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A PSA to Eventing’s Armchair Quarterbacks: If You’re Not Doing This, You Don’t Get to Talk

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  • A PSA to Eventing’s Armchair Quarterbacks: If You’re Not Doing This, You Don’t Get to Talk

    http://eventingnation.com/if-youre-n...t-get-to-talk/

    Sadly I think this post will be well shared, and thus more heads in the sand. Apparently if you complain about our sport, you don't actually do any of the things listed in the blog post.

    And this is why, the John Holling piece gets ignored.

  • #2
    While I think everyone is entitled to their opinion, I can't help but shake my head at the 'unless you are doing it you don't get to talk' angle. People talk s*** on sports all the time, judge players and coaches openly. People comment on politics and reps. But since the grand majority of us aren't pro footballers on X team, or elected representative to the government, we shouldn't or aren't allowed an opinion?
    where you invest your love, you invest your life

    Comment


    • #3
      I couldn't figure out who the author of that article was talking to/about. The author clearly states she competes at lower levels now, so I don't think she was saying "Only upper level riders" get an opinion. Jon Holling clearly isn't an armchair quarterback. I really have no idea who her intended audience was.

      And her comments about endurance didn't make sense to me either. Sure, going to an event is a long day (waking up at 4am, yadda, yadda). But I don't get how that has anything to do with the discussions I've seen regarding endurance because that has to do mostly with the horse's fitness. Heck, I competed at breed shows as a kid and was up at 4am and didn't get home until 9pm but thinking that somehow correlates to endurance day of a long format is like comparing apples and monkeys. I really didn't understand what the point was the author was trying to make.

      Comment


      • #4
        Ditto msmom.
        Blugal

        You never know what kind of obsessive compulsive crazy person you are until another person imitates your behaviour at a three-day. --Gry2Yng

        Comment


        • #5
          ah, more EN trash. i stopped having respect for EN years and years ago. in that respect EN is like DE and his wad of frothy followers.. most people read it, some people agree with it, but many have moved on to more rational and intelligent platforms...

          i'm assuming that person, like most people that are on EN, is very young and naive. in any event i am assuming she has not competed much considering half of what she says makes no sense..
          "i'm a slow learner, it's true."

          Comment

          • Original Poster

            #6
            Originally posted by msmom View Post
            I couldn't figure out who the author of that article was talking to/about. The author clearly states she competes at lower levels now, so I don't think she was saying "Only upper level riders" get an opinion. Jon Holling clearly isn't an armchair quarterback. I really have no idea who her intended audience was.

            And her comments about endurance didn't make sense to me either. Sure, going to an event is a long day (waking up at 4am, yadda, yadda). But I don't get how that has anything to do with the discussions I've seen regarding endurance because that has to do mostly with the horse's fitness. Heck, I competed at breed shows as a kid and was up at 4am and didn't get home until 9pm but thinking that somehow correlates to endurance day of a long format is like comparing apples and monkeys. I really didn't understand what the point was the author was trying to make.
            I know...I guess I took it personally since I am always one saying we need more of an endurance test.

            But apparently me saying that means I do none of the following;
            Those today who are whining about “endurance” obviously haven’t gotten up at 4:30 a.m., driven two to three hours on the interstate with three or four precious horses in a 26-foot trailer, organized three riders, walked three cross-country courses, and ridden a dressage test before 8:30 a.m.
            Ummm...thats not what we mean by endurance.

            Today, in our eventing, you have to be good at dressage, good at show jumping, and good at cross country to be close to the top of the classification, and I’m here to say THAT IS THE WAY IT SHOULD BE. I don’t want to lay down a lovely dressage test, have a perfect show jump round, and a good cross country and get beat by someone who had a crappy dressage test or dangerous show jumping round. Just because they have more “endurance” by some outsider’s cockamamy standard. The people I compete against work hard. They are good. They can ride. It’s an insult to say that we need to add anything to the sport, to change it by going backwards because someone is nostalgic for the good old days.
            This is the attitudes we are fighting against.

            Then there is this
            No longer is it enough to have “just OK.” You have to be good at withstanding the pressure of competition, too, as the sport has doubled in growth since the ’70s, too. The standards are all ratcheted upward and should be. No longer are we “just passing through” the dressage arena and show jumping arenas so we can get out on the cross country field.
            Has the sport doubled in growth? Have the standards ratcheted up? Shame on EN for printing this trash piece.

            and finally we have
            So, the last event of the season in Area II was a good place for me to get out some of my thoughts, and the conclusion I have come to is this: you non-riders and non-eventers that somehow get to drive the emphasis in this sport need to shut the hell up.

            Comment


            • #7
              Agree. Anyone telling me to "shut up" deserves to be ignored.
              I write checks for membership, I compete and volunteer when I can. And I don't have the luxury of living in Area II where eventing is plentiful.
              I damn well ought to feel like my voice is just as good as anyone else's.
              This is my concern as we go forward - that the sport is open to only certain voices. Is that the point the author is making? Because that's how it sounds. Who chooses what voices will be heard??
              I have been told multiple times in online forums that because I don't compete at the UL, then I should, again, essentially 'shut up'.
              What exactly does that accomplish???
              Does eventing want to continue in it's own echo chamber?
              I applaud Jon Holling for speaking out and his efforts to improve the sport. We cannot continue to shut down viewpoints we don't like and expect the sport to survive.

