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watched some 2000 Olympic tapes...

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  • watched some 2000 Olympic tapes...

    and i was kinda saddened... at
    1. the crappy dressage tests... perhaps they only like to show the bad ones, i dont' know... but the tests really were on the poor side... and a lot of it, as i think(may be wrong...) seemed to be rider error... lots of riders had really "loud" seats and simply couldn't do a lengthening or get their horse to bend... but from what i've heard, theses are improvements over the last Olympics...
    2. The fact that the narrator said for every other horse "this horse is fairly INEXPERIENCED at this level" or "had never seen stuff like this on course"...

    I mean- yes there are only a few 4*'s... and i guess in order to get the experiance, u kinda have to go out there and do it- but i was disappointed in the # of inexperienced people at THE OLYMPICS. but you can only use that excuse for #2, NOT #1... IMO, it's inexcuseable... I am very happy that the up and coming eventing people are focusing more on Dressage...

    I was also watching the various styles XC- i noticed the O'Conners(more karen then david) both lean lower while galloping as opposed to the rest who seemed to sit-up/stand more while galloping. Is that their way to encourage their horses? Or is that sposed to help in a different way? air resistance?? :P (sorry if the use of names bothers anyone, but i figure you can go look if ya need to to see what i mean)

    There were some horses on course that looked phenominal... Darian Powers for example *yummy* i would give to ride that horse on course... *drifts into dreamland* He also had a nice dressage test.

    Anyone else watched these? what are your opinions?

    ~laura~
    p.s. the whole david forgetting where to go in stadium makes me laugh out loud every time. [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img] [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif[/img]
    "Do you care, or don’t you care? Because if you do care, you better speak up now or take what you get."
    — Denny Emerson www.savethe3day.org
    **proud member of the trakehNERD group**
  • Original Poster

    #2
    and i was kinda saddened... at
    1. the crappy dressage tests... perhaps they only like to show the bad ones, i dont' know... but the tests really were on the poor side... and a lot of it, as i think(may be wrong...) seemed to be rider error... lots of riders had really "loud" seats and simply couldn't do a lengthening or get their horse to bend... but from what i've heard, theses are improvements over the last Olympics...
    2. The fact that the narrator said for every other horse "this horse is fairly INEXPERIENCED at this level" or "had never seen stuff like this on course"...

    I mean- yes there are only a few 4*'s... and i guess in order to get the experiance, u kinda have to go out there and do it- but i was disappointed in the # of inexperienced people at THE OLYMPICS. but you can only use that excuse for #2, NOT #1... IMO, it's inexcuseable... I am very happy that the up and coming eventing people are focusing more on Dressage...

    I was also watching the various styles XC- i noticed the O'Conners(more karen then david) both lean lower while galloping as opposed to the rest who seemed to sit-up/stand more while galloping. Is that their way to encourage their horses? Or is that sposed to help in a different way? air resistance?? :P (sorry if the use of names bothers anyone, but i figure you can go look if ya need to to see what i mean)

    There were some horses on course that looked phenominal... Darian Powers for example *yummy* i would give to ride that horse on course... *drifts into dreamland* He also had a nice dressage test.

    Anyone else watched these? what are your opinions?

    ~laura~
    p.s. the whole david forgetting where to go in stadium makes me laugh out loud every time. [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img] [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif[/img]
    "Do you care, or don’t you care? Because if you do care, you better speak up now or take what you get."
    — Denny Emerson www.savethe3day.org
    **proud member of the trakehNERD group**

    Comment


    • #3
      I agree with your comments about Darien Powers. If he is not the best example of what a true **** horse should be, I don't know who is!! [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]

      As to the galloping position thing, when galloping b/w fences and after you've been in the saddle for quite some time, you get fatigued, and I think that different riders have different ways of resting themselves. I went to a Dorothy Crowell clinic where she taught us to put our feet all the way home in the stirrups and point your toes down, while basically standing up in the stirrups and bridging your reins and pushing your knuckles into the horse's neck. I guess each person copes with fatigue and position differently?

