• Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.

Announcement

Collapse

Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.

Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 1/26/16)
See more
See less

Barefoot or former barefoot eventers @ Prelim and up . . .

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Barefoot or former barefoot eventers @ Prelim and up . . .

    Anybody know of any horses eventing barefoot at prelim or above? I am curious about how they made the choice between barefoot or studs. If you evented barefoot was there a certain point that you put shoes and studs on? What prompted that decision?
    I have a barefoot horse- he has FANTASTIC feet- and we did our first prelim in Oct 08 with no issues, but I am being advised that at some point i will need studs. There are so many benefits to being barefoot- his gaits improved dramatically when his shoes came off 3 years ago, better blood flow to his lower limbs, no lose/lost shoe situations to deal with, and definitely less expensive but i don't want to enter into this decision lightly nor do i want to risk my horse's well being.

    I want to know if anyone has been in my position and can offer any advice.
    Right now my plan is to compete barefoot at Pinetop and Chatt Hills and then put studs on for the rest of the season and compare results, way of going, etc.

    Did someone run barefoot at Kentucky**** last year? I heard a rumor, not sure of the validity, but i am curious all the same, can anyone verify?
    Lisa

    Founder of the *Barefoot Eventers Clique*

    Happiness is a state of mind according to how you look at things.. and whether or not you have a sound horse!

  • #2
    in the good ole days, bruce davidson would not shoe a horse at all until they went preliminary. that said, the training regiment for a typical bruce horse in the late 70's until...well probably now...included fairly intensive jumping (he would foxhunt the young ones 1-2 times per week barefoot). with the reputation of the cheshire hounds, i would say that would suffice to be equal to most preliminary events.

    he did it to build up strong limbs...so a little different rationale than you, however, the strategy seemed to work pretty well. i'd say you are probably pretty good, you'll just have to balance more and probably waste a few seconds in the deep going...otherwise you should be ok.

    Comment


    • #3
      I have competed up to prelim barefoot, but with a irish horse with amazing feet. He had been barefoot his entire life and evented with ralph hill to training level barefoot. He did pinetop, poplar, fence, jumping branch all barefoot but eventually I did put shoes on him it was hard to keep his feet up especially during the summer (his 1 white hoof always chipped) and I was always worried about footing and slipping. I havn't noticed too much of a difference with him with shoes, but it gives me peace of mind and options when the footing isn't so great.

      Comment


      • #4
        Several years ago I was stabled at event next to BNT/BNR Tiffany Loudon (now Meetz I think.) I didn't and don't know her at all, but I noted on the first day that both of her horses were barefoot even the one going Preliminary. I asked her about it and she said she didn't put shoes on until the horse let her know he needed them. But the same as the OP she found they had such great feet without shoes that she even pulled them on all her horses in the winter and thought it did a great deal of good.

        The next day she and her Prelim horse fell on XC. Dewey, wet morning and his back feet slipped out from under him on a strong turn into a fence and they went down hard. She came back to the barn and said he just told her it was time and that she was rethinking no shoes on Preliminary on general purposes.

        I think this was at Pine Top which has incredible footing so it was just a case of being slick on the surface of the grass. As good as the grip gets on a barefoot horse I tend to think once you get to Preliminary some of the turning demand and the morning dew is more likely better negotiated with studs. Although I too like to keep my young horses barefoot if I can.

        Comment

        • Original Poster

          #5
          I can see having options when the footing is less than ideal but i don't like the idea of using honking big bullets either- that has its own risks.
          Dante's feet don't chip at all anymore, for the last 2 years his feet have been almost perfect so i think that it is abnormal for his feet be able to hold up to all the work and maintain hoof integrity. He doesn't need shoes so that makes the decision harder, because the question is does he need studs? and how do i know if he needs them? sigh. . . .
          just read subk's post- that would be a huge sign perhaps that studs would be good. i would like to avoid that situation, so i don't want to miss the smaller signs indicating that he needs more traction, but studs don't guarantee that your horse won't fall either though, there in lies a quandry.
          Lisa

          Founder of the *Barefoot Eventers Clique*

          Happiness is a state of mind according to how you look at things.. and whether or not you have a sound horse!

