• Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.

Announcement

Collapse
1 of 2 < >

Event Announcements now available FREE to all registered users

We just reconfigured the Event Announcements forum to be available as a free service for all registered forum users. See the thread stuck at the top of that forum for more information.
2 of 2 < >

Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.

Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 1/26/16)
See more
See less

Gray OTTBs ....

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts
  • Original Poster

    #21
    Originally posted by deltawave View Post
    But track horses who are gray are typically at that "gorgeous" phase of their lives--dapples everywhere, etc. They make a pretty picture, and eye candy must sell at least on some level! A dark bay with four stockings and a blaze will automatically be marked up, too, because they're uncommon.
    That's true ... Most of the OTTBs being sold directly from the track are in that age group wherer they are lovely, dark dappled gray ... And it's amazing how many people don't seem to realize that they all eventually turn white or flea bitten. And there does seem to be a bit of a premium on chrome, too ... Just maybe not quite to the extent that there is on grays.

    Comment


    • #22
      Gimme a grey with black legs and a black mane and tail and I will swoon like no one's business. Now I have owned a few greys and not only are they a PITA to keep clean but every nick and scrape can be seen from a mile away and if its an old cow pony a few well placed black scars look like they have been through world war three. But alas I love them though color is not a deciding factor for me. On the other hand if I have the choice between a bay with no markings or a chestnut with no markings, I always head for the chestnut. Anything other than bay for me.
      Adoring fan of A Fine Romance
      Originally Posted by alicen:
      What serious breeder would think that a horse at that performance level is push button? Even so, that's still a lot of buttons to push.

      Comment


      • #23
        My previous horse was a grey, wasn't looking for that color in particular, he was so lovely, big dapples, wasn't why I bought him but he sure was pretty and made alot of people swoon. In the three years I owned him he was never clean again for more than ten minutes after a bath and at the end the dapples were mostly gone and he was essentially white. I did notice he was harder to get clean, his coat was an entirely different texture than any other color horse I have ever owned. It was weird. My new horse is a seal/black bay with no white except a blaze and that is just fine with me. WAY less work to get clean.

        Comment


        • #24
          I've owned/ridden a good number of greys and paints. Come to think of it almost all the pictures I have of me at a show, I'm on a grey or paint... I think I'm a grey magnet or something haha! I love them! Sure, you can see the dirt more, but I have found a good routine for getting them clean for shows and there's nothing more satisfying than a spotless grey horse.

          Before I got my mare I set out to buy a bay or chestnut (I did want some chrome too) and ended up with another grey. But I love her and she's absolutely wonderful.
          "There are only two emotions that belong in the saddle; one is a sense of humor and the other is patience."

          Comment


          • #25
            Originally posted by judybigredpony View Post
            Regulary when selling a grey during the PPE buyer brings up melanoma...and every vet will reply the horse will die from something else before from a skin melanoma
            This what I have heard from my vet regarding my boy's melanomas. He's 22 this year, with the throatlatch lump like EventerAJ--but on the left side. I worry whether asking him to come on the bit is being mean; at least when he does it fairly willingly I'm pretty sure he's ok with it.
            That's fine, many of us have slid down this slippery slope and became very happy (and broke) doing it. We may not have a retirement, but we have memories ...

            Comment


            • #26
              I'm also in the "no grays" camp, though I wouldn't turn a horse down based on color alone. As a kid I rode at a barn with lots of grays. They were all lovely, dappled, and in varying hues, and now 10 years later they are all the same shade of "white"

              I once emailed a seller about a horse on Dreamhorse. The horse I was asking about was a chestnut; the woman told me more about that particular horse, and then told me that there was another one available, but he cost more because he was gray. Haha at least she was straightforward about it, though I would want to pay LESS for a gray horse

              Comment


              • #27
                Gray has always been my sucker color. Every one of my childhood horses was a gray mare of some sort. First adult horse was another gray mare. Then I discovered geldings! And, yes, again gray. This is my now retired 22yo OTTB. http://nancyreynolds0519.shutterfly....ctures/222#222
                He is dazzling when he is cleaned up!

                This is the same horse, er, pig in his more preferred state.
                http://nancyreynolds0519.shutterfly....ctures/222#225

                I hunted him for several years when I was hunt staff. That means cleaned up just as you would for show (except braiding) - twice a week from July through March!!! I should have bought stock in QuickSilver shampoo. By far the best for a gray!

                I have bought 4 bays in a row now! New horse has a pretty big blaze and two white socks. I almost passed on him because he had too much chrome!!

