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Rider Fitness, And "Stickability"

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  • #41
    I paused the video of BH's fall for an almost frame-by-frame look. Teddy left his left front leg back at the fence and didn't manage to get it under him in time to prevent a significant stumble. He went down on both knees and planted his face on the turf and started to roll to the right before correcting himself. IMHO, it sure looked like physics were in play and the rider, whoever if happened to be, was going to be leaving that saddle.
    Hindsight bad, foresight good.

    Comment


    • #42
      Will was the one shown bent over after his round.
      Hindsight bad, foresight good.

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      • #43
        Originally posted by Judysmom View Post
        JER- interesting article about diet. It is amazing how different we all are. I do best with a high carb/ low fat/ lots of veggies diet. I feel disgusting if I eat too much fat/meat/dairy. And I get severe digestive issues from Atkins style diet LOL.
        That's one of Noakes's major points -- that what works for him might be totally wrong for someone else. And, even for a doctor and a scientist like Noakes, the process of figuring out a good (for him) diet wasn't quick or easy. The average person doesn't have his expertise or resources, and many people get turned off to 'dieting' when it just doesn't seem to work for them.

        There is also a segment of the population which doesn't 'improve' via exercise. Study here. IIRC, a writer for the Guardian embarked on a fitness program which he was to chronicle for the paper, then discovered, during his report on genetic factors, that he was in this category.

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        • #44
          Originally posted by JER View Post
          There is also a segment of the population which doesn't 'improve' via exercise. Study here. IIRC, a writer for the Guardian embarked on a fitness program which he was to chronicle for the paper, then discovered, during his report on genetic factors, that he was in this category.
          Very interesting-- i wonder why that hasn't gotten more professional & layperson media attention? also, it doesn't mention cardiac muscle, just skeletal, though it aerobic capacity is part of that (btw, can't access the full article). all in all, it would further reiterate that genes decide body's shape & style--our tall lanky WFP and our shorter curvy BH. Does the article touches on what's most easily modifiable genetic potential across all gene pools?
          bringing us right back to the OP....

          maybe the student just isn't that fab of a rider and her aerobic capacity has nothing to do with it? (in all seriousness).
          And the wise, Jack Daniels drinking, slow-truck-driving, veteran TB handler who took "no shit from no hoss Miss L, y'hear," said: "She aint wrapped too tight."

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          • #45
            Originally posted by JER View Post
            Not true. Getting around Rolex, or even trying and failing to get around Rolex, does not mean you are 'mega-fit'. Some of the riders on display did not look very fit at all.

            Most of the riders are 'riding fit', in that they can ride a number of horses per day, but there was a distressing number of riders who couldn't/didn't hold a strong, balanced gallop/jump position around the course.
            About 10 years ago or more, I attended Rolex with a group of people that included a woman who was both a rider and a personal trainer. Her comment to me as we watched the riders walk the stadium course was how astounded she was at how unfit the riders were. She commented on the inequality of it all, how the horses are so super duper fit and the riders are still fluffy. Wasn't much that I could say. She wasn't beating up on body image, she was commenting on fitness.

            I remember reading an article by Darren C talking about rider fitness and he said that he ran his Xc courses, and I thought, humm... good idea. Got to be fit enough to run that sucker on foot before you ride it on horseback.

            All of this is easy for me to say, horse has been injured for some time, I'm fluffy and out of shape and neither one of us is running xc any time soon.

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            • #46
              Seriously though, if you are trying to use 'core strength' to stay on a horse, that is a loosing battle. You have to FOLLOW in order to stay with the horse. If you try to use core strength, you will just be fighting against forces much larger than yourself.

              It seems like I am the dissenter here, but I don't think that STAYING ON has much to do with how strong or fit you are. Trust me, I stay on 99% of the time when I should be flat on my face, and I am not fitter than you. I think it's because I ride like a sack of rocks.
              Founder & President, Dapplebay, Inc.
              Creative Director, Equestrian Culture Magazine
              Take us to print!

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              • #47
                Originally posted by NRB View Post
                She commented on the inequality of it all, how the horses are so super duper fit and the riders are still fluffy. Wasn't much that I could say. She wasn't beating up on body image, she was commenting on fitness.
                Agree completely. This was in evidence last weekend.

                Originally posted by NRB View Post
                I remember reading an article by Darren C talking about rider fitness and he said that he ran his Xc courses, and I thought, humm... good idea. Got to be fit enough to run that sucker on foot before you ride it on horseback.
                On Thursday at the lunch break, I met up with olympicdreams04 (liveblogging for EN) and my older sister, and we ran the XC from start box to finish flags. It was an awesome run -- great grass footing, lots of terrain, ditches and water to jump, a beautiful day. Along the way, we discussed rider fitness or lack thereof, but then olympicdreams04 and I do pentathlon, she also gallops racehorses and can hold a gallop position for days, and my sister is a mega-miles endurance athlete.

                My sister, who knows nothing about eventing at all but has been immersed in the world of pro sports for her entire adult life, made the observation that, of the riders she saw out walking the course, two actually looked like athletes -- those two were Mary King and WFP.

                (We also had the bright idea that there should be a people race over the XC course after the event. Obstacle races are booming, the course is all roped already, and who wouldn't want to run a CCI****? )

                Comment


                • #48
                  There's Youtube footage - Mike Matson probably posted it -of people running a XC course and climbing over the jumps. I think it's a brilliant idea and would be great for a fundraiser.

                  Regarding the inequality issue -that's why I went back to the gym. I felt like why was I putting my horse in training to carry a sack of potatoes?

                  Paula
                  He is total garbage! Quick! Hide him on my trailer (Petstorejunkie).

