• Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.

Announcement

Collapse

Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.

Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 1/26/16)
See more
See less

Going to look at this mare on Sunday... Thoughts?

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts
  • Original Poster

    #21
    Originally posted by Simkie View Post
    Ah, here she is as a baby: http://www.sableranch.net/page11.html
    Awww cute!
    Eventers of the West
    A Facebook group I created for Eventers in the West Region of the U.S.
    Remy - My OTTB Gelding! Love him to pieces!

    Comment


    • #22
      I have friends who got a half-wild at the time TB-Percheron PMU baby when he was maybe a yearling. He had been sold to someone on the east coast as a field hunter prospect, but they backed out when they found out he had a hernia. They couldn't have gotten a more suitable horse. Husband rides him on the trail, does mounted sheriff stuff, etc. Wife trained him to jump when both of her horses were on layup. He's been to a few local and county HJ shows. He handles everything well. There have been a few stubborn moment over the years, mostly when he was younger, but nothing scary.
      The Evil Chem Prof

      Comment


      • #23
        I think she's really sweet looking. Definitely come in with a lower price ($2400 seems fair, then you can haggle up to 3k if need be) and of course keep us updated with lots of pictures if you decide to get her!

        Comment


        • #24
          Originally posted by KateMcCall View Post
          http://www.ksl.com/index.php?nid=218...lpid=13&search

          She's TbxPercheron, and her sire (TB) is http://www.pedigreequery.com/faded+denim2

          I'm looking for a horse to do some lower level eventing on, and she seems pretty cute! I have experience on Greenies so there is no worry there.
          The owner said I could try her our for more than a month if I like her so hopefully if she's nice I will do so.
          She is near 17hh and I am tall so I think she will fit me better than my current 15h QH (he's retiring to be a lesson horse)

          this is her best video
          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CMUD2zj5s6Q
          Take some video of her at liberty - she's rather short strided under tack, especially walk u/s BUT this may just be tension/feet/saddle fit related. Also see what happens when you push her a bit

          Re the 1 month trial, that's not really too unusual depending on locale & the sale climate, just make sure you have a good contract in place & insurance.

          Comment


          • #25
            She looks really sweet. I wouldn't be surprised if she still has a lot of growing to do as she still looks a bit gangly. The butt needs muscle but that will come with time and training. I agree that she doesn't seem to be stepping under herself yet but when they are green bean noodles that does not worry or surprise me.

            With an offer of taking her on trial to see how she will fit into your program, I would do it. Just make sure you do a pre-purchase so a vet you trust can tell you if there is physically anything you need to worry about. Good luck tomorrow!

            Comment


            • #26
              Not sure if she is a PMU baby or not....doesn't really matter. I will say NOT all draft crosses are PMU babies!

              She looks cute but she looks like she is going to get pretty heavy. So if by lower level eventing you mean novice level or below, she may be just fine. I personally think it is asking too much of the heavier ones to do much more even if they are capable. It is hard on them even if they have the athletic ability. But you really will not know until she finishes maturing.

              She just looks green in the video so hard to tell how she moves. Go see her and try her and decide if you click!
              ** Tact is the ability to tell someone to go to hell in such a way that they look forward to the trip. ~Winston Churchill? **

              Comment


              • #27
                Originally posted by enjoytheride View Post
                Well, I think she's overpriced considering how green she is, and a month long lease sounds very out of the norm. She's cute but not spectacular so I think that her price should come way down.
                Big, solid, sane, pretty, appears sound and a decent mover. Price seems completely reasonable to me. Where I am located, she'd be more in the ballpark of $7500.

                I think she is darling and definitely worth looking at!

                Comment


                • #28
                  Since she has a NAERIC registration, she's definitely a PMU foal. That says nothing about her quality, and if she's a good horse, their incentive program could be a good thing.

