• Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.

Announcement

Collapse

Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.

Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 1/26/16)
See more
See less

North American Super Duper Multi-discipline Amalgamated Competition Association

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • North American Super Duper Multi-discipline Amalgamated Competition Association

    This is a thread for brainstorming. No idea is too silly or wrong!

    I could probably figure out how to put together a website that would collect the contact information of all the people interested in starting and supporting such an organization. It would be a way to get a sense of the number of people interested/the base of support. I am sure there is someone out there who would be more efficient than me - SPEAK UP!

    IF we created an organization called the North American Combined Training Association (NACTA) what would its mission be?

    The welfare of the horse.
    The support of the Classic format.
    The support of safe, educational, confidence building course design.

    If you could create the perfect organization, what would it do, what wouldn't it do? How would it communicate to its members?

    Start throwing ideas up against the wall. Let's see what sticks.
    Last edited by Gry2Yng; Jun. 4, 2009, 03:46 PM.
  • Original Poster

    #2
    First one

    FEI shall become known as "the organization that cannot be named" until we find our Harry Potter.

    Comment


    • #3
      need to think on the rest, but honestly... i *HATE* using "Combined Training" in the name. Loved it when everyone went to eventing and haven't looked back. Yes, you get "what's that?" kind of questions on eventing, but even moreso IMHO when you call it Combined Training. In addition, I don't think CT has the right connotations. It sounds like something you do to train for something else... and thus not important in and of itself.

      My 2 cents... devalued for the times of course.
      ************
      "Of course it's hard. It's supposed to be hard. It's the Hard that makes it great."

      "Get up... Get out... Get Drunk. Repeat as needed." -- Spike

      Comment


      • #4
        I guess, because I grew up when we were the United States Combined Training Association, I like going back to the USCTA.

        To me, combined training IS the essence of this sport. It is dressage, which trained the horse to compete in battle, combined with cross country, which showed that the horse could go for long distances, over any obstacle in it's way and stadium jumping, which showed that the horse had enough stamina to continue through battle. All of these, combined, made up the tests for the complete horse and horseman.

        If that did not make a bit of sense, please excuse me. I have been on cold and flu meds for about 10 days. I think that my brain is scrambled.
        When in Doubt, let your horse do the Thinking!

        Comment


        • #5
          I'm in, I like Combined Training as well. Are there going to be lower levels too? Why does anyone need the FEI? When I did CTR I belonged to ECTRA and we had our own year end awards sanctioned rides etc, is this what you're thinking of something like that? We run our own show so to speak.
          RIP Kelly 1977-2007 "Wither thou goest, so shall I"

          "To tilt when you should withdraw is Knightly too."

          Comment

          • Original Poster

            #6
            I would think much more emphasis on lower levels. Might not go above prelim?


            Asking for ideas. Not a fully formed concept. Also not necessarily taking about an overthrow. Just a place to get ideas as to what is important to those of us who have no desire to ever compete internationally or interact with the FEI. The question is just this...

            If you had an organization that represented EXACTLY your interests, what would that organization be and do?

            Comment


            • #7
              I can see this working. As an organization that supports, through its members, those events that embrace the vision of those members. The members would subcribe those horse trials that meet thier needs, volunteer at those trials, promote those trials. These could be both events that are USEA recognized as well as those who are not...jumping branch. Lets show the organizers that we are there to support those efforts. Voting with entries and time will make those events who do not share the vision of a fair, fun, and safe sport either conform or go out of business. Those that choose to foster the vision of the many (and not the few) will prosper.
              A forum/dedicated web page that discusses those events would be of benefit to those on board. A horse trials rating, networking for products and services, shared transportation, shared housing at events, open stalls available near events...ect

              This should be an organization with shared views, ideas, goals and rewards. It can certainly operate on its own whilst still embracing the sport of eventing. Year end awards for horses, riders, events etc would be a great way to foster a united stand to take back the sport at the training levels.

              I would be interested in fleshing this out further and have some time to devote to getting something like this off the ground.

              As I said, this organization would be indepedent and need not be endorsed by the USEA...hell who cares if it does not like it. I would be happy to support the USEA with those events that it recognizes...that embrace the vision of the NACTA. The others...no.
              Last edited by snoopy; Jun. 3, 2009, 05:14 PM.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Gry2Yng View Post
                FEI shall become known as "the organization that cannot be named" until we find our Harry Potter.


                I don't have any constructive input at the moment (except to say I agree with snoopy), but that seriously imperiled my Coke...
                Proud member of the EDRF

                Comment

                • Original Poster

                  #9
                  Originally posted by snoopy View Post
                  I would be interested in fleshing this out further and have some time to devote to getting something like this off the ground.

