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2/3/2011 UPDATES...... Re: Lame after shoeing, 4 times in a row.....

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    #41
    If this has already been answered, I apologize as I went a little off course with this thread.

    He has been off the last 4 times he's been shod- how long did he stay off for and when/how did it resolve itself?

    Also, a horse can have nav changes in only one foot.

    Comment


      #42
      Here's my experience. Used the same farriers for 4 years, never had a problem and, actually, really liked them. All of a sudden, around March, things started to go downhill. I now have a horse on 4 to 6 weeks of stall rest in Ultimates laminitis shoes because they trimmed him too close. Run, run from a farrier that makes your horse lame!
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        #43
        Something like this ~

        Originally posted by LauraKY View Post
        Here's my experience. Used the same farriers for 4 years, never had a problem and, actually, really liked them. All of a sudden, around March, things started to go downhill. I now have a horse on 4 to 6 weeks of stall rest in Ultimates laminitis shoes because they trimmed him too close. Run, run from a farrier that makes your horse lame!
        Won't go into details BUT have sworn by my farriers several times during this "horse thing/addiction" and while some horses were reset just fine - others were sore or two even "foundered due to sole pressure after resets SO when in doubt I suggest network and use another farrier = can't hurt or rather it should not hurt ! - Find a new farrier, who comes reommended by a large barn where he works on many horses types...IMHO it is time to change at least for this particular horse. Good Luck ~
        Zu Zu Bailey " IT'S A WONDERFUL LIFE ! "

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          #44
          Hey guys - update on poopsie:

          Vet recommended not de-shoeing until he could get here today.

          He is still lame at the trot, but walking better. Vet out today (I hate living in BFE)

          Took a crapload of pictures and measurements for vet to study last week, he is leaning towards farrier, and not conformation changes.

          However - we are still going to hit it up with an xray.

          That video made me LMAO

          Thanks guys for the info, and also the support against the drama llama

          ETA, also have another farrier on the book to come look
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            #45
            Originally posted by Timex View Post
            Anybody else wondering if J.D. is actually naters farrier? Lol. And its 'pertinent' information. Not pretinate. Whatever that is.

            haha ha, he can't be my farrier, because all of a sudden my farrier (who has been very vocal about consulting the vet) has been MIA since I left him a voicemail with the vet's recommendation.

            Meanwhile the other horse (different location) that he also had supposedly trimmed had a shoe just FALL off (per the barn manager) when she was walking him in.

            So...... Looks like I am looking for a new farrier regardless...
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              #46
              Update with pics. After taking the pictures, I realized that I have never seen my horses feet look so horrid. Or anyone else's horse's feet for that matter. There is that one spot where an abscess that is growing out is looking horrible, but does this look like white line??

              Vet suggested over the phone (from emailed pictures) that he has white line.

              Farrier finally called back, and said he hasn't seen any signs of white line disease.

              I just don't know, and my appointment has been moved to tomorrow due to an emergency surgery at the clinic...

              HEre are the pics:

              http://s128.photobucket.com/albums/p...of%20Pictures/




              .
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                #47
                Can you even diagnose WLD by email?
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                  #48
                  Originally posted by naters View Post
                  Update with pics. After taking the pictures, I realized that I have never seen my horses feet look so horrid. Or anyone else's horse's feet for that matter.
                  That is one of the best benefits of taking pictures. You get accustomed to seeing your horse's feet in real life, the pictures force you to take an objective, fresh look.

                  OK, sorry to say this like this, but those feet look awful. Not just the shoeing job but the feet do not look healthy at all. He looks like he has been experiencing chronic laminitis (those rings). And the bottom has that characteristic 'bulge' to it.
                  Honestly it is probably really hard for the farrier to find healthy wall to nail behind and is probably quicking the horse, but it is hard to blame him.
                  However he could do a better job on the angles as well as setting the heels (of the shoe) further back. Very short shod.

                  Who knows if he has white line but I think you have bigger problems.

                  What is his diet?

                  Don't know what all the measurements are supposed to determine.

                  Comment


                    #49
                    The feet, from the side shots, look really awful. Dramatic flares, long toe and under-run heel, nasty looking hoofwall. How long has this farrier been working on the horse's hooves?

                    You (and the horse) will be so much better off with a different farrier.

                    Good luck.
                    "The formula 'Two and two make five' is not without its attractions." --Dostoevsky

                    Comment


                      #50
                      No professional advice, but add me to the "those feet look awful" group. I think you need a new farrier, ASAP.

                      Comment


                        #51
                        Add me to the same group. My first thought when I saw the pictures, was OMFG.

