Sport Horse Spotlight

Sir Donnerhall_02Beelitz

Real Estate Spotlight

UMS_01

Sale Spotlight

COTH_without Subscribe
  • Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.

Announcement

Collapse

Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You�re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the Forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it�details of personal disputes may be better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts, though are not legally obligated to do so, regardless of content.

Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting. Moderators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts unless they have been alerted and have determined that a post, thread or user has violated the Forums� policies. Moderators do not regularly independently monitor the Forums for such violations.

Profanity, outright vulgarity, blatant personal insults or otherwise inappropriate statements will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

Users may provide their positive or negative experiences with or opinions of companies, products, individuals, etc.; however, accounts involving allegations of criminal behavior against named individuals or companies MUST be first-hand accounts and may NOT be made anonymously.

If a situation has been reported upon by a reputable news source or addressed by law enforcement or the legal system it is open for discussion, but if an individual wants to make their own claims of criminal behavior against a named party in the course of that discussion, they too must identify themselves by first and last name and the account must be first-person.

Criminal allegations that do not satisfy these requirements, when brought to our attention, may be removed pending satisfaction of these criteria, and we reserve the right to err on the side of caution when making these determinations.

Credible threats of suicide will be reported to the police along with identifying user information at our disposal, in addition to referring the user to suicide helpline resources such as 1-800-SUICIDE or 1-800-273-TALK.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it�s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users� profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses � Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it�s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who�s selling it, it doesn�t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions � Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services � Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products � While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements � Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be �bumped� excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues � Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators� discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the �alert� button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your �Ignore� list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you�d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user�s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 5/9/18)
See more
See less

Supplementing Hay for boarded horse

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Supplementing Hay for boarded horse

    I would like to supplement my horse’s diet by adding more hay. Our boarding facility provides free choice round bale hay in the turn outs and 2-3 flakes of hay in the stalls. Horsie is out all day and in all night. Naturally he cleans up his hay in his stall pretty quickly. I’ve been soaking hay cubes and giving him about 3lbs dry weight on the evenings I am there ; 4 to 5 days a week. Horsie is in good weight. So it’s not like he’s starving to death, but I would feel better if he wasn’t going so long on an empty stomach. I’m considering buying square bales and some sort of whole bale slow feed net to put in his stall. BO is pretty chill about me putting things in his stall and can’t imagine she’d be upset that I buy him extra hay. My idea is that a whole bale in a net would last at least two nights. Thus providing him continuing access to forage. I am concerned that the net would be a safety hazard. Any tips for such a situation? Product recommendations?

  • #2
    The biggest concern is if he's got shoes on. The net needs to be high enough to not allow him to paw it, and stay high enough as the net empties. There are some corner net feeders that string across a corner of the stall, like a hammock, or you can rig a regular hay net to do something similar so it's stretching sideways, not up and down. The height shouldn't really go below his chest (for safety) nor above his withers (for a healthier eating position)
    ______________________________
    The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances. - ET

    Comment


    • #3
      I supplemented my pony for a year at previous barn. I did a hay net and them put the hay net in a hay bag to reduce the waste/mess on the floor. My BO's complaint was that he was dropping hay and making his stall messier. He wasn't.....but oh well. Also make sure that he continues to get his normal ration from the barn even if he has hay in his bag. Been there.....done that. I would ask the BO how much to just give him more flakes, otherwise you have to deal with buying and storing hay. Its a pain in the ass if you don't have a truck.
      "Anyone who tries to make brownies without butter should be arrested." Ina Garten

      Comment

      • Original Poster

        #4
        Horsie is barefoot. I’ll look for the corner nets. I do have a truck, with water proof bed cover. Him not getting his regular ration from the barn would be concerning. I’ll have to think on that

        Comment


        • #5
          What happens if you put his 3 flakes of barn hay in a small hole hay net? You should also weigh it to see how much it weighs. 3 flakes could be anywhere from 10 to 15 lbs or more. If you put 15 lbs of hay in a small hole nibble net that is more than enough to see him through the night if he has free access hay all day.

          For comparison my easy keeper gets about 15 lbs a day total in 4 or 5 feedings. If she got it all at once she'd vacuum it up.

          Anyhow I think putting the barn hay in a small hole net is a good starting point. See how that works. You may need to stuff it yourself and if you are not there every day buy 3 or 4 nets and stuff them ahead of time. Barn staff hate stuffing nets and you will soon discover why!!!

          The problem doesn't seem to be total amount of hay is too small just that you want something on his tummy overnight.

