• Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.



Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.

Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 1/26/16)
See more
See less

Nerving the Event Horse

  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Nerving the Event Horse

    I've got a friend whose vet is recommending that they nerve her daughters event horse (lower level event horse) for navicular issues. The vet told them that 6 horses ran this past rolex that were nerved, but I've never heard of any that were. What is everybody elses thoughts, concerns, ideas, etc. on it??

  • #2
    I haven't either. Have they done an MRI? Do they know exactly what is wrong?
    Taco Blog
    *T3DE 2010 Pact*


    • Original Poster

      From what I've been told, the horse had navicular change in x-rays. He's been chronically lame in his front end, they have done all of the corrective shoeing as well. And he just recently came up with suspensory issues that they saw on an ultrasound. But I don't think they have done an MRI.


      • #4
        What! And who is this vet that he would know who has been nerved?

        Somehow I doubt that many people would want to run a nerved, navicular horse at a 4*. Is is even allowed in the rules?
        HAS provides hospital care to 340,000 people in Haiti's Artibonite Valley 24/7/365/earthquake/cholera/whatever.
        www.hashaiti.org blog:http://hashaiti.org/blog


        • #5
          I had always heard that it was a huge no-no to jump nerved horses (for safety reasons I thought they were mostly flatwork in a nice even ring after that).

          Maybe the procedure has advanced?


          • Original Poster

            That is what my thoughts were. But I thought maybe I was uneducated in the whole nerving process now, if it has advanced. So thought I would see what everybody elses ideas were.


            • #7
              MRIs are expensive, so many people don't have the option to do them. But, according to this article, MRIs give a lot more information that can indicate how a case should be treated:
              In earlier years, a diagnosis of navicular disease was often considered career-ending for a horse. Chronic lameness was typical, in spite of therapeutic shoeing, medication, etc., and sometimes the only option to help the horse travel sound was a neurectomy (the cutting of nerves leading to the foot), which meant he would no longer feel pain (or anything else) in the foot. Today we realize that what we earlier called navicular disease (the horse showing palmar--toward the back of the foot--foot pain, positive to hoof testers over the navicular area, and going sound after a posterior digital nerve block) includes a host of different problems within the foot, some of which are unrelated to the navicular bone and/or bursa (the fluid-filled sac that cushions the navicular bone against the pressure of the deep digital flexor tendon). The term navicular syndrome or palmar foot pain is now used instead.
              Some cases of navicular syndrome have a good prognosis for healing and full recovery, if given time and proper treatment.
              Taco Blog
              *T3DE 2010 Pact*


              • #8
                Originally posted by HorsesinHaiti View Post
                What! And who is this vet that he would know who has been nerved?

                Somehow I doubt that many people would want to run a nerved, navicular horse at a 4*. Is is even allowed in the rules?

                Oh you would be suprised. There are definitely some top level horses out there (and some very well known Rolex horses as a matter of fact ) that have been low nerved (back half of the foot only).


                • #9
                  I would never jump a horse that was nerved. But I did know a guy that did that and played polo on the mare. I always thought you could not compete a nerved horse.


                  • #10
                    Oh you would be surprised. There are definitely some top level horses out there (and some very well known Rolex horses as a matter of fact ) that have been low nerved (back half of the foot only).

                    Ditto above statement. have been for years.
                    Shop online at


                    • #11
                      it is against FEI rules i believe but it is very difficult to prove short of sticking needles in horses feet and it certainly goes on.


                      • #12
                        Navicular is a degenerative problem, nerving will take the pain away but the horse wills till deteriorate, especially if its being jumped and galloped. So, you gain a couple years competing, but the horse likely loses some years of its life as competing will only cause the horse to deteriorate faster. Seems incredibly irresponsible and selfish to me.

                        The horse has navicular and suspensory issues, when are these people going to realize its not designed for its job and retire the poor thing?


                        • #13
                          There was a horse at my barn in high school that was nerved. He was raced after that, if I remember correctly (not saying that's the best thing to do). He would also jump the four foot paddock fences routinely (he really believed that whole 'grass is greener on the other side' adage).

                          He became a school horse and we were NOT allowed to jump him more than an 18" crossrail. It did not have as much to do with repeated concussion on the horse's feet and a lot to do with the fact that the horse cannot feel his feet. There was concern for the horse, and if he were not nerved he may have been jumped more, with proper care, but my trainer at the time would not risk and accident due to the horse not realizing where his feet were. That is very likely in jumping. Tripping is much more likely as well as not quite knowing where his feet are over a jump until to late.

