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What is the deal with Vegetable Oil

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    Originally posted by Mouse&Bay View Post
    JB, your patience is exemplary in this thread.

    As they say, you can lead a horse to water but you can’t make it drink.

    Or you can lead a human to knowledge, but you can't make them think.

    ~~Some days are a total waste of makeup.~~

    Comment

      Original Poster

      Originally posted by JB View Post




      Are you saying PCPS ARE generally experts in nutrition?




      I can tell you 100% that my PCP sent me to a sleep specialist for sleep problems. She didn't dare try to address them beyond some very basis (aka PCP-type) "have you tried these things".




      so again - some of your posts recently sound like you have medical training of some sort. Do you? You've certainly questioned some of us, and dismissed some of us for lack of "expert" training. What about you?



      PCP’s aren’t the reigning experts when it really comes down to human nutrition either. However there is a baseline expectation and a support (referral) network. And it becomes more nuanced depending on the issue. However, depending on the context, dietary fat can indeed be “bad” even without a formal diagnosis. Such advice is not automatically incorrect. I would be very surprised to hear a physician say all dietary fat is bad as a blanket statement, though.




      There are many types of experts in addition to practicing medical professionals. MD’s in PRACTICE are just the ones people tend to think of first. Not sure why. For example, just the other day someone called you out on a supposed vet degree.




      The “experts” in the context used earlier in this thread refer to those doing research and therefore keep up with and have access to the latest. Or they are in school, immersed in the latest. Generally these are the only ones who can say “there is no research backing up....” and have it mean something. Otherwise, it doesn’t.




      Now the reality is experts rarely use such finite wording regardless, because they understand the nuances of their fields.




      I have told you as much about myself as I will be telling you. I am not in the practice of flashing nor name dropping. Thanks.




      This thread started out with a very basic question. I can’t say I am not surprised it wasn’t answered to my satisfaction. Questions often aren’t. It evolved into some topics I find quite interesting, and ended up being informative nonetheless.
      Originally posted by Equkelly;n10679061

      Jeez now I know why COTH has a reputation of being a bunch of overaged mean girls.

      Comment


        I believe you likely have a history with this one JB. So much gobblygook above. Common denominator is poking you. *yawn*

        Comment


          Originally posted by Fellbutbackup View Post

          PCP’s aren’t the reigning experts when it really comes down to human nutrition either.
          Do you actually even read what I write? That's exactly what I said

          However there is a baseline expectation and a support (referral) network. And it becomes more nuanced depending on the issue. However, depending on the context, dietary fat can indeed be “bad” even without a formal diagnosis. Such advice is not automatically incorrect. I would be very surprised to hear a physician say all dietary fat is bad as a blanket statement, though.
          Again - Read. What. I. Wrote. Yes, there are absolutely PCPs out there who subscribe to 30 year old nutritional research that said dietary fat was bad for our health.

          There are many types of experts in addition to practicing medical professionals. MD’s in PRACTICE are just the ones people tend to think of first. Not sure why.
          And that has to do with....what exacly?

          For example, just the other day someone called you out on a supposed vet degree.
          You really need to keep your posters straight. Or stop making stuff up

          Nobody has "called me out" because I have never, not in all the years here, claimed to have any degree, never implied I did. Yes, several people have asked if I am a vet, or a nutritionist, and I never hide the fact that I'm not. I have told people I do not have formal education in any veterinary or nutritional field. I've never said otherwise, never hid that.

          The “experts” in the context used earlier in this thread refer to those doing research and therefore keep up with and have access to the latest. Or they are in school, immersed in the latest. Generally these are the only ones who can say “there is no research backing up....” and have it mean something. Otherwise, it doesn’t.
          So which is is? Some has to be a professional to be believed, or they don't? If I've spent the last almost 20 years researching and keeping up with some of the latest and greatest on equine nutrition and parasite management, doesn't that make me an expert by your definition?

          Now the reality is experts rarely use such finite wording regardless, because they understand the nuances of their fields.
          I don't even know what you're talking about

          I have told you as much about myself as I will be telling you. I am not in the practice of flashing nor name dropping. Thanks.
          So, you're ok with asking what degree others have, you're ok with making up that I was "called you out on a supposed vet degree", but are 100% unwilling to answer a really simple question. I don't care if you are or aren't a medical student, or someone with a medical degree, I don't care if it's biology or chemistry or neuroscience or physics or whatever else. I merely observed that some of your latest posts have a science-y feel to is, and found that really curious given your (apparent) inability to do your own research, or read some of the publications presented to you in a futile attempt to answer your very, very confusing questions.

          I couldn't care less, but if you're not willing to answer a simple question, you have no right to ask it of others.

          This thread started out with a very basic question.
          No, actually, it didn't. Maybe to you it seemed simple, but as you should have clearly figured out early on, exactly no one really understood what you were after.