          Comment


          • #6
            They are pricey, but the PortaGrazer corner feeder is the *only* thing I've found that holds enough hay and slows my guys down enough to get through the night (or longer) without running out. Hay is insanely expensive in Florida and I found that I could give about half as much in the PortaGrazer as I needed to give even in slow feed haynets, so I figure the PortaGrazers paid for themselves in not too long.

            And they're easy to fill and the horses don't seem to make nearly the mess they did with haynets.

            Comment

            • Original Poster

              #7
              Scribbler yes I believe he is getting “enough” hay currently. His work load is increasing as we slowly work our way up the training tree. The BO, a lovely lady, has mentioned upping his grain ration to maintain his weight due to increased work. I would personally rather up his hay as opposed to the grain. And I am paranoid he will develop ulcers from going so long on an empty stomach. I had thought to slip in some higher quality hay if I purchased extra, perhaps perennial peanut or alfalfa. I did bring a nibble net to the barn, but it is rarely used as it is a pain to stuff and hang. Your suggestion for multiple nets is pretty solid if BO doesn’t mind hanging them. BO gives the hay at night check so she may not be excited about havin to go into his stall to hang a net as opposed to just tossing hay through feeder hole in stall front. Lots to consider! Thanks for your thoughtful reply!

              Comment

              • Original Poster

                #8
                cbg I will absolutely check those out! Sounds exactly like what I want! I’m also in Florida, though in the panhandle, and hay is pricey. About how much hay can you get in one?

                Im also considering just upping how many hay cubes I give and switching to an alfalfa cube. Figure it would be better than nothing.

                Comment


                • #9
                  I bought a PortaGrazer corner feeder about 6 months ago and I still think it’s the best money I’ve ever spent on a hay feeder. I can easily fit 20-25lbs of hay in there (6-8 decent size grass flakes, small squares). That will last my 16.3h WB in moderate work 12+ hours easily. Almost no hay waste, easy to fill, and I love that it’s a more natural position for his head and neck than contorting to eat from a hay net. Also, it’s completely worth the peace of mind knowing that there’s nothing for my shod horse to get a shoe hung up in - I’ve had a few scary moments where nets fell because caribiners or double ended snaps broke, or nets were not tied correctly by barn staff when hanging. After having to literally cut a net to get it off my horse’s shoe, I swore I’d never go back to hay nets.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by lenapesadie View Post
                    cbg I will absolutely check those out! Sounds exactly like what I want! I’m also in Florida, though in the panhandle, and hay is pricey. About how much hay can you get in one?

                    Im also considering just upping how many hay cubes I give and switching to an alfalfa cube. Figure it would be better than nothing.
                    If your problem is making the hay last overnight, cubes don't help. Also I find it's pretty hard to feed enough alfalfa cubes to make a difference. They need to be soaked and that's a huge pail of mash that horse will just drink down.

                    If you are there daily you could hang the hay bag in his stall in the daytime while he is out and BM could just skip the night feed. This is assuming you stuff the hay bags with barn hay.

                    I suggest trying to work with the barn hay and also weighing it before moving on to buying your own hay. I don't know what hay costs where you are but here a 50 lb bale of grass hay is about $12 and a 100 lb bale of alfalfa is about $25. If you really think your horse will eat up a 50 lb bale in 2 days in a net, that's 15 bales a month or $180 a month. It's also an awful lot of hay. I would not feed alfalfa free choice this way, it's too tasty and a recipe for gorge, obesity, founder.

                    Get yourself a fish scale so you can weigh the hay. If the barns night feed weighs 10 to 15 lbs that is more than enough hay, just hang it in a small hole net in the afternoon so it's there when he returns.

                    Remember that most horses do just fine on 20 lbs of hay a day. He has free choice hay all day.

                    If he is not muscling up enough I would look at his protein and his general vitamin mineral load. If he is getting a smaller amount of a fortified bagged feed guaranteed he is low on nutrients. I would not necessarily feed more of the bagged feed but rather look at its nutritient analysis and consider a ration balancer or VMS

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      My horse’s hated the porta grazer, and they are expensive.

                      nets are a pain to fill, tend to drape too low, and get chewed up.
                      i bought two of the biggest smartpak web hanging feeders, and they are perfect. The first one is over a year old and holding up well. I can cram 20 lb in there.

