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    Originally posted by Fellbutbackup View Post

    I am a brand new member. My expectations were not met...

    I expected a higher level of thought. One involving discussion. Not regurgitation from Horseu.com and an ancient textbook, with interpretations that do not show correct understanding.
    This is, at the end of the day, an open (and relatively anonymous) Internet forum. Some very knowledgeable and gracious (looking at you, @JB) members have attempted to decipher the information you offered to provide guidance.

    If you want a “higher level of thought”, consult PubMed, other vet journals, your local equine vet school, etc. If you’re so inexplicably dissatisfied with the information you’re getting here, look elsewhere. It’s that simple.

    Comment


      Originally posted by Amy3996 View Post
      If you want a “higher level of thought”, consult PubMed, other vet journals, your local equine vet school, etc. If you’re so inexplicably dissatisfied with the information you’re getting here, look elsewhere. It’s that simple.
      What's so curious is that the data shared from those sources "goes against [her] training." Sooooo the OP is anti science...? Man, there's just not much anyone can do with that.

      Comment


        We have had a couple new(old) posters vague posting about stuff and then posting gotcha posts. Or trying.

        Comment

          Original Poster

          Originally posted by JB View Post

          I never said you made me feel stupid

          You don't agree with the leading research on horses.

          Awesome. Why are you on this board?

          Maybe you would like to enlighten us as to what you learned that disagrees with this special training in people, this special training you're so secretive about, yet seem to have a fascination of others' training.

          You know horses aren't people, right?

          Science doesn't care whether you agree or not. Your medical training in the human field helps understand terms and basic biological concepts across species, but it *does not* mean you can extrapolate details from people to horses. Surely there was a concept you were taught?

          Do you know why dogs and horses get different doses of firocoxib?
          We strongly disagree on the concept of “leading research.” Referencing a 10-20 year old textbook is using extremely outdated research. For some concepts even three-five years is pushing it. Again, I gave you the benefit of the doubt, but in the end, after consulting horse studies, only ended up confirming you were wrong multiple times.

          That is OK. I learned quite a bit in that journey.

          However, you have continued to repeatedly claim your references are the most up to date. When I saw that you did so initially, that I was surprised and disappointed. You are still claiming cutting edge, so I am less surprised, and disappointed.

          FYI: You should be aware that in general, going by research that is 10-20 years old is still probably helpful for the majority in a limited capacity, and most likely will not HURT. There are some exceptions there, but for this context I am seeing how it can be satisfactory. But you should be aware that it is not optimal, not guaranteed to be helpful, and absolutely should not be called “leading research.” As such, we also disagree on what you are referencing up there as “science.”
          Originally posted by Equkelly;n10679061

          Jeez now I know why COTH has a reputation of being a bunch of overaged mean girls.

          Comment


            Trying for the THIRD time to get something to stop going to the Unapproved hell:

            Originally posted by Fellbutbackup View Post

            We strongly disagree on the concept of “leading research.” Referencing a 10-20 year old textbook is using extremely outdated research. For some concepts even three-five years is pushing it. Again, I gave you the benefit of the doubt, but in the end, after consulting horse studies, only ended up confirming you were wrong multiple times.

            That is OK. I learned quite a bit in that journey.

            However, you have continued to repeatedly claim your references are the most up to date. When I saw that you did so initially, that I was surprised and disappointed. You are still claiming cutting edge, so I am less surprised, and disappointed.
            LMAO! I never claimed cutting edge.

            Several times I made a very specific point to say these are the latest.

            And FINALLY, you're right, yes, I absolutely DID claim my "references are the most up to date."

            Maybe you're confusing "latest" with "new"
            ______________________________
            The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances. - ET

            Comment


              Part 2:

              Originally posted by Fellbutbackup View Post

              FYI: You should be aware that in general, going by research that is 10-20 years old is still probably helpful for the majority in a limited capacity, and most likely will not HURT. There are some exceptions there, but for this context I am seeing how it can be satisfactory. But you should be aware that it is not optimal, not guaranteed to be helpful, and absolutely should not be called “leading research.” As such, we also disagree on what you are referencing up there as “science.”
              Never said it was optimal.
              Always said it was the best we had.

              Just because something is 10 years old doesn't automatically mean the science has change.

              Maybe you should read this thread again.

              Maybe your beef should be taken up with the NRC guys. I'm sure they'd be SO grateful for your help Maybe you can start a funding program to get new research done on these things you're just convinced are no longer valid. I know a huge number of people would be very thankful to have newer, or even some at all, studies done on certain things in horses.
              ______________________________
              The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances. - ET

              Comment


                JB is really worth arguing someone who can’t wrap their head around a supplement vs a ration balancer? I mean that is the level we are dealing with.

                Comment


                  Fellbutbackup I still have no idea whether you think horses should be fed Vegetable oil or not.

                  For your attitude and the way you treat people I will not be changing to giving it even if you say to.

                  You sound like someone who is stuck in academia and have no street smarts at all.
                  Last edited by SuzieQNutter; Jul. 6, 2020, 04:59 PM.
                  It is better to ride 5 minutes a day than it is to ride 35 minutes on a Sunday.

                  Comment


                    It's abundantly clear that there are no studies in support of what our OP is claiming...so my vote is woo. An animal psychic told her the horse had "issues" with oil and she used muscle testing to come up with the "research" she's citing here.

                    Comment


                      The OP apparently has access to databases which are simultaneously unavailable to the Great Unwashed, yet cutting edge and with a high impact factor.
                      "It's like a Russian nesting doll of train wrecks."--CaitlinandTheBay

                      ...just settin' on the Group W bench.