          I can’t say I am not surprised it wasn’t answered to my satisfaction. Questions often aren’t. It evolved into some topics I find quite interesting, and ended up being informative nonetheless.
          I'm not surprised either, since the question was so "can you guess what's behind my back" without any clue as to context or any other tidbits of information you dangled over our heads (whatever you heard and its context from your "trusted source")

          I'm out. I have no formal education in anything you seem interested in, so I'm not playing your game any more.

          Originally posted by ThreeWishes View Post
          I believe you likely have a history with this one JB. So much gobblygook above. Common denominator is poking you. *yawn*
          Trust me, you're not the only one wondering
          ______________________________
          The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances. - ET

          Comment

            Original Poster

            Originally posted by JB View Post
            So, you're ok with asking what degree others have, you're ok with making up that I was "called you out on a supposed vet degree", but are 100% unwilling to answer a really simple question. I don't care if you are or aren't a medical student, or someone with a medical degree, I don't care if it's biology or chemistry or neuroscience or physics or whatever else. I merely observed that some of your latest posts have a science-y feel to is, and found that really curious given your (apparent) inability to do your own research, or read some of the publications presented to you in a futile attempt to answer your very, very confusing questions.

            I couldn't care less, but if you're not willing to answer a simple question, you have no right to ask it.
            You should recheck some premises.

            The person in question stated she had an MS. What I asked was what year she received it. For the same reasons that you have stated above.

            Additionally, someone did call you out on the supposed vet degree. Just the other day in the thread in my signature. If you choose to interpret my mentioning the situation as accusing you of something, that is certainly a choice.

            This is a public forum. There should be no surprises about the lack of information shared.
            Originally posted by Equkelly;n10679061

            Jeez now I know why COTH has a reputation of being a bunch of overaged mean girls.

            Comment


              Originally posted by Fellbutbackup View Post
              Additionally, someone did call you out on the supposed vet degree. Just the other day in the thread in my signature.
              I'll wait for you to quote the comment. Nobody could call me out for something I didn't imply, let alone outright lie about. Anyone who's known me here for any reasonable length of time knows I freely admit I don't have any degree in science, veterinary or otherwise.

              Have people asked me if I do have one? Absolutely. And every time I tell them I don't. 100%.
              ______________________________
              The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances. - ET

              Comment


                Sea Lioning at its finest JB. Google it. You’re wasting your valuable time with a troll.

                Comment


                  Ooo, new term, I've never heard that before! Seems about right though
                  ______________________________
                  The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances. - ET

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by ThreeWishes View Post
                    Sea Lioning at its finest JB. Google it. You’re wasting your valuable time with a troll.
                    Wow! Learn something new every day

                    Comment

                      Original Poster

                      [QUOTE=JB;n10682298]

                      I'll wait for you to quote the comment. Nobody could call me out for something I didn't imply, let alone outright lie about. Anyone who's known me here for any reasonable length of time knows I freely admit I don't have any degree in science, veterinary or otherwise.

                      Have people asked me if I do have one? Absolutely. And every time I tell them I don't. 100%.

                      [/
                      Originally posted by Equkelly View Post
                      2) Also where did you go to vet school? You didn’t say but surely it must be a really really good one if you’re able to make such claims so I’m super curious.
                      Again. Your interpretation. Your choice.
                      Originally posted by Equkelly;n10679061

                      Jeez now I know why COTH has a reputation of being a bunch of overaged mean girls.

                      Comment


                        Equkelly to me:
                        2) Also where did you go to vet school? You didn’t say but surely it must be a really really good one if you’re able to make such claims so I’m super curious.

                        Originally posted by Fellbutbackup View Post


                        Again. Your interpretation. Your choice.
                        That's hysterical!

                        Here's my comment which prompted that one:

                        "Not knowing what kind of enteritis she had, many forms are caused by an infection. You can't prevent that in its entirety. Most issues of acute enteritis have nothing to do with management. Hopefully your vet has educated you on what kind of enteritis exactly, so you can be researching down the right rabbit hole.

                        It's HIGHLY unlikely that this product would have prevented this in the first place."

                        Just so we're all on the same page That poster was miffed that she couldn't get colic insurance (right after enteritis) even if she paid full price for a product she'd never used, which is supposed to be a great gut support product.

                        Your definition of "called out" is certainly interesting
                        ______________________________
                        The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances. - ET

                        Comment

                          Original Poster

                          Originally posted by JB View Post
                          Equkelly to me:
                          2) Also where did you go to vet school? You didn’t say but surely it must be a really really good one if you’re able to make such claims so I’m super curious.



                          That's hysterical!

                          Here's my comment which prompted that one:

                          "Not knowing what kind of enteritis she had, many forms are caused by an infection. You can't prevent that in its entirety. Most issues of acute enteritis have nothing to do with management. Hopefully your vet has educated you on what kind of enteritis exactly, so you can be researching down the right rabbit hole.

                          It's HIGHLY unlikely that this product would have prevented this in the first place."

                          Just so we're all on the same page That poster was miffed that she couldn't get colic insurance (right after enteritis) even if she paid full price for a product she'd never used, which is supposed to be a great gut support product.

