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Anaphylactic shock from a 6-way shot

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  • #21
    Originally posted by Dutchmare433 View Post

    When one of my horses had a vaccine rxn a few years ago (pretty sure it was Fort Dodge), the company covered all the expenses related to the reaction. It was just the cost of the vaccine plus the cost of the vet coming out for a few days afterwards to monitor (and some banamine maybe). It wasn’t something I had anything to do with, vet reported it and company reimbursed him.
    I wonder if these companies who sell vaccines have a working/hand to hand relationship with vets so that if a horse has
    an extreme re-action to one of their vaccines, the company offers re-imbursement per advanced agreement for the vet for buying/using the vaccines. One hand washing the other.

    As I mentioned in the other thread, my vet was really pushing the Zoetis 6 way combo + Rabies all in one vaccine that
    I believe is new this year. I was miffed since my horses's records are supposed to be notated "NO FORT DODGE".

    I'm pretty sure these companies pay incentives or kickbacks to vets for using their vaccines. I know Zoetis has a special
    rebate program now for dog flea/tick drugs, but the rebates are only credited to buyer's account with their vet. No rebate
    to client, only credit at vet.
    "There is no fundamental difference between man and animals in their ability to feel pleasure and pain, happiness, and misery." - Charles Darwin

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    • #22
      I'm so sorry!

      Unfortunately I have been in your shoes. I had a really nice young filly I had just purchased. Had the vet come out to do routine vaccines. It was administered, vet watched her for about 5 minutes then walked away to start packing up her truck. Before she was even done packing up my filly was down and thrashing. Everything happened so fast and we lost her. I was in such shock that I didn't start questioning the vet and pharmacy until everything had calmed down the next day. When I touched base with the clinic they told me they were trying out a new pharmacy. I wish I remember who, unfortunately it has been about 10 years since that incident. This past year was my first time vaccinating since that incident.

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      • #23
        Marla 100 Nope, no kickbacks. Usually, we pick a brand we trust and use that vaccine. Occasionally, there are deals on the products if you buy in quantity. It is standard for the drug companies to pay for any vaccine reactions when reported if a vet has given it. Just like if the animal is diagnosed with the disease that the vet has vaccinated it against then the company will pay all the bills. This is why its worth it to pay a vet to give the vaccines then buy it and give it yourself.
        I love cats, I love every single cat....
        So anyway I am a cat lover
        And I love to run.

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        • #24
          Originally posted by Marla 100 View Post

          I wonder if these companies who sell vaccines have a working/hand to hand relationship with vets so that if a horse has
          an extreme re-action to one of their vaccines, the company offers re-imbursement per advanced agreement for the vet for buying/using the vaccines. One hand washing the other.
          They absolutely do, and they state on their website this is a value-added service they offer IF the vaccine was purchased and administered by your vet.
          ______________________________
          The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances. - ET

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          • #25
            Originally posted by Beethoven View Post
            Marla 100 Nope, no kickbacks. Usually, we pick a brand we trust and use that vaccine. Occasionally, there are deals on the products if you buy in quantity. It is standard for the drug companies to pay for any vaccine reactions when reported if a vet has given it. Just like if the animal is diagnosed with the disease that the vet has vaccinated it against then the company will pay all the bills. This is why its worth it to pay a vet to give the vaccines then buy it and give it yourself.
            This is what I do. Routine work is the bread-and-butter for vets and most don't like to be called only one there's an emergency. I bite the bullet and buy my vaccinations from my vet and administered them myself to save the call fee. And they're always there for me if I have an emergency. It's not that much more than buying them through a catalog and I do have peace of mind knowing that it's something my vet would give his own horse.

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            • #26
              Originally posted by Beethoven View Post
              Marla 100 Nope, no kickbacks. Usually, we pick a brand we trust and use that vaccine. Occasionally, there are deals on the products if you buy in quantity. It is standard for the drug companies to pay for any vaccine reactions when reported if a vet has given it. Just like if the animal is diagnosed with the disease that the vet has vaccinated it against then the company will pay all the bills. This is why its worth it to pay a vet to give the vaccines then buy it and give it yourself.
              This is what I do. Routine work is the bread-and-butter for vets and most don't like to be called only when there's an emergency. I bite the bullet and buy my vaccinations from my vet and administered them myself to save the call fee. And they're always there for me if I have an emergency. It's not that much more than buying them through a catalog and I do have peace of mind knowing that it's something my vet gives his own horse. I break the vaccinations up and give half 1 week 1/2 the next week and keep the 2nd half refrigerated until I use them. My one horse will present as colicky if I give them all on the same day because she can't put her neck down to graze. She'll paw like she's uncomfortable, but it's not her gut, it's her neck so I know now to give them a week apart.

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              • #27
                Originally posted by kande04 View Post

                This is all kind of vague in my memory, but I think I did recently read about a similar situation but I think the horse survived, although there were considerable vet bills. For some reason the company paid the vet bills, although the circumstances were such that I wouldn't have expected them to. (Routine vac, or something like that.) So it might be worth asking?
                Maybe it was one of our horses a few years ago, that received his rabies vaccine on his thigh, on the back of it.
                After some hours, he had a basketball swelling and was stiff all over.
                We had to feed him by hand, he could not get his head up or down or hardly shuffle to his water through, would mostly stand over it.