                      Comment


                        The irony is the OP is knocking the use of 10-20 year old nutrition research when the reality is that’s about the pace at which any major advances happen in equine nutrition. This isn’t a field where there is a lot of continuous, cutting edge research because there isn’t that much funding. If she doesn’t believe this to be true, she can confirm my claim with the educated equine nutrition researcher who already addressed her question.

                        I also find it bizarre that one would turn to the horse care forum on the website of a magazine about horse shows in search of academic conversation. Surely one who possesses a terminal degree in medicine would realize there are better places to seek out conversations that exclude the opinions of lowly peons.
                        Don't fall for a girl who fell for a horse just to be number two in her world... ~EFO

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by Texarkana View Post
                          The irony is the OP is knocking the use of 10-20 year old nutrition research when the reality is that’s about the pace at which any major advances happen in equine nutrition. This isn’t a field where there is a lot of continuous, cutting edge research because there isn’t that much funding. If she doesn’t believe this to be true, she can confirm my claim with the educated equine nutrition researcher who already addressed her question.

                          I also find it bizarre that one would turn to the horse care forum on the website of a magazine about horse shows in search of academic conversation. Surely one who possesses a terminal degree in medicine would realize there are better places to seek out conversations that exclude the opinions of lowly peons.
                          Never mind one would think with all her expertise she’d be chiming in on this forum. Instead she’s asking how tall boots are supposed to break in. I think it’s safe to say it’s best to not take her seriously. While she may have expertise in whatever subject she’s in, she’s very ignorant when it comes to all things horses.

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by TheMoo View Post

                            Never mind one would think with all her expertise she’d be chiming in on this forum. Instead she’s asking how tall boots are supposed to break in. I think it’s safe to say it’s best to not take her seriously. While she may have expertise in whatever subject she’s in, she’s very ignorant when it comes to all things horses.
                            Yes but horse sense is actually another name for common sense.
                            It is better to ride 5 minutes a day than it is to ride 35 minutes on a Sunday.

                            Comment


                              Originally posted by TheMoo View Post

                              Never mind one would think with all her expertise she’d be chiming in on this forum. Instead she’s asking how tall boots are supposed to break in. I think it’s safe to say it’s best to not take her seriously. While she may have expertise in whatever subject she’s in, she’s very ignorant when it comes to all things horses.
                              Maybe one could try softening boots with .... vegetable oil.

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by Scribbler View Post

                                Maybe one could try softening boots with .... vegetable oil.
                                Boyle Heights Kid 1998 16.1h OTTB Dark Bay Gelding
                                Quiet Miracle 2010 16.1h OTTB Bay Gelding
                                "Once you go off track, you never go back!"

                                Comment


                                  Originally posted by Scribbler View Post

                                  Maybe one could try softening boots with .... vegetable oil.

                                  Comment


                                    Originally posted by Scribbler View Post

                                    Maybe one could try softening boots with .... vegetable oil.
                                    That's it, we can all go home, Scribbler has won the internet today 😂😂😂

                                    Comment


                                      Originally posted by Simkie View Post

                                      That's it, we can all go home, Scribbler has won the internet today 😂😂😂
                                      I will add that my saddle guy said use olive oil not vegetable oil, on my saddles, but NOT on the girth straps he had put on.
                                      It is better to ride 5 minutes a day than it is to ride 35 minutes on a Sunday.

                                      Comment

                                        Original Poster

                                        Originally posted by JB View Post
                                        Trying for the THIRD time to get something to stop going to the Unapproved hell:


                                        LMAO! I never claimed cutting edge.

                                        Several times I made a very specific point to say these are the latest.

                                        And FINALLY, you're right, yes, I absolutely DID claim my "references are the most up to date."

                                        Maybe you're confusing "latest" with "new"
                                        I won a bet with myself. New saddle pad ordered.

                                        On another note, given the info you are sharing is already 20 years old (actually based on citation sometimes 30 years old), it will be interesting to see what this forum is saying in another 10-20 years.

                                        The info you have thus far presented is neither “latest”, nor “new.” The 20 year old text you link presents outdated info, suggests beginnings of updated info, and offers to sell you the latest text. The version you use as a source is informative historically, but certainly not current nor “latest” nor “new.”

                                        The suggestion that horse nutrition has not changed in 30 years is incorrect.

                                        It will be interesting to see how things change here, if they do.

                                        Something else curious is the suggestion that this place might be a main or even sole source of information for some. Worrisome, but perhaps unsurprising.
                                        Originally posted by Equkelly;n10679061

                                        Jeez now I know why COTH has a reputation of being a bunch of overaged mean girls.

                                        Comment


                                          Originally posted by Fellbutbackup View Post

                                          I won a bet with myself. New saddle pad ordered.

                                          On another note, given the info you are sharing is already 20 years old (actually based on citation sometimes 30 years old), it will be interesting to see what this forum is saying in another 10-20 years.

                                          The info you have thus far presented is neither “latest”, nor “new.” The 20 year old text you link presents outdated info, suggests beginnings of updated info, and offers to sell you the latest text. The version you use as a source is informative historically, but certainly not current nor “latest” nor “new.”

                                          The suggestion that horse nutrition has not changed in 30 years is incorrect.

                                          It will be interesting to see how things change here, if they do.

                                          Something else curious is the suggestion that this place might be a main or even sole source of information for some. Worrisome, but perhaps unsurprising.
                                          What?

                                          Do you have later and/or greater sources than JB? If so, perhaps you could share them to enlighten us plebs that are living in the dark.

                                          Comment

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