                          Your definition of "called out" is certainly interesting
                          It was quite the banal reaction. Calling out for someone’s medical degree on a forum generally is.
                          Originally posted by Equkelly;n10679061

                          Jeez now I know why COTH has a reputation of being a bunch of overaged mean girls.

                          Comment


                            Lol. Someone has a crush on JB. Cute.

                            Comment


                              Originally posted by Fellbutbackup View Post

                              That is actually a far more complicated question than you as the asker might intend.

                              Research is a loosely used word many varying definitions. To most, “research” means a google search. Most would automatically click on the wikipedia page. And then call it a day. But the limitation to doing that is that there is a cap on it. This kind of “research” brings up only popular knowledge, whether it is right or wrong.

                              But the formal definition involves the pertinent databases and asking experts. Preferably first hand experts. I happen to have access to some of those databases. The average person would not. There was no reason for you to believe prior to this that had any more access than the average.

                              However, that still leaves asking experts. The reason we do this is that experts have at hand knowledge perhaps even without looking it up. And if not, an efficient way of finding it. Experts also keep up with the nuances of the field, and especially in the field of nutrition, may have knowledge that would be common for them but yet not -popular-, in this sense meaning not established. In human nutrition new info can take a decade to establish, often with much bemoaning about lack of research. Equine nutrition I am seeing maybe doubles it as it can trickle down from small animal research meant for humans. Regardless, the “research” is always changing.

                              Therefore consulting experts, or those who have kept up to date, is valuable research.

                              In this thread, I count four people with expertise in this topic or related topics.

                              I explain this because you felt the need to ask. Does this make sense to you?
                              If you wanted an experts opinion you could have asked your vet for a referral to an equine nutritionist and saved us all a headache. It really was a simple yes or no question and from your response I’m going to go with no.

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by JB View Post
                                Do you actually even read what I write? That's exactly what I said

                                I'm not surprised either, since the question was so "can you guess what's behind my back" without any clue as to context or any other tidbits of information you dangled over our heads (whatever you heard and its context from your "trusted source")

                                I'm out. I have no formal education in anything you seem interested in, so I'm not playing your game any more.
                                Speaking of games and behind my backs, this thread reminds me of the weird off base casino Clark Griswold's brother in law took him to in Vegas Vacation...where is the poster asking "how many fingers am I holding up behind my back?"!!!! Lololol

                                Comment


                                  Originally posted by Fellbutbackup View Post

                                  This is a public forum. There should be no surprises about the lack of information shared.
                                  Feel free to leave if you find the responses here insufficient.

                                  I'm sure there must be some *special* forum where only smart people can post.

                                  Comment


                                    Originally posted by CanteringCarrot View Post
                                    Lol. Someone has a crush on JB. Cute.
                                    I have a suspicion

                                    I should have remembered this thread, but sadly, I didn't connect the dots. Such a predictable pattern emerging, either being purposefully obtuse, or doing it simply to stir the pot. Sound familiar?
                                    https://www.chronofhorse.com/forum/f...ral-supplement

                                    And I KNEW things were starting to sound all "educated" and stuff here:

                                    Originally posted by Fellbutbackup View Post
                                    Further I know professionally that MgO is a digestive irritant in humans.


                                    ______________________________
                                    The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances. - ET

                                    Comment


                                      Originally posted by Montanas_Girl View Post

                                      To my knowledge, there has not yet been identified a toxic threshold for Vitamin E in horses (assuming that's what you're asking).
                                      I believe the adverse effects of excessive supplementation in horses are theoretical at this point, but interference with drug metabolism via the cytochrome P450 system, issues with coagulation, and demineralization of bone would be the likely suspects, based on extrapolation from human data.
                                      "It's like a Russian nesting doll of train wrecks."--CaitlinandTheBay

                                      ...just settin' on the Group W bench.

                                      Comment


                                        Originally posted by Fellbutbackup View Post


                                        There are many types of experts in addition to practicing medical professionals. MD’s in PRACTICE are just the ones people tend to think of first. Not sure why. For example, just the other day someone called you out on a supposed vet degree.
                                        I have never seen JB claim any sort of medical degree, veterinary or otherwise.
                                        However, she does know a damned sight more about equine nutrition than the average bear, and is willing to learn more.
                                        She is also quite willing to engage in civilized discussion with others.

                                        I have told you as much about myself as I will be telling you. I am not in the practice of flashing nor name dropping. Thanks.
                                        And your credibility on any given subject will be judged accordingly. Thanks.




                                        "It's like a Russian nesting doll of train wrecks."--CaitlinandTheBay

                                        ...just settin' on the Group W bench.

                                        Comment


                                          I'm getting major Florida vibes here..... like say, maybe I want to go to PalmBeach?
                                          I was really curious how a thread about feeding oil could be this long

                                          Oh and throwing in my guess of why people don't feed oil will be my own reason of -it goes rancid in the summer and it makes gross gel-glop in the winter. Highly scientific, I know.
                                          Wouldst thou like the taste of butter ? A pretty dress? Wouldst thou like to live deliciously?

                                          Comment

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