                The vet came right away the same day, treated him and let the vaccine manufacturer know.
                They paid for the vaccine and the vet calls and medication (vet lives 15 minutes from us, on his way to his clinic, so he was stopping as he went to and came from there).

                Horse was fine after a week, all that was left was about a golf ball sized bump where the vaccine was given.
                Next year, our vet thought he would be fine and was right.
                We were watching him like a hawk and he didn't have any reaction at all.

                Every reaction, even the more strange ones, are important to know for the researchers that make the vaccines, as they may give clues how they are working or not and how to keep tweaking them so they work better.

                Decades ago, when the horse flu shot came out, that first year, our then vet gave it first time to all broodmares.
                Practically all had a very sore neck for a day or two.
                Our vet was not sure we were right, until he gave it to his mares and they too were sore.
                He reported it to the manufacturer and they changed the vaccine to avoid that.

                In all the years and many, many vaccines, we were lucky to never have a horse react and die, it is rare.

                Neither vaccinating thousands of cattle but once, when we were vaccinating replacement heifers for brucellosis, the vet was doing it, so they had the required official records.
                This one heifer walked out of the chute and while we were vaccinating the next one, just toppled over and died.
                Vet jumped right on it, but she was already gone.
                Vet said that was a first one for him, it is that rare.

                I can't imagine to lose a perfectly happy and healthy horse like that.
                What a terrible shock to all, so sorry for you.

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                • #28
                  Very sorry.

                  It happens. I am shocked the drug company would do anything, they usually try to blame it on something else.

                  My horse went into anaphylactic shock after her second wnv. There was a snow storm, vet was late so I went to work since that is all my horse needed. Vet ended up leaving, and 30 minutes later my best friend got to the barn. My friend went to see her, and my tb looked like a belgian! Eyes, lips, everything swollen. She called me, called the vet who refused to come back btw, then dug in the medicine cabinet. She put whatever she could- bute, dex, whatever and shot it into my horse's throat that was closing up. A vet more than an hour away volunteered to come out.

                  My horse was obviously upset snd starting to panic, but by the time I got there, she was better. She never had another wnv.

                  My gelding had the first wnv, and he began acting neurologic.

                  The vet came out to see him, and said a week before she had one die from the vaccine.

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                  • #29
                    Originally posted by Dutchmare433 View Post

                    When one of my horses had a vaccine rxn a few years ago (pretty sure it was Fort Dodge), the company covered all the expenses related to the reaction. It was just the cost of the vaccine plus the cost of the vet coming out for a few days afterwards to monitor (and some banamine maybe). It wasn’t something I had anything to do with, vet reported it and company reimbursed him.
                    That's similar, or maybe the same case, to what I remember.

                    Many, many years ago (maybe 20?) my vet said he was boycotting Ft. Dodge because he reported multiple serious vaccine rxns one year and they wouldn't do anything. I still avoid Ft Dodge (now Zoetis?), as do many others who became aware of their lack of concern 20 years ago, so maybe the boycott had an effect?

                    I used to get a couple bottles of epinephrine when I ordered my vaccines, but I don't think it's available, anymore? And that may be because the chances of saving them is much lower than previously thought so no one was buying it?

                    I know a lot of owners who have the vet vaccinate because they want them there in case of a serious rxn. But then some one pointed out that the vet is often long gone by the time the horse reacts,.

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                    • #30
                      How devastating for both the OP and her daughter.

                      I would have been intrigued by the timing of the reaction and the blood from the neck the following day,

                      I assume no postmortem was performed. The drug company should have been more than willing to pay for it.
                      Some riders change their horse, they change their saddle, they change their teacher; they never change themselves.

                      Remember the horse does all the work, we just sit there and look pretty.

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                      • Original Poster

                        #31
                        We got our bill from the vet, and they extended us a "sympathy credit" for the entire cost of their services for our late gelding ($400+). We only had to pay for the surviving mare's annual checkup. We sent them a thank-you note along with our check.

                        That doesn't cover the renderer's $200 fee or the cost of a replacement horse, of course. We haven't decided whether to pursue Merck (the 6-way drug company) for those costs. We've currently got a $2500, 15-yo gelding on loan from a friend. I'm hoping he works out.

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                        • #32
                          IMHO, and I am not a vet, I know this is the cost effective way to do things but a 6-way all at once is a lot. I feel it would be better to do a 3-way in March, the rest in April and intranasal strangles in May or whatever order. Our camp in Afghanistan was named after a solder who died after getting way too many vaccinations to head over seas. My two had big reactions to a Ft Dodge 6-way (whom I'll never use again) that required an emergency vet visit. It's just a lot on the immune system.
                          "Punch him in the wiener. Then leave." AffirmedHope

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                          • #33
                            I’m very sorry for your loss, I would pursue it further. It can be hard to know which they reacted to, I had a pony react badly to the rabies shot last year, ran a fever and was very sore for several days. I had another pony react badly to the Vetera gold combo shot. I now try to split them, doing them all on one day often seems to result in a reaction, at least with ponies.

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