              Comment


              • #8
                Since the author is a regular coth poster, perhaps she can chime in and discuss who the intended audience was. I agree with everything said above.

                Comment

                • Original Poster

                  #9
                  Originally posted by Frivian View Post
                  Since the author is a regular coth poster, perhaps she can chime in and discuss who the intended audience was. I agree with everything said above.
                  I had a feeling it was directed here... hopefully we can get some clarification then

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    As I consider this further, I sincerely wonder, why is the author of that piece so angry? Does she fear the demise of the sport? Does she prefer the changes to the sport and not want it changed again to favour XC more (this does appear to be one of her points)?

                    Or, perhaps, does she feel a bit helpless/hopeless about an elephant in the room - that there is a disconnect amongst popularity initiatives, safety initiatives, rules changes, inclusivity and the like?

                    Since she seems to be targeting non-participants in the sport (specifically, those who don't compete, own, run events, or volunteer), is she talking to show jumpers, dressage riders, reiners and combined drivers? Is she talking to the SPCA and HSUS?

                    In any event, her language is strong enough that she must feel she has some answers as she wants these people to "shut the hell up". What are her answers? What message does she feel is being drowned out by these "armchair quarterbacks"?
                    Blugal

                    You never know what kind of obsessive compulsive crazy person you are until another person imitates your behaviour at a three-day. --Gry2Yng

                    Comment

                    • Original Poster

                      #11
                      My guess is the ppl of Coth are the armchair QBs....not realizing most of event, host shows, volunteer, or serve on boards involved in eventing in one way or another.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Ummmm... the getting up at 430, loading, driving, unloading yadayada yada, is there any discipline that does NOT involve that? Anyway, her tone is unfortunate and condescending. She’s entitled to her opinion but so are those she disagrees with and don’t think anybody told her to shut the hell up and get lost when they disagreed with her on here.

                        I won’t mention I do think she is right about the good old days not being so good but never personally Evented so I’ll just get lost.
                        When opportunity knocks it's wearing overalls and looks like work.

                        The horse world. Two people. Three opinions.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Yeah, whatever message she is trying to convey gets lost with her condescending tone. When does telling people to shut up ever do anything except piss them off?

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by msmom View Post
                            I couldn't figure out who the author of that article was talking to/about. The author clearly states she competes at lower levels now, so I don't think she was saying "Only upper level riders" get an opinion. Jon Holling clearly isn't an armchair quarterback. I really have no idea who her intended audience was.

                            And her comments about endurance didn't make sense to me either. Sure, going to an event is a long day (waking up at 4am, yadda, yadda). But I don't get how that has anything to do with the discussions I've seen regarding endurance because that has to do mostly with the horse's fitness. Heck, I competed at breed shows as a kid and was up at 4am and didn't get home until 9pm but thinking that somehow correlates to endurance day of a long format is like comparing apples and monkeys. I really didn't understand what the point was the author was trying to make.
                            I don't understand the hostility (or the point) of that opinion piece either. It sounds more like a personal rant than a considered opinion.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              I took it as being directed at Denny. And his trashing of the sport as a whole..as well as those posts on his page.
                              ** Tact is the ability to tell someone to go to hell in such a way that they look forward to the trip. ~Winston Churchill? **

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                I wish those people circling the wagons and defending the status quo would spend more time being open to evaluating input from various well-reasoned voices that don't just affirm what they are already doing and less time in defensive posts like this. It's disheartening for those of us not in lock step. Why make this into us vs. them?

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Add me to the list of people that don't understand the tone and context of the article. I'm not sure exactly which group she's referring--I'm presuming Denny and his "followers." However, as someone who makes their living being persuasive and arguing and defending their points in front of judges, I can tell you that typically telling those who you oppose you or have a difference of opinion to "shut the hell up" is largely the absolute least effective way of convincing someone of your position.

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    Originally posted by bornfreenowexpensive View Post
                                    I took it as being directed at Denny. And his trashing of the sport as a whole..as well as those posts on his page.
                                    I am definitely one of those who should shut the hell up, so take this as the likely confusion of a smurf. How can anyone accuse Denny of not participating? He has horses he is bringing along in the sport, with one just completing her first two star this summer. Horses he has bred (I think) are out there competing. And he is still teaching others how to compete. I don't get the point of telling a guy who has spent over 50 years in the sport that he is not a participant.

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      That was just bizarre and unhinged-sounding. WTF? And if she thinks you can't get a ribbon with a scary XC round she must not event in he same areas as MML (for example).

                                      Jennifer
                                      Third Charm Event Team

                                      Comment

                                      • Original Poster

                                        #20
                                        Originally posted by bornfreenowexpensive View Post
                                        I took it as being directed at Denny. And his trashing of the sport as a whole..as well as those posts on his page.
                                        Omg... if that's the case... people just need to let it go. They really can't handle him having a negative opinion eh.

                                        I wouldn't call a man who events into his 70s an armchair QB though.

                                        comments are interesting on the article too.

                                        Comment

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