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*small update* New farrier and now a lame horse, what to do now?

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  • #21
    It sounds like your horse is newer to you (owned under a year)?

    It sounds like your new farrier may have been a bit agressive but he did all the right things of coming back to look, request x-rays and did something to make your horse more comfortable. Any farrier worth using again should do exactly what yours did. I'm not surprised your horse isn't sound after the new shoe and heel floated. There is most likely some inflammation that needs time to go down

    Honestly my current horse had pretty bad feet coming off the track. The first month or so he was sound. Once I pulled his shoes he started getting abscesses and his toes started slowly falling apart. It took changing farriers, changing his diet, adding biotin to his diet and giving his feet time to grow before I saw major changes. He has great feet now but getting there was a battle.

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    • Original Poster

      #22
      Scribbler yes newer horse. I bought him in November, did a trial in October. Yes been shod for a 4 or 5 months though. He was up with a trainer (an hour away) so the first two cycles were with a farrier that the trainer used. Not able to use him now.

      When I bought him, he was at 12 or 13 weeks, obliviously very long. He came from a herd of 30 horses so I don't think the cycles were very regular.

      Honestly when I bought him I was suspect of him having a clubby foot. During the PPE (not my regular vet because of distance) I asked about it and they told me no, it was the good foot, the other foot was more underrun and kind of an optical illusion. No x-rays were taken. Arg.

      And yes horse was sound before but a bit weak in stifles which was why my regular vet is coming on Wednesday.

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      • Original Poster

        #23
        punchy yeah farrier changes are tough. I actually got this one's number from my vet...

        But yeah I think having a few others in mind if things don't improve might be a good idea. He's a younger farrier, maybe my horse needs a really experienced one at the point.

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        • Original Poster

          #24
          horseshorseshorseshorses yeah he's definitely very nice to deal with. So hopefully it's nothing major and we can get him sound and then farrier will be more prepared to work with him on the future.

          That he's willing to work with my vet, especially right now, is definitely a blessing. I've just never dealt with this before. Worst I ever had was a close nail.

          And the fact that I was suspect of a club foot, told by vets that it wasn't and now having issues with my regular vet saying, well it's a clubby foot is just adding to my stress. That's not the farrier's fault though. Maybe the other farrier had been started all of this too. Who knows.

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          • #25
            It sounds like there was more going on than just an overdue trim wheen you bought him. A horse can go 12 weeks between trims and then trim up fine. It sounds like maybe you were right that there was a high-low asymmetry in his from feet. In the couple of cases I've seen that can make the lower foot pancake and run under. In some cases it might not even be useful to call it a club foot because both front feet have angles that are within normal parameters but they are different from each other.

            Which foot is giving you problems, the steep or the low angle hoof?



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            • Original Poster

              #26
              Scribbler yeah unfortunately I think you are right.... I do think this horse had very random trimmings and not tip top care which doesn't help though.

              It's the more steep one that's causing problems or that he's sore on right now. I tried to upload photos but it says the photo is too big.

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              • #27
                I wouldn’t be in too big a hurry to change farriers just now. Always good to have a plan B of course. But this one cane right back and actually stated he might have taken off a bit to much on a heel? Good lord, most of them never admit to being at fault, on the contrary, most it’s never their mistake and you don’t question them.

                No, this guy sounds like he’s honest, smart and actually understands the basic nature of the problem. The fact that he WANTS to be there for the vet appointment and discuss the x rays and skeletal angles with the vet is priceless...I’d offer to pay him for the consult if he hasn’t brought that up.

                You will find the very best horse service providers never say never, never say always and never act like they know it all. The best ones never stop learning and know you can’t learn if you think you know it all and never miss an opportunity to learn more and broaden their knowledge base. Sounds like he has some customer service skills as well. Like I said, refreshing.

                Little skepticism is always in order as is a plan B. But I’d wait and see how the vet appointment goes and how he wants to proceed. Patience. Give it a chance, Eyes and ears open but don’t rush into anything.
                When opportunity knocks it's wearing overalls and looks like work.

                The horse world. Two people. Three opinions.

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                • Original Poster

                  #28
                  findeight he definitely is a good guy and I agree, the lack of a major ego (so common with farriers) is a plus. He won't be there for the vet consult, but my vet will be calling him and sending him x-rays. And yes if he needs to come back out to make adjustments I definitely will pay him something for his time and willingness to come multiple times.

                  Fingers crossed that we can get the all figured out. I'm definitely nervous but I think that's some PTSD from my NQR young horse before this guy.

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                  • Original Poster

                    #29
                    Looked slightly better today I thought. So that makes me feel better!

                    Comment


                    • #30
                      Just a small anecdote, I had a tb who had pretty decent feet, good solid farrier who trimmed on a regular basis, was always barefoot and never took a step wrong. Fast forward three years, had to move barns, had to go with a new farrier, within 3 trim cycles, one front foot started looking odd, even to me (not a hoof expert, just a long time horsey person). When I asked the new farrier, he told me my horse had a club foot. I really questioned this, as my horse had been under regular care with my old farrier and he had never once mentioned this as an issue. His feet had always look decent to me. And, my horse suddenly started to develop abscesses in that foot on a regular basis. I decided then and there to try and educate myself as much as possible, and learnt to trim myself. I eventually got the foot back to where I thought it worked, and he stopped abscessing. I wish I had thought to get xrays, but my regular vet didn't think he was club foot, thought I was on the right track and that his feet looked fine, so it never came up in conversation.

