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Fun In Trimming! Or, Check Out These Feet - UPDATED PICS ON POST 1 and 100

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  • Fun In Trimming! Or, Check Out These Feet - UPDATED PICS ON POST 1 and 100

    The first shot is when I pulled his shoes. The rest are todays trim, the second "real" one. I have rolled them a few times between then and now.

    Still no water to wash those feet... it was darn cold here today!

    More pics in post 100.
    Attached Files
    Last edited by EqTrainer; Feb. 11, 2008, 07:47 PM. Reason: UPDATE
    "Kindness is free" ~ Eurofoal
    ---
    The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances.

  • #2
    I'm not a professional trimmer, but I do trim my own horses, one of whom was pretty messed up when I started doing him (already barefoot, but had tons of flare and underrun heels because he was very badly behaved for the last guy and I had not yet started learning to do my own at that point).

    I would probably bring the horse's toe back a bit (for now, more over time), rasp off the flare in the lowest 1/3, and bring down the heels a little at a time (it's hard for me to see exactly where they are in the picture). I mainly trim from the top (much like Paige Poss's description at ironfreehoof.com). I would rather do a bit, step back, look, and maybe do a bit more, then do it again in a week or two than do a ton at once. JMHO... I'm far from an expert opinion, but I'm interested to hear what others have to say!
    Last edited by Lauren!; Jan. 19, 2008, 09:25 PM. Reason: for my bad spelling :)

    Comment


    • #3
      I would first address the run away toes and bad flaring as much as I can...take the wall right back to the white line and try to get his breakover back. I would level the heels but probably not take them down much on the first trim....just getting him out of the wedge pads might help with his heels also as they look pretty crushed. I would "feather" them also the way Paige does to help encourage the heels to grow downward instead of forward from the back.

      He looks like a horse that would be sore if you were too aggressive though so without seeing him, I'd be cautious about attacking the flaring too much also as I've seen that cause soreness. Is he flat soled? He looks a bit that way but I wasn't sure how much of that is dead sole I'm seeing. I'd also not do much to his bars other than to cut away any folded over bar...they don't look that bad and leaving them will help support him. He'd be a good candidate for boots and a wedge pad insert under his frogs also to help get him landing heel first as quickly as possible.

      Is this a horse you did? Unfortunately, I've seen a few as bad as him and one worse. The worse one I trimmed had much more contracted heels that that...his were about an inch apart, flat thin soles and worse flaring.

      Comment

      • Original Poster

        #4
        I pulled his shoes off yesterday. I only had a second to take "before" pics and will try to do some "afters" next week.

        DB, I hope you didn't think I did that to that poor horse!

        FWIW, I pulled his toe back as far as I could, rolled all the edges and backed away slowly, holding my breath. I did not touch his heels, which of course are not really heels at all.

        He is 80% sounder today.
        "Kindness is free" ~ Eurofoal
        ---
        The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by EqTrainer View Post
          DB, I hope you didn't think I did that to that poor horse!
          Oh No! I knew you didn't shoe him like that! I just wondered if you trimmed him after his shoes were pulled? Sounds like we are on the same wavelength...be conservative and get those toes back!

          So glad to hear he's feeling better too! :-)

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by EqTrainer View Post
            I did not touch his heels, which of course are not really heels at all.
            Are his heels underrun or crushed? It's hard for me to tell on my computer screen. If so, what's the best course of action? I trimmed my horse's back a bit at a time and kept up on them and it worked nicely. I don't have a good understanding of the feathering concept... anyone care to elaborate?

            Glad to hear he's on the mend... can't wait to see the after pics

            Comment

            • Original Poster

              #7
              His heels are...

              it's beyond crushed or underrun, although I suppose those are proper terms to use. The tubules have been so leveraged/misaligned that they are running completely horizontal at this point. The bottom of them are worn off where the pads were. So he effectively has no heels at all. There is actually nothing at all to rasp off in the heel area.

              I think in about 3 inches of growth, I will find a heel buttress

              Personally, when I deal with a horse like this I pick - toes or heels. In his case, I figured it was the toes that had to go. Definately a conservative approach, my goal is to get him comfortable and keep him that way during this transition.