                BTW - Blue (the gray) does have a couple small melanomas under his tail. They didn't show up until he was 12 or 13 and they really haven't changed much since.
                Fox Wood Farm

                Comment


                • #28
                  Just my expereince - I've purchased 3 OTTB's direct from the track, a liver chestnut, a chestnut, and the most recent a gray. All three fancy and well put together, and I paid the most for the chestnut, and the liver and gray were the same price, but all three within a few hundred dollars.

                  I never went shopping for a gray, and next time, I will not even look at a gray. They are beautiful when clean...but mine is extra piggy and wants to be a spotted palomino!

                  Comment


                  • #29
                    Just an FYI, chesnut-based grays are the least likely to get melanomas, black (non-bay) the most. Homozygous grays and those that have skin depigmentation are also more likely to develop melanomas.

                    Me, I'm a sucker for black or that nearly black-bay... and if TBs commonly came in buckskin, I would be a complete sucker for them too. White is too much work to wash.

                    Comment


                    • #30
                      Originally posted by baxtersmom View Post
                      Homozygous grays and those that have skin depigmentation are also more likely to develop melanomas.
                      Hi baxtersmom - what can you tell me about skin depigmentation? My gray has many areas where black skin has turned pink. When I first got him at 8yo, there was NO pink skin any where. Over the years he began to lose pigment in some places permanently. And most weird - he gets large pink areas on his belly that move around. They are most noticeable when he is wet from a bath.

                      My vet and I sent some pix to a DVM Derm specialist and he called it equine leukoderma (I think) and said it was basically an equine form of vitiligo.

                      Just curious if this is what you were referring to?
                      Fox Wood Farm

                      Comment


                      • #31
                        Is it a gray with skin depigmentation or another color?

                        The depigmentation on grays is usually (but not always) associated with G/G homozygotes, who have a double-whammy of the "overproduce melanin" signalling molecule (in grays, early overproduction of pigment results in later loss of pigmentation due to exhaustion of the cells that produce pigment in the hair and sometimes the skin; this is also why grays are usually so dark at birth). This "revving up" process is what also leads to the development of the melanoma tumors.

                        In a non-gray horse, I would think that it would be a different process.

                        Comment


                        • #32
                          Originally posted by baxtersmom View Post
                          Just an FYI, chesnut-based grays are the least likely to get melanomas, black (non-bay) the most. Homozygous grays and those that have skin depigmentation are also more likely to develop melanomas.
                          That's interesting. I have noticed that most chestnut-based grays tend to go "white" very young, while the black-based chestnuts stay darker and dappled longer. (Seen a lot of yearling TBs and young racehorses-- the Tapits, like Hansen, end up white as yearlings/2yos, the Unbridled's Songs stay dark till age 6.) My vet told me he sees most melanomas develop as the dapples fade and the fleabites appear-- that was true for my mare. I don't know what color she was at birth, her sire was bay and she has bay elsewhere on the dam's side (obviously the dam was gray!).


                          Curious-- do the chestnut-based grays not get flea-bitten? Are they the ones that stay pure white? Do only dappled (black-based) grays end up with fleabites?
                          “A clever person solves a problem. A wise person avoids it.”
                          ? Albert Einstein

                          ~AJ~

                          Comment


                          • #33
                            Originally posted by judybigredpony View Post
                            Regulary when selling a grey during the PPE buyer bringsupmelanome...and every vets will reply the horse will die from something else before from a skin melanoma and to date I have never ever has a grey who was found with a melanoma..
                            Well, melanoma might not kill'em, but I've got one who's been forced into early retirement. Sound as a bell, but being slowly choked. Already had surgery done on the throat latch area on both sides several years ago. Perfectly sound horse. Very annoying.
                            "Friend" me !

                            http://www.facebook.com/isabeau.solace

                            Comment


                            • #34
                              I have a grey OTTB, and I don't have any more trouble keeping him clean than any other horse in the barn. I bed my stalls, I groom and brush, I do use a little showsheen on the tail and knees to help the dirt slide off. Get gets only spot baths in winter to get the manure stains off, usually can wipe them off with a damp sponge, which is what I would do on the bays and browns, too.He has a lot of clothes -- keeping a good blanket or sheet on him most of the time is a big help but all my horses will be wearing the same weight, no matter what color they are, if it is cold - they will get a good weight, if not, just a sheet. I don't get the reluctance to groom a horse just because their coat is a different color. They all need to be kept clean, and regularly groomed. Duh.
                              Proud & Permanent Student Of The Long Road
                              Read me: EN (http://eventingnation.com/author/annemarch/) and HJU (http://horsejunkiesunited.com/author/holly-covey/)

                              Comment


                              • #35
                                Originally posted by baxtersmom View Post
                                Is it a gray with skin depigmentation or another color?