      I haven't watched the 2000 tapes, but I have the 96 Atlanta 3-day one. I don't think the dressage was that bad there. I think you have to keep in mind that these horses are fighting fit and are getting ready to run and jump their hearts out in the next few days, so convincing them to be soft, supple, and relaxed is quite a task! [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gif[/img] [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif[/img]

      I'm not sure I know what you mean when you say that you are disappointed with the "inexperience" of some of the riders there. Who specifically are you referring to? Do you mean inexperience in the sense of never having been on the Olympic team or general lack of experience within the sport? Some of these riders may have never ridden for the Olympic team before, but have quite an impressive resume otherwise for international and 3 and 4 star competition. Maybe you are talking about some of the bizarre countries that scrounge up a cool horse and find some poor soul to stick up as a jockey and expect them to get around a **** course! [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gif[/img] (Remember the guy from the Atlanta games with the rainbow reins? [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif[/img] )

      Comment


      • #4
        I watched a tape that a friend got for a present of the Eventing portion of the Sydney Olympics and the number of crashes they showed really bothered me. There was one combination that my heart was in my throat on almost every single rider and near the end of the XC portion, I realized that about 3 had gone through beautifully, the rest were all (for me) OMG moments.

        It wasn't my tape, so I can't watch it again, but I didn't find the dressage bad and enjoyed the tape.

        As for the crashes in eventing, that has been hashed, rehashed and then fought about again here, so for THAT discussion, there are a bazillion threads you could read up on.

        Mel

        Comment


        • #5
          about your dressage comments as well. I have this tape and have watched it several times. They did show some of the bigger "names," and Blyth's test on Ready Teddy was explosive - they prefaced that in the tape (and he scored badly on it too). From what I remember, they showed most of Darien Powers test (I thought he looked lame), Pippa Funnell's portion on Supreme Rock (she got a 10 on her extended walk, despite the fact that he broke), Karen's test on Prince Panache (did you notice cantering down centerline that her right stirrup is about 2 holes longer than her left?). But, I still think the riding was good - just questioned some of the scoring. There is a difference. And what on Earth is a "loud" seat? Is that the same as an electric seat?

          What always bothers me about these tapes is they are produced by the BBC, and have such an obvious bias toward the UK/European riders. And their factual errors just kill me!

          Robby

          I see a stairway so I follow it down
          Into the belly of a whale
          Where my secrets echo all around ...
          When blood is the beverage of choice, the sharpest fangs feed first.

          Comment


          • #6
            <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Robby Johnson:
            What always bothers me about these tapes is they are produced by the BBC, and have such an obvious bias toward the UK/European riders. And their factual errors just kill me!
            <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

            No no no no no!!

            The British commentators are so much better than the North American ones it is not funny. If this is the same tape I have, isn't the man narrating Mike Tucker, one of the course designers? I think I remember the odd factual error (horse/rider mixed up etc) but nothing major, and certainly nothing as bad as what the americans do to their coverage of horsesport!

            As for bias, well, what do you expect? Its the BBC - of course they will show more British/Euro riders. It works both ways - watch any american coverage of the olympics and you'd think you guys were the only ones competing there! I'm serious! I watched some of NBC's coverage, and when they announced results of a given sport, they'd say something like "Sally Jane of the US got a Silver today" then fail to mentioned who/which countries won the gold or the bronze! now that is bad! [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif[/img]

            I guess I've always found I would far rather watch equestrian sports that were produced by the BBC than North America. I've watched tons of showjumping etc. and there is no better equestrian commentator in my mind than Peter Churchill - that man knew showjumping inside out, and he was not the least bit biased and made the most intelligent comments (nor did he mince words when a rider made a mistake!!). Find one of his tapes sometime Robby - bet you'll love him! [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_cool.gif[/img]
            You Strike Me Still

            Comment


            • #7
              and bias is extremely apparent when David O'Connor's list of accomplishments during the commentary from Sydney - by the Brits - does not include the fact that he won Badminton in 1997 aboard the horse that won the gold medal at Sydney.

              Listen to the commentary and if you follow the sport, in America, you will hear the factual errors they report (I'll have to watch it again to pinpoint some others) but when you say, "so-and-so, third at ________," when in fact the person didn't compete there, or won there, whatever, that is an error of fact. That is irresponsible journalism.

