his colic episodes.
          Originally posted by EquineImagined
          My subconscious is a wretched insufferable beotch.

          Comment


          • #6
            http://www.chronofhorse.com/forum/sh...d.php?t=352557
            --Gwen <><
            "Treat others as you want to be treated and be the change you want to see in the world."
            http://www.thepenzancehorse.com

            Comment


            • #7
              I suspected HG ulcers. Put my horse on Equishure (KER) and saw a noticeable change. (he had terribly acidic, foul smelling manure, was very gassy - this was after we treated and healed stomach ulcers). We did switch him to KER's other product, RiteTrac, only because another horse at our barn was going on it - RiteTrac addresses the whole digestive system (has Equishure in it). I dropped SmartGut from my Smartpak, only have him on the RiteTrac and he is doing GREAT. Licking his pan clean, very eager to eat, no longer as gassy. I always suspected hindgut as it's a much larger area than the stomach, and if he had chronic Grade 2 in the belly, it's likely he had it elsewhere. Even after we treated with Gguard, he would still get ho-hum about eating at times, leave feed, and not be nickering for his food. Now he comes running, nickers and finishes everything.

              You could try one of the above products and see if you notice a change vs. all the testing, vet bills.

              Comment

              • Original Poster

                #8
                Is there anything of use in that thread? read some of it, but it just seemed snarky vs useful. Not really in the mood to read snark today.

                Horse doesn't really show any of the symptoms. no colics, no smelly poo...and she has been treated with Omeprazol back in Nov or Dec. Scope of stomach was fine.

                She has also been seen by a TCM accupressurist and doesn't get sweet feed/grain (referring to above link....).


                Was hoping there was a simple, proven test.
                Freeing worms from cans everywhere!

                Comment


                • #9
                  It's diagnosed by eliminating all other possible issues. Sadly.

                  However...a change of diet is the fix and also can be a really decent diagnostic tool.

                  Change the diet...if there's improvement then you've most likely hit the nail on the head and you just stick to the diet change for 3 months minimum to give them time to heal.

                  Remove *all* stem hay, dry forage and extruded feeds. Swap over to a complete feed/pelleted feed and soak it to mush. Replace stem hay with soaked cubes. Soak the cubes until soup. Change feedings to 3-6 times daily instead of 1-2 times. Smaller meals fed more often. Absolutely positively *no* NSAIDs. Grazing is good.

                  The small wet soupy meals many times per day means less bulk is moving through the painful areas, less stretching. All the extra soaking helps a lot with the excess water/hydration.

                  If it's hind gut ulcers/inflamation then there should be an improvement rather soon after the diet change. Give it at least a week or two.
                  You jump in the saddle,
                  Hold onto the bridle!
                  Jump in the line!
                  ...Belefonte

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by CHT View Post
                    Is there anything of use in that thread? read some of it, but it just seemed snarky vs useful. Not really in the mood to read snark today.

                    Horse doesn't really show any of the symptoms. no colics, no smelly poo...and she has been treated with Omeprazol back in Nov or Dec. Scope of stomach was fine.

                    She has also been seen by a TCM accupressurist and doesn't get sweet feed/grain (referring to above link....).


                    Was hoping there was a simple, proven test.
                    If you watch the video, you might learn something from it.
                    --Gwen <><
                    "Treat others as you want to be treated and be the change you want to see in the world."
                    http://www.thepenzancehorse.com

                    Comment

                    • Original Poster

                      #11
                      Originally posted by caballus View Post
                      If you watch the video, you might learn something from it.
                      Watched the first 4 minutes. Will watch again and take notes. Interesting, and worth checking out. I do think acupressure/meridians have value.

                      MistyBlue, thank you for the feeding schedule...not an easy one for a horse that is on group turn out, but worth a try. How long until we should see improvement? Right now she is fed hay three times a day (in a slow net feeder twice a day, ones a day hay is scattered in her paddock), 1 cup complete in afternoon, and soaked beet pulp with suppliments at bed time (mine, not hers...she can stay up as late as she wants).

                      Soon though they will be out on sparse grass, and supplimented with hay and a mineral block, but could switch that to soaked hay cubes, with some pellets mixed in.
                      Freeing worms from cans everywhere!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Don't try to diagnose/treat hindgut (colon) ulcers on your own, despite the advice you've received here. They're very serious, tough to diagnose and tough to treat--definitely not a DIY project. Consult your veterinarian (I realize you have a call in).

                        Comment

                        • Original Poster

                          #13
                          Originally posted by zipperfoot View Post
                          Don't try to diagnose/treat hindgut (colon) ulcers on your own, despite the advice you've received here. They're very serious, tough to diagnose and tough to treat--definitely not a DIY project. Consult your veterinarian (I realize you have a call in).
                          Spoke to my vet briefly and she admits to little knowledge on this other than from school. She would expect different symptoms than this horse has though; such as poor condition, runny and/or smelly manure, worse blood work (last one was normal), and signs of mild colic. She was not off hand aware of the treatments other than antibiotics for suspected collitis....but maybe that is because there really aren't any.

                          Still, I see no harm in trying the acupressure test, even if just to give my vet a good laugh. Vets deserve good stories about their crazy clients once and a while, and I should contribute.
                          Freeing worms from cans everywhere!

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by CHT View Post
                            Spoke to my vet briefly and she admits to little knowledge on this other than from school. She would expect different symptoms than this horse has though; such as poor condition, runny and/or smelly manure, worse blood work (last one was normal), and signs of mild colic. She was not off hand aware of the treatments other than antibiotics for suspected collitis....but maybe that is because there really aren't any.

                            Still, I see no harm in trying the acupressure test, even if just to give my vet a good laugh. Vets deserve good stories about their crazy clients once and a while, and I should contribute.
                            OP- how I'd this work or yo and how did you end up treating?
                            "No hour of life is wasted that is spent in the saddle" - Winston Churchill

                            Check out Central Virginia Horse Rescue

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              We have been going through some issues with my gelding after a mild colic this fall. My vet had me treat for sand colic and then place on either equisure or smart digest to see if they helped (there is a particular ingredient in there she was looking for.)

                              I tried the smart digest as it was less expensive and his appetite has increased significantly but he is still a little gassy. I think I will try equisure next time to see if it helps with the gas.

                              I would suggest trying the equisure.

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Yes CHT, update please.

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Hind gut ulcers

                                  My horse suffers from chronic hind gut ulcers... we have tried him on all sorts of things... I did so much research and so many trials on all types of supplements and medications but ultimately broke it down to my scientific understanding of how hindgut ulcers and how they are formed... hind gut ulcers form after the occurrence of hindgut acidosis, a build up of lactic acid in the hind gut, causing the pH to drop and the environment to become acidic, the acidic environment allows the development of harmful bacteria and hinders the growth of good microbes... after trying the ever pricey "solutions" that never ended up working I ended up putting my guy on a dose of pre and prebiotic AM and PM along with equisure from KER... equisure is important in keeping the environment basic and allowing the pre and prebiotics to work on building a healthy environment with good microbes... my guy hasn't been happier he is back out competing and sound after years of struggle! I needed to share after all the research I did with claimed "cures" this is what really helped! Feel free to message me <3

                                  Comment

                                  Working...
                                  X