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                  • #49
                    ^ ^

                    To be fair though, one can be fit without being a runner. Some people don't like to run... some people just plain aren't good at running. Doesn't mean they're not fit. So to say that one should be able to run their XC before riding it isn't entirely valid.

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                    • #50
                      Originally posted by JER View Post
                      (We also had the bright idea that there should be a people race over the XC course after the event. Obstacle races are booming, the course is all roped already, and who wouldn't want to run a CCI****? )
                      Love it! It has been a while (decade!?) since I've done any running but I would train to do that. Great fundraising idea - I'm sure there would be a great cause to raise some money for.

                      I'm still in shock over the fact that WFP is 167 pounds.. OMG 24 pounds heavier and one full foot taller than me. Wowzers!!

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                      • #51
                        I think it would be brilliant. I don't run, but I'd give it a shot. I think it would be fun, even if you walk to the tree, scramble over the tree, walk to the water hazard, get wet, walk to the shrubbery.... it would still be quite a trek!

                        Paula
                        He is total garbage! Quick! Hide him on my trailer (Petstorejunkie).

                        Comment


                        • #52
                          Originally posted by La Chasse View Post
                          as someone whose own mass is above my knees and below my waist genetics is part of your body shape & size. gotta look at the family-- like in horses-- to see if the one specimen is normal for that family or an aberration. my dad's side of the family all has junk in the trunk- some big, some small, but its centered there. people & riders may weigh less or more but their body shape doesn't change all that much.
                          Hmm, I have to disagree. I'm the same shape, the only place I put weight on is my hips and thighs. I was about a stone overweight (5'10", 11 stone.) I tried to lose it, for quite a long time, and my family (not riders) all said "that's just the shape you are" etc.
                          Then I got into serious low-carbing and it went. I lost over a stone and at 10 stone I looked (and felt) totally different. Just because that is where my body wants to store fat, doesn't mean it has to be there...
                          It's tough. I got out of the regime and need to get back into it as strictly. But it IS doable for just about anyone imho. But of course I am not a medic or a nutritionist etc.

                          There's been quite a lot of research done on the fact that exercise, while it makes you fitter of course, often doesn't help you lose weight. For most people it increases appetite, for starters. iirc I read a few places where it said the original '60s study that claimed fitness = weight loss was deeply flawed.

                          Rider Fitness is being taken seriously in the UK. Companies like Advance Performance (http://www.advanceperformance.co.uk/) are working with Oliver Townend, Sharon Hunt and Francis Whittington, doing gait analysis, V02 fitness tests, special running and course-walking shoes, fitness regimes etc. At Badminton this week I expect there might be one or two riders who are not fit enough, at most. The lower levels are a different matter but hopefully it will trickle down.
                          If a rider was riding a hard-pulling horse, for e.g., at Rolex, that would imho excuse him for being out of breath at the finish. Doesn't mean he wasn't fit enough, just means he had a good work-out!

                          Btw, whoever thought WFP and Mary King were the only two who looked like athletes maybe didn't see the whole field at Rolex! pmsl.

                          Comment


                          • #53
                            Whenever people have the weight and riding argument someone always brings up Becky. Look, she's a bigger rider and she's been around Rolex. I must be fine. Etc.

                            However, Becky has spoken several times about the huge difference in her ability to ride well that was made after she lost some weight. I think that anyone who rides around Rolex is not only fitter but much more talented then I will ever be and if one of them commented on losing weight making them ride better it must be at least a bit true so it's not fair for someone to use them as an example of why they don't become fitter.
                            http://weanieeventer.blogspot.com/

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                            • #54
                              Yes, people are very definitely predisposed to a certain body shape and body type. Just like we are genetically programmed to have our cholesterol in a certain range.

                              Where we actually lie on that range depends on what we put into our bodies and how much work we ask of them.

                              You can't change your genetic "range", but you can decide where on that range you actually sit.
                              Click here before you buy.

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                              • #55
                                I don't think anybody is using them as an excuse not to get fitter. I think we all understand and agree that fitness makes your riding better. I think the discussion arises when people might conflate fitness with being skinny.

                                Paula
                                He is total garbage! Quick! Hide him on my trailer (Petstorejunkie).

                                Comment


                                • #56
                                  Originally posted by JER View Post
                                  (We also had the bright idea that there should be a people race over the XC course after the event. Obstacle races are booming, the course is all roped already, and who wouldn't want to run a CCI****? )
                                  IIRC, a local trail-running series did exactly this at Plantation Field the weekend after the CIC*** last fall. The run was one of several events held at Plantation that weekend to benefit conservation of open space.
                                  I evented just for the Halibut.

                                  Comment


                                  • #57
                                    Love the idea of a post-XC fun run! I might actually even motivate myself to train for that, although usually I'm knackered after XC day from hauling 25 pounds of shopping booty from one end of the course to the other!
                                    Click here before you buy.

                                    Comment


                                    • #58
                                      The Sunday Morning Rolex "Jog After the Jog!" I think that would be great fun for those that want to participate. The rest of us can cheer you on while eating Spalding's donuts. Something for everyone.
                                      Hindsight bad, foresight good.

                                      Comment


                                      • #59
                                        Originally posted by kerilli View Post
                                        Btw, whoever thought WFP and Mary King were the only two who looked like athletes maybe didn't see the whole field at Rolex! pmsl.
                                        kerilli, that's true. But that's also what my post said -- my sister was commenting only on the riders that she saw out walking the course while we were running.

                                        Comment


                                        • #60
                                          Originally posted by Badger View Post
                                          The rest of us can cheer you on while eating Spalding's donuts. Something for everyone.
                                          I've never heard of Spalding's Donuts, but now I plan to run the race with one in each hand. That would be perfect.

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