              Eventing Magazine is horrible about factual errors as well. They actually had a story before WEG that said the US hadn't finished a three-day team since 1990, which was entirely not true. We didn't finish a team in the Hague, but we actually finished 4th in Pratoni, then upgraded to bronze when the British team was eliminated due to the Polly Phillips/Coral Cove doping scandal. Hello?

              I'm not British-centric, but fair play is fair play. It's no wonder, though ... their tabloid/paparrazzi media has really turned the entire world of journalism upside down.

              It is interesting to see your perspective, though, as a neutral in all of this!

              R.

              I see a stairway so I follow it down
              Into the belly of a whale
              Where my secrets echo all around ...


              [This message was edited by Robby Johnson on Nov. 20, 2002 at 12:35 PM.]
              When blood is the beverage of choice, the sharpest fangs feed first.

              Comment


              • #8
                I gotta agree with Jair about the commentary.
                Yeah, they are biased toward the British riders, but they are making the tape to be marketed in Great Britain - its a BBC production.

                I have the tape of the Atlanta Olympics and it is pathetic.
                It's one of the announcers that you hear doing figure skating, skiing, sometimes football, obviously has NEVER seen a horse go.
                His comments are primarily "wow", "look at that", "gee they must be fit" repeated ad nauseum.
                Everyonce in a while Jill Walton chimes in and tries to explain something, but is mostly cut off.
                It was TERRIBLE! I have several tapes like this, made here.

                At least the BBC commentators are horsemen and cover the equestrian events on a regular basis.
                Personally I love the aside comments, they used to be really nasty about rider errors, they have toned it down lately. I thought they were great.

                I don't buy tapes anymore unless the commentators are somebody like Jamie Hawksfield or Mike Tucker, the football announcers need to stick to football (I'm sure they would rather also [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif[/img] it can't be fun to try to comment on a sport that you don't know anything about.)

                BarbB
                charter member BEQS Clique & Invisible Poster Clique

                ...virtue shall be bound into the hair of thy forelock... I have given thee the power of flight without wings. - The Koran
                Nina's Story
                Epona Comm on FB

                Comment


                • #9
                  <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> and i was kinda saddened... at
                  1. the crappy dressage tests... perhaps they only like to show the bad ones, i dont' know... but the tests really were on the poor side... and a lot of it, as i think(may be wrong...) seemed to be rider error... lots of riders had really "loud" seats and simply couldn't do a lengthening or get their horse to bend... but from what i've heard, theses are improvements over the last Olympics... <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                  I'm not sure what you mean by this. First, I don't think it's true. Custom Made had, I believe, the highest scored dressage test ever in the Olympics. We can discuss bias in judging or score inflation, but I don't think anyone can fairly say that Tailor can't do a lengthening or bend properly. Ditto many of the other riders. They may have focuses on some of the horses who exploded, but I think if you talk to people who were there, much of the dressage being done at FEI events is now competitive with that being done at dressage only competitions. Second, a 4 star fit TB trying to do a dressage test at that level is somewhat like trying to keep a pyromaniac away from a gallon of gasoline. I've never ridden a 4-star fit TB, but I can tell you that I've ridden horses fit for a one or two star that are hard to manage in the dressage ring because they are so puffed up with themselves they can't see straight. Think of Three Magic Beans, Nina's wonderful horse who is well known to be quite difficult in the dressage, but a machine x-c. There are many others who are similar. Sometimes what you may be interpreting as poor riding, may be the most tactful thing that rider could do on that day to keep the horse in the ring.