              My gut feeling is that he is going to be just fine
              "Kindness is free" ~ Eurofoal
              ---
              The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances.

              Comment

              • Original Poster

                #8
                Bumping for JB and Lookout!
                "Kindness is free" ~ Eurofoal
                ---
                The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances.

                Comment


                • #9
                  I thought toes myself.

                  This is fun, Eqtrainer... I hope other experienced hoof people post more pics with "what would you do" questions.

                  Poor horse, BTW.
                  SportHorseRiders.com
                  Taco Blog
                  *T3DE 2010 Pact*

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Oh drats, I was trying to sneak away from this one

                    I would probably start at the toes and back them up with a vertical cut to the edge of the sole (screw it if some don't like the look of that cut ) I'd take the smoother side of the rasp and see what I could find in the way of a heel buttress. Every couple of days I'd take 2-3 light swipes on the heels to keep ANY new growth from growing forward.

                    I'd make sure every bit of outer wall was in non-contact with the ground. I can't see the pics now (why don't thumbnails stay visible when typing a new reply? ) but if I saw any major WL stretching behind the toe quarters, I'd take it back to the sole. Leaving it has to hurt and sure isn't helping.

                    So, short answer - toes first
                    ______________________________
                    The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances. - ET

                    Comment

                    • Original Poster

                      #11
                      Oh JB, you are so optimistic.. WHAT white line? None to speak of. I guess that means it's stretched

                      Here is the good news: his owner is on board with these changes and I just checked on him a minute ago.. and he feels good.

                      Now, friends... besides the Borax soak, any new and fabulous thrush and fungus killing techniques? I can't get a boot on and I don't think he'll let me bag his feet so Cleantrax is out. Plus, I have found that until the hoof form improves, there is no point in doing that. I save it for the final hurrah!
                      "Kindness is free" ~ Eurofoal
                      ---
                      The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        EQ:

                        Yeah for you

                        I would bring the toes back into the WL and also would nipper out those bars and lower the heel a touch.

                        It looks like you have a lot of exfoliating sole, so that is why I'm saying you could do this.

                        You don't want the heels level with the frog as it (frog) and the Digital Cushion are not up to handling that load yet.

                        Between those too I think within 2 weeks you'll have major improvements.

                        I just Love that someone thought a wedge was necessary, what for the heels that won't grow... snort. Sheesh.

                        I wish I could say this is an unusual sight.

                        Yeah for you Eq.

                        Regards,

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by EqTrainer View Post
                          Now, friends... besides the Borax soak, any new and fabulous thrush and fungus killing techniques? I can't get a boot on and I don't think he'll let me bag his feet so Cleantrax is out. Plus, I have found that until the hoof form improves, there is no point in doing that. I save it for the final hurrah!
                          I'm assuming you know about the Pete's Goo? 1/2 and 1/2 antibiotic ointment and athlete's foot cream?

                          When do we get to see the after photos? Will you post again in 2 weeks?
                          SportHorseRiders.com
                          Taco Blog
                          *T3DE 2010 Pact*

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by CookiePony View Post
                            Will you post again in 2 weeks?
                            I know where she lives, I'll go take pictures if she doesn't
                            ______________________________
                            The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances. - ET

                            Comment

                            • Original Poster

                              #15
                              Originally posted by CookiePony View Post
                              I'm assuming you know about the Pete's Goo? 1/2 and 1/2 antibiotic ointment and athlete's foot cream?

                              When do we get to see the after photos? Will you post again in 2 weeks?

                              Yup on the first, but I usually treat one or the other at a time. Why? I don't KNOW. Doh! I will mix up a batch tomorrow.. AFTER the Borox soak (I do love my Borax, now). Do you pack in it w/cotton and then wrap or just pack it?

                              I will try to do after photos in two weeks. He is living in the pea gravel run-in so I expect A LOT of sole exfoliation, which will help me decide where to go and how quickly to go there. I am really quite pleasantly surprised at how much better he feels, every hour. He is a good egg
                              "Kindness is free" ~ Eurofoal
                              ---
                              The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances.