                                The depigmentation on grays is usually (but not always) associated with G/G homozygotes, who have a double-whammy of the "overproduce melanin" signalling molecule (in grays, early overproduction of pigment results in later loss of pigmentation due to exhaustion of the cells that produce pigment in the hair and sometimes the skin; this is also why grays are usually so dark at birth). This "revving up" process is what also leads to the development of the melanoma tumors.

                                In a non-gray horse, I would think that it would be a different process.
                                Yes, he is gray. Very fleabitten now at 22yo. I got him at 8yo and he still had some dappling with dark edges on his legs and butt, but was mostly fleabitten even then. I don't know what color he was at birth. I think he is likely black based, not red based.

                                Sire was Darn That Alarm, a fairly well known TB sire in FL. His get were successful - with the chasers doing better than the flat racers. My guy could literally be a clone of DTA who was gray with gray ancestors in every generation. Interestingly, my guy's dam was dark bay with no gray ancestor until her third generation back. And that was only one gray out of the 8 3rd gen ancestors. I wouldn't have suspected he was homozygous, but obviously it's possible. Have had too much wine at this point to calculate the odds... (I was a Bio/Chem major and was a genetics-junkie, but like I said, time and wine...)
                                Fox Wood Farm

                                Comment


                                • #36
                                  Originally posted by retreadeventer View Post
                                  I have a grey OTTB, and I don't have any more trouble keeping him clean than any other horse in the barn. <snip> They all need to be kept clean, and regularly groomed. Duh.
                                  You live up in sandy DE, right? Try keeping a wanna-be pig, whose legs are as white as his body, clean in Carolina red clay mud. It's not just dirt - it's stain. It doesn't come off with brushing!
                                  Fox Wood Farm

                                  Comment


                                  • #37
                                    Fasig-Tipton (the major TB sale ventue) did a study many years ago and found that all things equal...the gray sale horses brought as much as 25% more than any other color!! Apparently the buyers of those horses are not always the grooms!!!
                                    www.crosscreeksporthorses.com
                                    Breeders of Painted Thoroughbreds and Uniquely Painted Irish Sport Horses in Northeast Oklahoma

                                    Comment


                                    • #38
                                      This reminds me of my good friend horse shopping a couple years ago. She HAD to have a big gray fancy warmblood show hunter and that's all there was to it. Huge gray horse after huge gray horse after huge gray horse... and what does she FINALLY buy? A plain bay 16.0 hand connemara/TB cross. Bless her heart.
                                      The big guy: Lincoln

                                      Southern Maryland Equestrian

                                      Comment


                                      • #39
                                        Originally posted by Fox Wood Farm View Post
                                        Sire was Darn That Alarm, a fairly well known TB sire in FL. His get were successful - with the chasers doing better than the flat racers. My guy could literally be a clone of DTA who was gray with gray ancestors in every generation. Interestingly, my guy's dam was dark bay with no gray ancestor until her third generation back. And that was only one gray out of the 8 3rd gen ancestors. I wouldn't have suspected he was homozygous, but obviously it's possible. Have had too much wine at this point to calculate the odds... (I was a Bio/Chem major and was a genetics-junkie, but like I said, time and wine...)
                                        Actually, your horse cannot be homozygous gray, as you said his dam was dark bay. Gray is dominant to all colors. A homozygous gray can only happen from two gray parents; a gray x non-gray will only result in a heterozygous gray or a non-gray.
                                        “A clever person solves a problem. A wise person avoids it.”
                                        ? Albert Einstein

                                        ~AJ~

                                        Comment


                                        • #40
                                          [QUOTE]
                                          Originally posted by EventerAJ View Post
                                          Actually, your horse cannot be homozygous gray, as you said his dam was dark bay. Gray is dominant to all colors. tA homozygous gray can only happen from two gray parents; a gray x non-gray will only result in a heterozygous gray or a non-gray.
                                          I thought that the equine gray gene was more complicated than straight single dominance? One of those "fuzzy" traits more like human eye color than an absolute... But I'm no expert!

                                          Thanks for the input!
                                          Fox Wood Farm

                                          Comment

                                          Working...
                                          X