                      Comment

                      • Original Poster

                        #12
                        Scribbler I take back my comment of hay being spendy here. Grass hay is half that cost here or less. Alfalfa is similar price. I absolutely would not feed free choice Alfalfa; more like a flake a day. He gets 9 quarts a day of a 10/10/10 sweet feed. When he lived at home I fed triple crown training, similar composition to his current feed, and it weighed approximately a pound per quart. He also gets a mineral supplement ( Ca, Sulfur, Copper, Zinc Methionine and kelp), 1 1/2 cups whole flax, a tsp of loose salt, and Platinum Refresh (until it cools off a bit more). A ration balancer is an interesting idea. I could easily add that to his supplement tub. The quality of his bagged feed is dubious. And I’m concerned that upping it will just be unnecessary sugar.

                        You make a solid point regarding costs of buying additional hay vs making barn hay more efficient.

                        Horse eats dinner around 5 and hay is fed around 9 to 10. I usually feed the hay cubes between dinner and hay. I do believe it’s better than nothing.

                        Horse is @17.1 hands, thickly built Friesian x QH, 7 year old gelding.

                        Comment

                        • Original Poster

                          #13
                          Originally posted by Arlomine View Post
                          My horse’s hated the porta grazer, and they are expensive.

                          nets are a pain to fill, tend to drape too low, and get chewed up.
                          i bought two of the biggest smartpak web hanging feeders, and they are perfect. The first one is over a year old and holding up well. I can cram 20 lb in there.
                          Thank you for your reply. I would hate to spend a bunch of money on something that he might not want to eat out of. I’ll check out those web feeders.

                          Comment

                          • Original Poster

                            #14
                            Originally posted by Amy3996 View Post
                            I bought a PortaGrazer corner feeder about 6 months ago and I still think it’s the best money I’ve ever spent on a hay feeder. I can easily fit 20-25lbs of hay in there (6-8 decent size grass flakes, small squares). That will last my 16.3h WB in moderate work 12+ hours easily. Almost no hay waste, easy to fill, and I love that it’s a more natural position for his head and neck than contorting to eat from a hay net. Also, it’s completely worth the peace of mind knowing that there’s nothing for my shod horse to get a shoe hung up in - I’ve had a few scary moments where nets fell because caribiners or double ended snaps broke, or nets were not tied correctly by barn staff when hanging. After having to literally cut a net to get it off my horse’s shoe, I swore I’d never go back to hay nets.
                            Scary! Horse is on barefoot protocols and doing well so far but will keep this in mind should he get shod in the future

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Sweet feed? How much does 9 quarts weigh?

                              I fed sweet feed as a kid in the 1970s. Back then the only choices were sweet feed, whole oats, and mystery pellets from the same local mill.

                              I rode pony into the ground and the sweet feed gave us no problems. I expect it would still be OK for a working ranch horse under saddle 8 hours a day that needs the calories and carbs.

                              But knowing what I know now about horse nutrition, obesity, insulin resistance, founder, no way would I feed sweet feed to my adult returning rider horse who gets ridden 1 to 2 hours daily with the occasional trucked out trail ride of 4 or 5 hours.

                              She would get obese, IR, and founder. I've watched folks at my barn founder stock horses on free choice alfalfa, no grain even.

                              The sugar levels of sweet feed are off the charts. Your horse is young now but he comes from two easy keeping breeds. Unless you are using him to ride the fence line 6 hours a day in the back country I would put him on a much lower NSC feed.

                              You might find Julie Gettys book Feed Your Horse Like a Horse s useful introduction to current best practices in horse nutrition.

                              Sweet feed is typically oats, corn, barley, with a bit of wheat bran and molasses and sometimes mystery pellets as well. The only thing on that list I think a horse should be eating is the oats, everything else is way higher carbs/sugar and wheat bran isn't the best bran for horses.

                              As a kid I liked sweet feed because it looked natural and whole food compared to the mystery pellets and palatable compared to whole oats. But these days there are many reputable extruded or pelleted feeds that have guaranteed nutrition and ingredients plus a lower NSC and higher protein, using ingredients like beet pulp, Alfalfa meal, soy, or brewers grains.

                              Actually I do still feed whole ingredients, a small mash of oats beet pulp and alfalfa cubes to carry a complete VMS, flax, and salt. I have never fed any horse more than 1 or 2 lbs of oats in these mashes, usually much less.

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Small hole hay nets, IMO, are not hard to fill--just get a plastic 32 gallon trash can, put hay net in can, stretch net edge over the edges of the can and stuff away... I hang mine with the carabiner shaped spring clips from the cheap 4 screw tie rings. Never an issue hanging them this way, whereas I did have issues when I tried to tie them up.