                  .
                  My first criteria/priority would be to adopt a set of standards as to what is appropriate for each level. What is educational, confidence building? Dressage test, fence size/question, speed, distance, etc. To me, it doesn't matter what happens internationally. Horses are generally safe and capable of recovering from a mistake at either 2'6", 3', 3'6" or beyond. I don't care about beyond. If it can jump 3'6" and still save my ass on occasion that is a preliminary horse. So, I have my preliminary xc horse. Now how much time and energy can I spend to make him competitive in the other two phases without compromising his xc ability and safety? The amount the average rider with the average amount of time could spend on the other two phases is the correct test. The rider with the above average talent and dedication should win. The average should feel satisfied and the below average should feel unprepared but not unsafe. They have the choice to drop down a level or work harder. The above average rider has the option to move up a level or continue to kick ass. We have to learn to accept that some riders will win and win and win. Eventually they have to start over because that is the nature of the sport.

                  I think Jimmy had a nice table in PH a while back. Maybe, with his permission we start there.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I may be out on a limb here, but I'd say we can leverage what we're good at here. CMP is always banging on about us nameless faceless know-it-alls behind our computer screens - as though very fast communication were a negative. I don't believe it is. And as a named and faced know-nothing numpty, I would like to think that we could minimise on the worrying about the name of the organisation, and the rule book ... and leverage word of mouth and camaraderie more effectively.

                    Why not ... why not have the lady from the previous thread have her courses known to be easy good first steps-up ? Why not have another course designer want to include a slightly more complex thingy at some level ... why not have every course designer able to come onto a board (say, ferinstance, this one) and say, 'this years XXX is really simple - the BN stadium is basically a hunter course at 2ft5 and all the XC jumps are logs and coops' ... or.... 'we're trying out a XXX jump for the first time at training level, and there will be an option around it' or whatever.

                    I'm desperate to see more schooling events, more baby lower level events (say, somewhere between x-poles, and maxed out BN oxers which scare my poor pony).

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      USEA current direction?

                      Don`t we already have a perfectly good USEA that should be doing all of this? Are they so misdirected that we need a brand new organization?

                      Yes, I`m cynical as hell about USEF, but is that also true of USEA? Please tell me it ain`t so!!

                      If there`s trouble at USEA, it`s trouble forced on them by USEF, that`s my guess.

                      I always thought USEF wore the black hats, USEA the white ones. Am I wrong?
                      http://www.tamarackhill.com/

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by denny View Post
                        Don`t we already have a perfectly good USEA that should be doing all of this? Are they so misdirected that we need a brand new organization?

                        Yes, I`m cynical as hell about USEF, but is that also true of USEA? Please tell me it ain`t so!!

                        If there`s trouble at USEA, it`s trouble forced on them by USEF, that`s my guess.

                        I always thought USEF wore the black hats, USEA the white ones. Am I wrong?
                        I agree Denny, lets fix what maybe broken, dont start from the bottom all over again
                        Cindy

                        Make any mistakes going forward!

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Gry2Yng View Post
                          FEI shall become known as "the organization that cannot be named" until we find our Harry Potter.
                          Or "That which we do not speak of" like in The Village

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            USEA may be handicapped by the structure of its relationship with USEF, but I agree with Denny that it's fundamentally a good, strong organization that whole-heartedly cares about the very priorities Gry just espoused. USEA has stood as firmly as it possibly can behind both promoting the welfare of the horse and in favor of the classic format, and USEA president Kevin Baumgardner is an enormous supporter of the classic format and of the lower levels and the amateur-rider (he is one himself). Rather than try to splinter off, I'd rather see time/energy spent lobbying the USEF Eventing Technical Committee, which is where alot of these changes/cough-boneheaded kneejerk rules-cough are made and trying to get more course designers and a stronger set of standards for what is proper and what is not at each level.

                            Comment

                            • Original Poster

                              #15
                              There is NOTHING in my posts that says anything about overthrowing or replacing the USEA. I was trying to float the idea that there might be a group of like minded people who can generate ideas and support each other. Not sure how the thought is any different than the Professional Riders Association. Perhaps choice of name made that implication. My intent was to show no exclusion for AA's and professionals and include Canadians, not to indicate that we would over throw the USEA.

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Whether splitting off or preferably? adding a subset to the existing USEA:

                                Do not have solid fences in cross country (think the image of war without it's guilt) and penalties for horses that crash through the safe fences (like paintball you get disqualified for a deadly hit). Reduce the technical mind-blowing fences that stun the horses and replace with forward riding fences that entice. Get the fatality level down to -at or below straight Dressage, Show Jumping or Endurance levels. No excuses.