                          I would NEVER do it over any solid jump more than a log on the ground.


                          • #14
                            My guy was just recently diagnosed with navicular (as well as sidebone, and pedal osteitis ). The very well respected vet from Southern Pines asked me what I wanted the horse's career to be, and I told him I just wanted him to be able to compete at novice and he suggested we do a partial neurectomy. My horse has not been in work for over a year because of the lameness and is not even 9 years old- shoeing changes and NSAIDS haven't made him comfortable so I'm seriously considering it. He is uncomfortable just walking around in the pasture so if it makes his quality of life better than I'm all for it.


                            • #15
                              The extent of the nerving makes a very big difference in what the horse can do after the procedure. Thus why there are some who can go around Rolex and some who can't walk across the pasture without tripping over their own feet. Finding out at what point exactly the vet intends to nerve this horse is definitely important in determining what he may be capable of doing in the future.

                              Also, navicular syndrome is not necessarily degenerative. As explained in an earlier post, navicular syndrome just means that the horse has pain in a specific part of his foot and that the pain goes away when the horse is blocked there. If the problem is because his navicular bone is degenerating? Then yes, likely to progress over time and become worse. However, there are also instances in which navicular syndrome is stemming from other underlying issues that may not get progressively worse with time if they are handled correctly.


                              • #16
                                Without going into too much detail, a horse very close to me was nerved a couple of years ago. He had suffered on and off for a few years with front end issues and EVERYTHING you could do he had done (special shoeing, coffin injections, navicular bursa injections, Tildren, etc, etc, etc). Every diagnostic tool available was used on him to monitor the extent of his issues (including MRI). The horse is much loved and is also a savage beast when not in work and charming when he is (this was actually a big factor in the decision. If he didn't make it so apparent that he liked to have a job, he might have been retired). When it became apparent the horse was not going to stay comfortable with less invasive procedures, it was decided (after much discussion with the vets, much debate, much reseach, etc) to nerve him. He has been happily jumping around training level and his vets feel that if he wants to do some prelim he should be able to. He is still monitored carefully with regular visits with the vets and careful shoeing (his angles have to be carefully dealt with and he MUST have pads).

                                The procedure has come VERY far. There was a point when the idea of jumping a nerved horse was just scary. However, they are able to be so accurate with what they do now that it is quite safe (this horse DEFINITELY can feel his legs and feet). The biggest worry is them stepping on something because they won't necessarily feel pain in their soles (hence, the pads).

                                All that being said, nerving should be a last ditch effort. Every avenue should be exhausted, in my book. The very best vets you can use should be consulted, and you need to be VERY sure what your horses issues are. A BIG thing that was stressed prior to this horse's surgery was that he could have NO soft tissue issues in his feet (lesions or tears or inflammation of things like DDFT etc). They really did not want to do it if those types of things were in a compromised state, since having a big issue with those can be very bad. I think the procedure is VERY useful and worth its weight in gold, but I really, really think it needs to be after everything else you can possibly do has been tried. There's a lot of stuff to do to before you get to that point.


                                • #17
                                  Why are you not trying Isoxsuprine? It's an old drug, but was extremly effective for a horse I used for CTR and endurance. We caught it in the early stages, changed her shoeing and did a treatment of isox. She competed for years and very succesfully.
                                  RIP Kelly 1977-2007 "Wither thou goest, so shall I"

                                  "To tilt when you should withdraw is Knightly too."


                                  • #18
                                    That is an excellent and accurate post, yellowbritches.
                                    Hindsight bad, foresight good.


                                    • #19
                                      You need to give him stall rest and deal with the suspensory first.
                                      The suspensory runs across the navicular, the pain is probably not solely the navic.
                                      If they nerve him and don't treat the suspensory they will in all likely hood blow that ligament, as he won't feel the need to protect the leg, hence traveling lame.
                                      In all reality how many performance horse don't x-ray bad.


                                      • #20
                                        Thanks Amanda! That approach to nerving makes complete sense. Glad to see the technique has advanced.
                                        HAS provides hospital care to 340,000 people in Haiti's Artibonite Valley 24/7/365/earthquake/cholera/whatever.
                                        www.hashaiti.org blog:http://hashaiti.org/blog