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                      • #31
                        Decades ago, had a horse with a slight club. It never, ever created any problems. No portable x rays back then, just look and see it’s a slight club and farriers trimmed accordingly, to help it not make it go away or deny the conformation defect. Had a little bit of a different stride on that leg but it never bothered the horse, interfered with his performance or blew any abscesses. If they are blowing abscesses, it’s not the natural shape but an injury something going on inside or nutritional issues creating a poor quality hoof.

                        Club, especially slight, in and of itself is no big deal.
                        When opportunity knocks it's wearing overalls and looks like work.

                        The horse world. Two people. Three opinions.

                        Comment


                        • #32
                          Originally posted by Lunabear1988 View Post

                          It's the more steep one that's causing problems or that he's sore on right now. I tried to upload photos but it says the photo is too big.
                          If the farrier has been working without rads and the "up" hoof is only slightly steeper than the "down" one, it's possible that the farrier has been trying to make them more even all along and just finally went too far (trimmed too much heel, left too much toe, took too much off somewhere)? If this was something that could have been avoided the farrier probably won't make the same mistake again.

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                          • #33
                            I had a horse with a fairly noticeable club foot. Never gave him any problems, and we trimmed/shod it as its anatomy dictated (did not try making it look like the normal foot).

                            An angle change causing lameness is one thing but with positive to hoof testers on one half of the foot, I still suspect something else is going on. Abscess, close nail, bruise...

                            Comment


                            • #34
                              Originally posted by Lunabear1988 View Post
                              Looked slightly better today I thought. So that makes me feel better!
                              If your vet is a knowledgable, experienced equine vet then I would give the farrier he recommended a chance. Good to hear the horse might be better. Good sign.

                              Comment

                              • Original Poster

                                #35
                                kande04 two different farriers but your theory is what it looks like to me.

                                Comment

                                • Original Poster

                                  #36
                                  IPEsq right now I don't think it's an abscess but a bruise could be possible. But the farrier admitted that he was a bit too aggressive during the trim. He slightly better than he was, so hopefully that's good. I'm sure the vet will help clear things up on Wednesday with x-rays and a lameness exam..

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                                  • Original Poster

                                    #37
                                    findeight I hope it goes that way! I've only known a few horses with club feet. One was an upper level horse who eventually did need to drop down from PSG work sure to her feet issues. But she did make it to PSG and was 18 when she had to drop down. She was still sound at a lower level of work though.

                                    Another I vetted and she failed. But her foot was worse and she definitely had not great care or a good living situation for 6 years before that.

                                    Comment


                                    • #38
                                      Originally posted by kande04 View Post

                                      If the farrier has been working without rads and the "up" hoof is only slightly steeper than the "down" one, it's possible that the farrier has been trying to make them more even all along and just finally went too far (trimmed too much heel, left too much toe, took too much off somewhere)? If this was something that could have been avoided the farrier probably won't make the same mistake again.
                                      As I read this it was a farrier working with him for the first time as previous farrier had become undependable, OP has only had the horse a few months and previous owner though 12-14 weeks was a suitable interval for farrier services. But new farrier has mentioned he might have trimmed too much off and wants to seethe vets x rays coining up this week. Think she’s good.
                                      When opportunity knocks it's wearing overalls and looks like work.

                                      The horse world. Two people. Three opinions.

                                      Comment


                                      • #39
                                        Originally posted by findeight View Post
                                        Decades ago, had a horse with a slight club. It never, ever created any problems. No portable x rays back then, just look and see it’s a slight club and farriers trimmed accordingly, to help it not make it go away or deny the conformation defect. Had a little bit of a different stride on that leg but it never bothered the horse, interfered with his performance or blew any abscesses. If they are blowing abscesses, it’s not the natural shape but an injury something going on inside or nutritional issues creating a poor quality hoof.

                                        Club, especially slight, in and of itself is no big deal.
                                        Wish I could go back in time, and ask many more questions! Always wondered about this horse and his feet. The thing with the abscesses always bothered me, and I wondered if it had anything to do with the trim and how he was landing. Was he bruising his sole? Was his sole being trimmed way too thin? Should the farrier have been touching the sole at all? I have no idea now, and didn't know enough to ask at the time. The more I learnt the more I realized I knew nothing! As a horse owner, you trust your farrier and your vet, it's only with hindsight you start to realize some are better than others and really start to ask questions. This particular horse was euthed years ago due to a completely unrelated issue.

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                                        • Original Poster

                                          #40
                                          Looking better everyday... Still not 100% but way better than a few days ago. I'll update after the vet appointment tomorrow if anyone is still curious. Thanks for all the input and advice.

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