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by nc_eventer View Post
            He doesn't need shoes so that makes the decision harder, because the question is does he need studs? and how do i know if he needs them? sigh. . . .
            Sometimes you just have to ask yourself what you personally can sleep with at night. Me? I think slipping barefoot and falling or loosing confidence while on course is more likely than hurting himself with studs in. But then I don't sleep in your bed. :wink:

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by raave05 View Post
              in the good ole days, bruce davidson would not shoe a horse at all until they went preliminary. that said, the training regiment for a typical bruce horse in the late 70's until...well probably now...included fairly intensive jumping (he would foxhunt the young ones 1-2 times per week barefoot). with the reputation of the cheshire hounds, i would say that would suffice to be equal to most preliminary events.

              he did it to build up strong limbs...so a little different rationale than you, however, the strategy seemed to work pretty well. i'd say you are probably pretty good, you'll just have to balance more and probably waste a few seconds in the deep going...otherwise you should be ok.
              He still doesn't with some! hahaha. His farrier was telling us his rationale the other day. Some are still barefoot behind at the bigger levels too... so I hear. Hey, It's Bruce man... clearly it works But not everyone rides like Bruce...

              Comment


              • #8
                Above Prelim, there have been a few barefoot horses but they are the rare exception. I know I haven't seen one at any of my competitions lately.

                At Intermediate and above there is too much risk in having a horse slip, especially at speed. I feel that studs (I use nothing bigger than small turfs in back and roads up front, even in heavy footing), give my horse confidence in his stability especially in the approach and getaway. And that is hugely important when the fences are big and complex. The last thing at those levels is your horse to slip out at a fence. Talk about a confidence breaker.

                Reed

                Comment


                • #9
                  Well, my mare just bumped up to Prelim last fall (she is coming 11 this year), has never been shod, and has fantastic feet. I figure if it aint broke, don't fix it!

                  She has great traction, is *very* surefooted, and never slips (unless the footing is greasy mud, in which case I don't ride her in it. I wouldn't run her on grass under those conditions anyway, or do x-country! That would be when I would opt to scratch, and might choose to scratch even if she *were* drilled and tapped all around, and wearing huge mud bullets! Just not worth the risk to me, since we are lucky enough--in Area 2--to have lots of HTs to choose from.)

                  I think she's a bit of an anomoly , since everyone is always flabbergasted when they find out she's barefoot (and she's done 2 years at T, plus schooled P questions at different venues at least 10 times, under a variety of conditions, before I bumped her up. She is just very careful and balanced by nature, and I really can't take any credit; I surely am not Bruce D! )

                  I think it just depends on the horse, IOW, and they WILL let you know if what you're doing is not working for them...
                  "Hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things, and no good thing ever dies."

                  "It's supposed to be hard...the hard is what makes it great!" (Jimmy Dugan, "A League of Their Own")

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I rode a sure-footed one at Prelim barefoot. He had grown up in the bush and was built like a tank. In fact we won a Training level HT in massive rain/mud because we were the only ones to make the time. The only reason we put on shoes was because I took a lesson with my coach's coach, who was aghast and said you couldn't ask a horse to do Prelim without shoes & the option of studs. We figured it would be rude to show up to another lesson unshod after that.

                    I rode in another rain/mud fest at Prelim with shoes & studs, and we did slip once or twice - but perhaps that was the faster speed, or a different type of soil/mud, or maybe I wasn't riding as strongly because I knew I had studs in?
                    Blugal

                    You never know what kind of obsessive compulsive crazy person you are until another person imitates your behaviour at a three-day. --Gry2Yng

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      My intermediate pony was barefoot until halfway through his first season at prelim. He is incredibly surefooted and sturdy, but at prelim (for me) it was def time for shoes and the extra hold studs provide, especially in Area II galloping up and down hills ( let alone the turning combinations). But I think your horse will tell you what he needs (or what will help you sleep the night before xc )
                      Courtney Sendak
                      www.defyinggravityeventing.com

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        The other issue to consider is your conditioning footing. I use dirt roads which can be rocky when things dry out and the risk of a stone bruise it too much to not use pads and shoes. But that's NH for you.

                        Another thing - the next step up from barefoot is not "big honkin' studs". Use only as necessary!