                  Comment

                  • Original Poster

                    #10
                    There is no doubt that some of the riding was awesome- i.e. custom made and darian powers... swizzle in i beleive did a nice job too.

                    but even andrew hoy had some of the same mistakes made w/ both his horses... watch closely next time. (ya, no1's perfect, but they were, IMO, simple-ish mistakes)

                    I liked the free walk pippa did- but that was, well... why the hell was she moving so gosh darn mucho!? "loud", since i couldn't think of another word yesterday. If it takes that much to encourage your horse to go forward... then by all means- do it... but i found it... "loud" [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif[/img] i like to use odd words for things sometimes... deal with me [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gif[/img] but how come your average upper level Dressage rider never moves that much?... eh- i dunno

                    then the other horses they showed couldn't seem to put in a nice extended trot- some only had one decent step- but i saw no suspension, just fast running-ness that all went out the back door... I geuss i expected more from riders at the Olympics. There were maybe 3 tests i watched where i wasn't constantly going "ouu, boo-boo there... and there... and there too". I watched it many times to watch the varrying riding styles, and i wasn't too impressed with the Dressage... working with a GP Dressage instructor has obviously started to do something to me [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_eek.gif[/img] [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_eek.gif[/img] someone save me now! [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gif[/img] i hated dressage 2 years ago... *shudder*

                    It makes ya wonder tho- how come the people who do so well in dressage, *generally* do well XC?? and then watching stadium and seeing some people who weren't even bending their horses- they were going around with thier noses stuck to the outside- and then they knock 3 rails... kinda makes me go - HEY, DRESSAGE. I dunno- i am an avid beleiver in that Dressage is sooooo very very important-ay. And yes- they are extremely fit/hotish horses, but When properly doing dressage, your horse should be relaxed and calm/content and happy in his work. is that not right?

                    but i mean, what is that test equal to? maybe an upper 3rd level, low fourth level test? It shouldn't be too difficult with correct training- and i did notice the people with multiple horses did seem to do well in all 3 phases (andrew hoy, both the O'Conners...)so obviously they are doing something right that the others aren't (yeah, lots of exceptions, but a rider who has consistently good dressage horses that consistently do well is my point)... ? Is that an ok hypothesis to make? (please correct me if any of ya'll think i'm wrong) Also, the top 2 teams all finished with great dressage scores and few mistakes- perhaps their teams are doing something correctly that the rest aren't (dressage?), and now the US is lowering their dressage scores and doing much better.

                    ehhh. i can't think right now [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif[/img] need a break.

                    ~laura~
                    "Do you care, or don’t you care? Because if you do care, you better speak up now or take what you get."
                    — Denny Emerson www.savethe3day.org
                    **proud member of the trakehNERD group**

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      so...please share your best dressage score at a three day! [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_confused.gif[/img]

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        If you are comparing eventing dressage to 4th Level Dressage - you are making a very unfair comparison.

                        In eventing dressage there are no collected gaits.
                        Gaits are working, medium and extended - NO collection.
                        The only lateral movement is a short half pass.
                        No turns on haunches.
                        There is some shoulder-in.
                        There is no haunches-in.
                        There are only two flying changes (I think - somebody correct me here.)
                        The advanced eventing test is really more like 2nd Level dressage - but even 2nd Level has collected gaits.
                        So maybe 1st Level plus a little.

                        It is intended to show the obedience and adjustability of the horse, not demonstrate advanced dressage.

                        [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]

                        BarbB
                        charter member BEQS Clique & Invisible Poster Clique

                        ...virtue shall be bound into the hair of thy forelock... I have given thee the power of flight without wings. - The Koran
                        Nina's Story
                        Epona Comm on FB

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BarbB:
                          If you are comparing eventing dressage to 4th Level Dressage - you are making a very unfair comparison.

                          In eventing dressage there are no collected gaits.
                          Gaits are working, medium and extended - NO collection.
                          The only lateral movement is a short half pass.
                          No turns on haunches.
                          There is some shoulder-in.
                          There is no haunches-in.
                          There are only two flying changes (I think - somebody correct me here.)
                          The advanced eventing test is really more like 2nd Level dressage - but even 2nd Level has collected gaits.
                          So maybe 1st Level plus a little.

                          It is intended to show the obedience and adjustability of the horse, not demonstrate advanced dressage.

                          <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                          There are now 4 flying changes in the 4* test, and I believe they show haunches in now too (in addition to shoulder-in) and medium and extended trots and canters.

                          The horse 1/2 passes both ways.

                          Robby

                          I see a stairway so I follow it down
                          Into the belly of a whale
                          Where my secrets echo all around ...
                          When blood is the beverage of choice, the sharpest fangs feed first.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I'm with Jair on the British announcers. Love Mike Tucker and Peter Churchill, and I also like commentators like Lucinda Green and Lorna Clarke. They're colorful, enthusiastic and expressive.