                              Comment

                              • Original Poster

                                #16
                                Originally posted by JB View Post
                                I know where she lives, I'll go take pictures if she doesn't
                                YOU are a very naughty girl! It's that sassy haircut, I just know it is
                                "Kindness is free" ~ Eurofoal
                                ---
                                The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances.

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Originally posted by EqTrainer View Post
                                  Now, friends... besides the Borax soak, any new and fabulous thrush and fungus killing techniques?
                                  One product: Solution 4 Feet from www.emeraldvalleyequine.com -- Probably feed some Formula 4 Feet too to help internally.

                                  Oh and I concur: toes first. Oy vey
                                  <>< Sorrow Looks Back. Worry Looks Around. Faith Looks Up! -- Being negative only makes a difficult journey more difficult. You may be given a cactus, but you don't have to sit on it.

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    The real question is what kind of shoes was he wearing before you pulled the shoes and how often was he shod ? It appears in your picture he was long overdue for shoeing.
                                    If you trim too much when you first pull his shoes, he will be really sore. We never trim at all when we first pull the shoes.
                                    Hot Venice Turpintine ( heat an open can on a coffee maker ) on the sole - use a cheap paint brush to apply, every couple days for a week.
                                    Then, at the same time as the Venice, let his feet crack back on their own for a few days.
                                    Sounds bad but it works !
                                    Then have the farrier come and trim.
                                    I would never consider trimming too much myself - if your farrier isn't doing a good enough job - Get a new Farrier - I do not think this is a DYIY Job.

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      Having done a few such myself, I would do a little at a time but at frequent intervals. They do look really bad but there is a good foot under there that will appear rather quickly as soon as some correct trimming is done. It actually looks like someone tried to do something about the runaway toes about two trimmings ago because the angle is better at the top (at the new growth), plus the farrier tried shortening the toe by chopping it across, afraid to do more. Definitely more can be done on the toe, and some of the flaring too. I don't think the heels look that horrible; on the white foot (LF?) the inside heel (top of picture) should be brought back to the back of the frog, and any other ones too that aren't apparent on the pictures because of all the exfoliating sole. Just start with a general cleanup and work from there. Definitely would not do anything with any kinds of pads that would force the angles, into the opposite direction of what they've been doing; just let things progress along on their own and not force any kind of movement for now.
                                      Last edited by Lookout; Jan. 20, 2008, 11:04 AM.
                                      Visit my barefoot blog:
                                      http://barefoothoofcare.wordpress.com/
                                      "I don't mean to brag, I don't mean to boast, but I'm intercontinental when I eat French toast" ~ Beastie Boys

                                      Comment

                                      • Original Poster

                                        #20
                                        Originally posted by Triplicate View Post
                                        The real question is what kind of shoes was he wearing before you pulled the shoes and how often was he shod ? It appears in your picture he was long overdue for shoeing.
                                        If you trim too much when you first pull his shoes, he will be really sore. We never trim at all when we first pull the shoes.
                                        Hot Venice Turpintine ( heat an open can on a coffee maker ) on the sole - use a cheap paint brush to apply, every couple days for a week.
                                        Then, at the same time as the Venice, let his feet crack back on their own for a few days.
                                        Sounds bad but it works !
                                        Then have the farrier come and trim.
                                        I would never consider trimming too much myself - if your farrier isn't doing a good enough job - Get a new Farrier - I do not think this is a DYIY Job.


                                        The horse was wearing NB shoes and a three degree wedge pad.

                                        A farrier DID this to him. Those shoes were put on three weeks ago.

                                        It was not MY farrier. MY farrier would never put shoes on a horse whose feet were in this bad of condition. He would refer them to the barefoot trimmer.. that's me

                                        So I guess it DYIY or nothing

                                        FWIW, his owner had tried all the available farriers in her area and this is what the horse got. If I can't do better than that, it would have to be because I have just had my arm amputated and couldn't hold a rasp.
                                        "Kindness is free" ~ Eurofoal
                                        ---
                                        The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances.

                                        Comment

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