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Originally posted by DinkyDonk View Post
                                  Small hole hay nets, IMO, are not hard to fill--just get a plastic 32 gallon trash can, put hay net in can, stretch net edge over the edges of the can and stuff away... I hang mine with the carabiner shaped spring clips from the cheap 4 screw tie rings. Never an issue hanging them this way, whereas I did have issues when I tried to tie them up.
                                  Yes, having something like a garbage can makes it so much easier.

                                  I don't tie hay nets. I use the carabiner spring clips too, I put them on the end of the string and then through the screw tie bolt or the mesh or bars on the stall front, weave the string back and forth through the bag and the ring until bag is at the height I like and then fasten the clip to the bag.
                                  ​​​​​​
                                  hate hate hate knots in hay bags.

                                  Comment

                                  • Original Poster

                                    #18
                                    Scribbler no doubt the sweet feed is awful. It’s a Tucker product I believe. Exactly the kind of product you recall from your childhood. Very sugary. I’d say it weighs slightly under a pound per quart. Currently on 9 quarts a day. Was on 6 prior to being in real work. BO will go as high as 12 quarts to maintain body condition. Can double check weight with the scale I use for mineral mix this afternoon. The triple crown product I used at home was a much lower NSC level. Barn provides current grain. Horse can’t eat pelleted feed as he is a choker.

                                    So now we have a whole barrel of options!

                                    1) Purchase my own grain, I have access to Triple Crown products, and provide it to barn out of pocket. @ cost $125 per month for TC senior or complete at @ 7lbs per day. Both are much lower NSC value than current ration and better overall nutrition profile. Doubtful that BO will cut me a break on board cost but might could “trade” for more hay. Use net or similar with barn hay possibly

                                    2) Add ration balancer and convince BO to lower grain portion, lower cost but maybe tricky getting horse to eat supplements on a smaller grain portion. I am already planning on trying a different mineral supplement that might be more palatable. Farrier recommended California Trace. Use net with barn hay. Unsure of cost of RB.

                                    3) Use some sort of slow feed hay feeder to add higher nutritional value hay. Local grass hay is Bermuda mix. Perhaps adding a flake of peanut and a flake of alfalfa to his regular grass hay would bring his caloric intake up enough to reduce grain ration of barn grain back down to 6 quarts. I believe that is minimum ration as per bag label. Will double check that as well. I would estimate my cost for this to be @75 dollars per month

                                    4) Buy a house with property and move horse back home. Only partially joking.


                                    Horse is in moderate work. Ridden 4 or 5 days a week. Basic dressage training plus small jumps. Horse show, clinic, or off property trail ride about once a month. Don’t let the QH fool you. His dam was the QH. Very well bred for the track, earned her ROM, strong TB type. She was a very hard keeper on Triple Crown Senior. Naturally my boy inherited his dearly departed mother’s metabolism lol

                                    Horse is on vet recommended wormer protocol. Quest Plus 3x per year. I am unsure why vet doesn’t recommend wormer rotation. I provide wormer out of pocket as barn uses a different, much cheaper wormer.

                                    Thanks again Scribbler for your help. I appreciate your support in exploring changes for my boy to help him be healthier and happier. BO is a lovely lady but her program consists of pleasure and ranch bred QH. And they do keep easy compared to my guy. She charges me a very reasonable rate so I’d like to avoid additional work and hassle for her and am open to spending a bit more per month
                                    Last edited by lenapesadie; Oct. 20, 2019, 02:09 PM. Reason: Because saddle and supplement are very different

                                    Comment

                                    • Original Poster

                                      #19
                                      Originally posted by DinkyDonk View Post
                                      Small hole hay nets, IMO, are not hard to fill--just get a plastic 32 gallon trash can, put hay net in can, stretch net edge over the edges of the can and stuff away... I hang mine with the carabiner shaped spring clips from the cheap 4 screw tie rings. Never an issue hanging them this way, whereas I did have issues when I tried to tie them up.
                                      I have a Nibble Net and I don’t think it’s any harder to stuff than carrying an arm load of hay down the aisle. It has handle straps and can be hung from a water bucket hook easily. The barn staff works hard though and I’m sure it’s not the most lucrative career.

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        I do hope that grain is being split into two feedings a day. And I agree I wouldn't great it increased. BO sounds a wee bit uneducated, hay is a far better choice for nutrients. Agreed that it is less tidy to feed.
                                        Some riders change their horse, they change their saddle, they change their teacher; they never change themselves.

                                        Remember the horse does all the work, we just sit there and look pretty.

                                        Comment

                                        Working...
                                        X