                            The British videos show a lot more horses and riders than the Rolex videos -- you get to see a good number of competitors as opposed to the half dozen or so that you see at Rolex (when they showed the top 10 results at the end, my kid commented that she didn't know from watching the tape that there were even 10 entries).

                            As for factual errors, there's bound to be a few mistakes and most you can forgive. But there was no excuse for the NBC commentator at Sydney referring to the defending Olympic and current World champion Ready Teddy as 'inexperienced'.

                            Comment

                            • Original Poster

                              #15
                              Ok, so i don't have a horse that can do a 4 star, but i have done all those movements... Some with my leased mare (whos an 11 year old green bean w/o any training on her til this year, and is not a naturally talented horse- i can't afford my own [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif[/img]) and some with my trainers horse... But i am not saying i'm perfect or anything- far from. I never said i was. Only been riding for 7 years- eventing for 3, "into" dressage the past 2... I don't call myself a professional rider (a hopeful one tho )and don't want to be thought of as one... But if i had a horse of that calibur and with that talent I would hope i would spend the time and train him/her properly... Why rush? savor the time spent with your horse. Ya- professionals don't have time, blah blah blah... ok- so then don't do well... dunno what to say to that. Dressage takes time.

                              so then shouldn't that make it easier? (in reference to the 1st level plus test... i thought it was 2nd level, but wasn't sure where halfpass and extensions came in in what is commonly called "normal" dressage (so i don't get eatten for saying eventing dressage and dressage dressage are different... since, IMO they aren't either...)) o- and go check your omnibus- there is LOTS and LOTS of collected canter work... 11 movements including it actually. 7 in the 3* tests as well. (if numbers make a difference, i don't know... but ya)

                              But that's not my point. I dont care about what movements they have to do...

                              and as far as i know "dressage" means training... These horses should be trained(i'd hope they are anyways)... they have forever and a half to prepare, to move up... why rush up the levels and get a 60 at rolex when you can move up slower, establish your dressage and get a 30?? That helps the jumping as well. As fun as it is to see an 8 year old at rolex, sometimes I question that... I don't know how they place in reference to age, but I have noticed numorous older horses (custom made, giltedge, prince panache, Darian powers- to name a few) that have "been on the eventing scene" start to win at the end of their careers- perhaps because they are finally relaxing more and their dressage got better as the years went along?

                              and besides, what is a grand prix dressage horse? They are not exactly fat little lumps. They are hott too- the muscles they build are incredible. And yet they manage to control themselves- how? through relaxation and correct work. I am sick of the excuse that eventing horses are too hott... why aren't they relaxed??? You can be fit and relaxed and energetic... isn't that how it *should* be? (since it apparently ISN'T that way now...) I would like to think that if a horse is trained properly, 9 times out of 10 you will have a quality test (since we all have had the joy to experiance our horses having an off day [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif[/img] [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gif[/img]).

                              Am i alone when i say dressage is the foundation of eventing? My barn is huge on dressage, and i have witnessed first hand the extreme differences in a horse properly trained in Dressage that scores LOW in it and horses that score high. More times then not the "dressage-ier" horse places better. In a clinic, i watched the difference in my trainers horses compared to the others there- i watch my trainer and her daughter execute ADVANCED level questions (huge drop fence, 2 strides to a huge-butt corner, and some stadium exercises w/ 4' arrowhead to corner, skinny...etc...) pretty damn well... even though they were in the *training level* group, and YES the Olympian clinician said the exercise was advanced- you may call him up and ask about the horses if you like, he is very keen on them... interestingly enough, the people in the prelim group didn't do this exercise, and their dressage was... lacking?