                        Some horses need more traction than others because of physical ability. Some don't care if they slip a little, some care a lot.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          As Hilary said, footing is key.

                          Almost all the horses went barefoot in FL, regardless of what level they were going. Coming back north, more required shoes because the footing isn't nearly as nice at many events.
                          -Jessica

                          Comment

                          • Original Poster

                            #14
                            i really appreciate everyone's input- thank you.
                            what specifically made you switch to studs? did your horse feel stiff in the shoulder when jumping, did he slip or slide around a turn, what were the small signs that indicated it was time for a change?
                            Lisa

                            Founder of the *Barefoot Eventers Clique*

                            Happiness is a state of mind according to how you look at things.. and whether or not you have a sound horse!

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              I ran my horse barefoot behind for his first 2-3 prelims because we couldn't get him shod behind with out tranq. and he had good feet. I never put studs on upfront if I don't have them behind so he was just fine and a couple of the events were pretty muddy.

                              I think it depends on the horse mostly, but I could see my self being hesitant to go for time and coming back earlier for turning questions if I wasn't confident in my horse's ability to turn.

                              If you live somewhere like Southern Pines and event around there then go for it. If you live in the midwest where the ground gets really hard in the summer and then really slick when it rains then you may end up wanting the shoes.

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                One other thing I'd add that you might not think of if you haven't done much riding at Preliminary and that's the scheduling. Most events where P is the highest division running will run it first, which means there is a much better possibility you're going to run in dew. Wet grass on top of a little bit harder turf might be the worst conditions to be stud-less

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  When my horse is unsure/slipping I feel their whole body is tight and less responsive. Not the fluid forwardness you are supposed to feel. This happens whereve they are slipping - out on the trail, in the dressage ring, right before that giant table off a tight turn.

                                  Do you live in a climate where you sometimes get ice on the ground? How do you walk when you're worried you're going to slip? All tense & tight and worried. That's how the horse feels under you. Not just "stiff in the left shoulder" type of thing.

                                  (if you don't live in such a climate, find a rink and go ice skating - you'll get the picture pronto)

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    With regards to "Save my poor precious bare feet! They look wonderful and I don't want to lose them!", I know where you are coming from.

                                    For the last 3 winters, I've pulled my mare's shoes in Oct/Nov. After two months barefoot, her feet look AMAZING. The chips and cracks grow out, her wall hardens, sole thickens, strong and tough. My farrier and I dread the day we put the shoes back on, but it is NECESSARY. I will not school Prelim+ xc without studs... I *might* consider it on awesome footing like FL or Pine Top, but Subk's story scares me. I'd never do it on normal (non-sandy) turf. I've seen too many horses slip without studs, and at Prelim+ the jumps are too big, too technical to recover safely.

                                    So, each spring 3wks before my first event (usually Jan/Feb, Mar this yr), the shoes (with stud holes) go back on. I mourn for a day or two () but I get over it... my mare doesn't seem to care one way or the other. Her feet hold up well, until the long dry summer catches up in August/Sept. By then, "the end" is in sight and I look forward to pulling her shoes again in October. She'll be a little tender for 3 wks, coinciding with her vacation-time, and then back to work barefoot.

                                    My point is: yes, studs are necessary. Until they find a way to screw studs into bare feet , ya gotta go with the shoes. But, never fear, your beautiful healthy bare feet will return as soon as you let them.
                                    “A clever person solves a problem. A wise person avoids it.”
                                    ? Albert Einstein

                                    ~AJ~

                                    Comment

                                    • Original Poster

                                      #19
                                      Eventer AJ- is the tree weeks enough time for your horse to adjust to wearing studs and shoes again? does she even notice a difference?
                                      thanks for everyone's help!
                                      Lisa

                                      Founder of the *Barefoot Eventers Clique*

                                      Happiness is a state of mind according to how you look at things.. and whether or not you have a sound horse!

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        Three weeks is plenty of time... She usually needs no "adjustment" period. I just like to have a couple weekends (w/ studs!) available to school xc before my event.
                                        “A clever person solves a problem. A wise person avoids it.”
                                        ? Albert Einstein

                                        ~AJ~

                                        Comment

                                        Working...
                                        X