                        Got a guy named Dave Richards from Aberdeen coming to look at the horse.... sent him the photos and he called me in like ten seconds

                        Anyone know anything about him?

                        This is a lesson to me (All of my horses normally have great looking feet!) to NOT LET A LITTLE RED FLAG go un-noticed, just to be "nice".

                        If I had put my foot down 16 weeks ago, I may not be here.
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                          #52
                          Dave Richards does this:

                          http://www.equicast.us/

                          but otherwise I don't know much about him
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                            #53
                            Dave Richards = awesome. He's very dedicated, a nice guy and excellent farrier. He helped turn my horse's feet around from disaster. I ended up taking that horse barefoot using another most excellent trimmer (eqtrainer so that is why I stopped using him. It was getting too much for him to drive to N. Durham from Aberdeen also.

                            Tell him that Charlene (used to own Meshach) says hi!

                            Comment


                              #54
                              This is not entirely the fault of the farrier. I think you need to look into the adequacy of his diet as well as supplementation, and living environment. A lot of things affect the feet, not just how you trim them and what you nail onto them.

                              Comment


                                #55
                                Diagnosing white line? You do need a good farrier. If the white line has "been there a while" you'll have a hollow sound when the farrier hits the hoof with a tool/little hammer etc.

                                Radiographs are your friend and a good vet is also. If you cannot find a good farrier your vet should be able to recommend someone that he/she has worked with. Vets and farriers are supposed to work together to solve hoof issues whether is it white line or laminitis or thrush or whatever.

                                And get a recommendation from your vet (or good farrier) for a hoof product to help prevent bacteria and fungi from invading the hooves in this hot humid summer.

                                You horse should never be lame after shoeing or trimming. No one is perfect and there will be the occasional hot nail or quicking, but that should be something that happens years apart, if ever. And remember, you get what you pay for. Get a good farrier, pay him and hope he doesn't leave your area.

                                Comment


                                  #56
                                  Meshach: Good news, looking forward to hearing what he has to say. Did you do the "equicast" route?


                                  Androcles: Never said it was all the fault of the farrier but after reviewing all of the information, the vet suggested I call Mr. Richards. His diet is good, conditions have been a little weird down here, either really wet or really dry.

                                  He eats an appropriate amount of TC Senior, is on Farriers Formula (since the other two were on it), and flax seed for the extra Omegas. MSM for another issue.

                                  Will have more info after he looks at the feet though! I think we were just all consumed with the other horse's abscess we kinda waited around a little too long on this.

                                  Current farrier says he doesn't see that the horse has white line...
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                                    #57
                                    Ouch, poor horse! I am glad that you have it under control! Good Luck. Please keep us updated!
                                    Life is too short to argue with a mare! Just don't engage! It is much easier that way!

                                    Have fun, be safe, and let the mare think it is her idea!

                                    Comment


                                      #58
                                      Looking at the pictures, it so horrifying to me, because they are so awful. I spent so much time obsessing over the other horse's foot that I wasn't paying close attention enough to my own....
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                                        #59
                                        This is not entirely the fault of the farrier.
                                        Maybe not entirely ,but certainly this pi$$ poor shoeing has exacerbated any underlying hoof wall weakness. A better educated farrier could make these feet a lot better imediately.
                                        .....of his diet as well as supplementation, and living environment. A lot of things affect the feet, not just how you trim them and what you nail onto them.
                                        Totally agree but this shoeing is obviously making the flares and wall weakness much worse. As well, given the flare on the toe, shoe fit to the front end of that mess, rasp marks on the sole at the toe, and the long heels ,the horse is going to be a candidate to suffer from thin soles in the toe area ,sore heels ,and problems in and around the coffin joint and navicular area.
                                        Patty Stiller CNBBT,CNBF,CLS, CE
                                        Natural Balance Certified Lameness Specialist ,instructor.
                                        www.hoofcareonline.com

                                        Comment


                                          #60
                                          Originally posted by Patty Stiller View Post
                                          Maybe not entirely ,but certainly this pi$$ poor shoeing has exacerbated any underlying hoof wall weakness. A better educated farrier could make these feet a lot better imediately.Totally agree but this shoeing is obviously making the flares and wall weakness much worse. As well, given the flare on the toe, shoe fit to the front end of that mess, rasp marks on the sole at the toe, and the long heels ,the horse is going to be a candidate to suffer from thin soles in the toe area ,sore heels ,and problems in and around the coffin joint and navicular area.
                                          I totally agree, especially about the toe flare and fitting the shoe to the front end of that mess. However what concerns me is the rings in the hoof wall that might indicate repeated inflammatory episodes.

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