                              I dunno, perhaps i will go research results in reference to age, and dressage scores... Let ya know what i find out [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]

                              ~laura~
                              "Do you care, or don’t you care? Because if you do care, you better speak up now or take what you get."
                              — Denny Emerson www.savethe3day.org
                              **proud member of the trakehNERD group**

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                              • Original Poster

                                #16
                                i was also curious when they said welton envoy was inexperienced- hadn't he just won rolex earlier that year? [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_confused.gif[/img]
                                "Do you care, or don’t you care? Because if you do care, you better speak up now or take what you get."
                                — Denny Emerson www.savethe3day.org
                                **proud member of the trakehNERD group**

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                                • #17
                                  the dressage test that we are talking about - performed at the Sydney Olympics.......was NOT the equal of an upper level dressage test.

                                  I am not familiar with the new advanced level tests, perhaps they are more difficult than they have been in the past. Though I doubt seriously (without looking) that they have been suddenly stepped up to an entirely different type of test.

                                  As for "dressage being the basis for eventing"

                                  ......uh, no.

                                  BarbB
                                  charter member BEQS Clique & Invisible Poster Clique

                                  ...virtue shall be bound into the hair of thy forelock... I have given thee the power of flight without wings. - The Koran
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                                  • #18
                                    ok bigdreamer, first let me say that I agree that dressage is correct trailing and helps the horse out in the jumping phases.

                                    But as to comparing the "hotness" of Dressage Horses verses four star fit event TB's well its sort of like comparing apples and cumquatts. For example take two horses same breed, same age, same temperment. One you ride in an arena W-T-C and maybe some hacking out in the fields. The second horse you do all that AND let em run fast out in a field, fast over fences and etc. Now which horse will be hotter? Will probablly the second one, he's anticipating the galloping around part. Simplistic example I know but that is the best way I can explain it.

                                    As to the Sydney tapes, I have it and have only watched it once. I remember that the Greek horse was lovely in dressage, but wasn't up to snuff out on the cross country course. I can't remember why.

                                    And I agree that the American commentators can do a rotten job. At Atlanta the guy commentator said that Giltage was a Quarter Horse. I was like no way, way to go Quarter Horses!! But then I found out that he's really an Irish Tb (right???)

                                    I'd like to add that I went to the regional dressage championships last month over here in Virginia and was Really impressed with some truley rotten riding, lame horses, and other sights that I was not expecting to find at the championship level. BUT I also saw some really good rides, lovely horses and courteous riders. The good and the bad are out there if you look hard enough for them. And we riders seem to LOVE nitpicking every little thing.....

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                                    • #19
                                      I attended the WEG in Jerez. After three days of watching straight dressage, I watched the fourth section of the eventing dressage. I was surprised at the number of horses pulling themselves along on their forehand with their hocks trailing out behind. It must be incredibly difficult for the horse to perform movements correctly from that position.

                                      From what I've been reading Mark Phillips is also telling the American riders that they have to improve their dressage. I believe the Australians improved their team dressage score by something like 30 points between the 1996 Olympics and the 2000 ones. They recognized that their jumping talent was not going to allow them to stay on top and made a concerted effort to improve their weakest phase. It certainly paid off for them. I'm amazed that more eventers don't turn to some of our talented dressage trainers for assistance...and not just in the run up to the Olympics.

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                                      • #20
                                        First, JER, my comments weren't intended to turn this into an American commentator vs. British commentator thing. British commentators *are* really stellar. My gripe was with the fact that when Brits are commenting on those outside the European circuit, they often don't report the facts and IMO they *do* show bias. Your comment on NBC's explanation of Ready Teddy also supports that America is just as guilty here. The blanket assertion here is for producers and directors and development staff to ensure the commentators have all pertinent facts checked so they can commentate appropriately.

                                        Trust me, nothing pains me more than to sit through the OLN broadcast of Rolex. But, like you, I'm a significant armchair quarterback and I just know I could do better. [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img]

                                        AM, I know a few upper level event riders who work regularly with talented dressage folk. I know Julie (Burns Richards) works with Gunnar Ostergaard, and Darren (Chiacchia) works with Jessica Ransehausen. I think as soon as the judges start dinging them on "trailing hocks" and "pulling along the forehand" you will definitely see a rush toward better dressage. Also, don't forget that the USET Three-Day riders receive significant training from Sandy Pflueger-Phillips, herself a respected dressage rider and trainer.

                                        Robby

                                        I see a stairway so I follow it down
                                        Into the belly of a whale
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