                                Return the steeplechase and roads and tracks and get with some endurance folks to plan a venue and realistic vet checks, routing, etc. Stick to the 3-day format with a real endurance + CC day test. Use a modified endurance route, do laps like a car race if needed, but you've got to keep the endurance aspect in or it devolves to Dressage, Jump Race of Death, and Show Jumping, and that is just not what the sport is or was supposed to be. No specialist horse ought to be able to win due to their specialty aptitude alone.

                                One horse, one rider. At most two horses per rider, no matter the level. If it is about rider and horse working together, strings of horses are not in sync with that premise. Also eliminates the 'been over the course on horseback' advantage a multiple rider might have.

                                Fund a marketing /PR arm and emphasize the welfare of the horse, exhilaration factor, all the best points of the sport. Fund and follow recommendations for a data arm that covers medical/course design/dangerous riders/etc., etc. and make results available to the PR arm and membership. On that note, might take a lesson from NASCAR and teach participants in the spotlight how to thank the fans, spectators, course designer, venue sponsors, their trainer their horse, etc.

                                How to get any of that done?

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  My wish is for an organization that recognizes the needs of those who
                                  are out to have FUN doing eventing, whether they want to be
                                  competitive or not. The levels I would like to see would start
                                  much lower than BN, such as

                                  Level US height Canadian height

                                  Elementary 12" 30 cm
                                  Starter 18" 45 cm
                                  Introductory 24" 60 cm
                                  Beginner Nov 30" 75 cm
                                  Novice 36" 90 cm
                                  Training 42" 105 cm
                                  Preliminary 48" 120 cm

                                  The Elementary might also have a split for solo and with leader.
                                  The Training and Preliminary might have a special "All phases"
                                  competition which would have long format endurance phase.

                                  I noted that there is quite a bit of enthusiasm for very low level
                                  competition expressed in the thread about a very small cross
                                  country course.

                                  I would also like to see some attention in the rules to size of the
                                  enrollment in competition. Something like the way hunter shows
                                  are ranked as A, B, or C; I would like to see some requirement
                                  concessions for shows which will have fewer than 50 riders, those
                                  with up to 100 competitors, and then larger competitions. It just
                                  is not practical or affordable to supply all the requirements at a
                                  smaller competition. Things like farriers, vets, EMTs, food service,
                                  announcers, and more just are not cheap to budget and they just
                                  push the cost to competitors higher until few want to come play.
                                  Last edited by Robin@DHH; Jun. 4, 2009, 09:12 PM.
                                  Robin from Dancing Horse Hill
                                  Elmwood, Wisconsin

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    Originally posted by GotSpots View Post
                                    USEA may be handicapped by the structure of its relationship with USEF, but I agree with Denny that it's fundamentally a good, strong organization that whole-heartedly cares about the very priorities Gry just espoused. USEA has stood as firmly as it possibly can behind both promoting the welfare of the horse and in favor of the classic format, and USEA president Kevin Baumgardner is an enormous supporter of the classic format and of the lower levels and the amateur-rider (he is one himself). Rather than try to splinter off, I'd rather see time/energy spent lobbying the USEF Eventing Technical Committee, which is where alot of these changes/cough-boneheaded kneejerk rules-cough are made and trying to get more course designers and a stronger set of standards for what is proper and what is not at each level.
                                    I agree wholeheartedly with this and with denny. And I think that what we NEED to be doing is, rather than putting time and energy into starting a redundant organization put that time and energy into rattling cages at the USEF and banging some heads together and get the changes we need THERE done. The USEA is right there with all the things that are mentioned in the OP, but if people trot off to start another group and support that group instead of getting after those who need to be gotten after (the USEF and, the Big Game, the FEI), then it is going to be harder and harder to get the changes that we need.
                                    Amanda

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      I think in a sense we already have this, at least here in NC, we have the NCDCTA (Dressage and Combined Training). Some events are completely unrecognized schooling events, others NCDCTA recognized, other nationally recognized. Although I am not a member (like I need ANOTHER fee to pay), I do like the structure of it so that if a person is inclined to be a point-chaser, they can do so without necessarily having to commit to dumping all their money towards USEF and can keep it on an NCDCTA (much cheaper) level and still get year end awards.
                                      Life doesn't have perfect footing.

                                      Bloggily entertain yourself with our adventures (and disasters):
                                      We Are Flying Solo

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        I think Combined Training makes it sound like a combined training show, just dressage and showjumping.

                                        Something really original would be nice?
                                        Fillys By Vibank - 2017 Road to RRP
                                        https://www.youtube.com/user/jealoushe

                                        Comment

                                        Working...
                                        X