                  What I think interesting is that neither of the ads for her mention her NAERIC registration. It's almost as if the sellers didn't want the world to know that she was a PMU foal. The first one offends me a bit because it looks as if she were bought cheap and priced high with nothing having been done to her.

                  TB x Percheron is a very popular type for the hunt field, especially for men. They are harder to get and keep in condition, but once in condition, they can be good for a field rider. They are not as popular for staff horses.

                  Originally posted by bornfreenowexpensive View Post
                  Not sure if she is a PMU baby or not....doesn't really matter. I will say NOT all draft crosses are PMU babies!

                  She looks cute but she looks like she is going to get pretty heavy. So if by lower level eventing you mean novice level or below, she may be just fine. I personally think it is asking too much of the heavier ones to do much more even if they are capable. It is hard on them even if they have the athletic ability. But you really will not know until she finishes maturing.

                  She just looks green in the video so hard to tell how she moves. Go see her and try her and decide if you click!
                  "I'm a lumberjack, and I'm okay."
                  Thread killer Extraordinaire

                  Comment


                  • #29
                    I am not an eventer, but I have owned two greys that were not suitable for me. If they had been plain bays I never would have looked twice at them. So that's my contribution to your evaluation process; ask yourself if you would be considering this horse if she were not a grey.

                    Good luck in your horse search and I do hope she's perfect for you.
                    A helmet saved my life.

                    2017 goal: learn to ride like TheHorseProblem, er, a barn rat!

                    Comment


                    • #30
                      I do the same thing with anything "sparkly," whether an attractive color, a lot of chrome, spotted... If it was a plain bay, would I still be interested, or would I keep looking?

                      She is cute, but the head tossing and bucking on the lunge line lead me to leave she is greener than advertised. And the u/s video seems like they are trying to be sweet and nice and not push her at all so that the video looks good. Annnnnd.... I think neglecting to mention the PMU part of her history, which isn't a bad thing, is an attempt to ramp her price up, just like saying she "looks like a TB." Makes me wonder if the seller knows what a TB looks like. My WB, who is 3/4 TB by breeding, does not look like a TB, and I would never say he did.
                      COTH's official mini-donk enabler

                      "I am all for reaching out, but in some situations it needs to be done with a rolled up news paper." Alagirl

                      Comment


                      • #31
                        Originally posted by vineyridge View Post
                        Since she has a NAERIC registration, she's definitely a PMU foal. That says nothing about her quality, and if she's a good horse, their incentive program could be a good thing.

                        What I think interesting is that neither of the ads for her mention her NAERIC registration. It's almost as if the sellers didn't want the world to know that she was a PMU foal. The first one offends me a bit because it looks as if she were bought cheap and priced high with nothing having been done to her.
                        I found this and thought it was interesting:

                        http://web.archive.org/web/200901061...bred2_2008.htm

                        It's the wayback machine cache of the Early Dawn Sport Horses website, which is now down and unavailable.

                        Those guys were asking A LOT of money for their horses! I can't imagine they were getting that, or they'd still be in business!

                        Comment


                        • #32
                          She moves better than I was expecting when I opened the link. Many times that cross can get more of the Perch movement, but she doesn't have excessive knee action and has some reach even as green as she is. I am bothered that they never show any canter under saddle - big red flag to me.

                          I had a TB/Perch cross that was a very nice mare - I didn't like her movement at all - but she was very forward and had a bottomless well of stamina in the hunt field. She's now eventing training level and doing well for her junior owner.

                          Not all draft crosses are made equal - in fact they can be all over the map in type and temperament. Draft cross does not consistently mean quiet. The short lunging clip seemed to show some 'tude for sure, but it sounds as if the current owner may be a bit intimidated by her.

                          As for her price, I'd say it is fairly consistent for what I see in my area. I would recommend negotiating down pretty hard as I think the mare is greener than represented in the ad. In fact, I call BS on most of the claims just based on how green she looks on the videos.

                          Good luck, I think she can be quite nice in the right hands!
                          If you believe everything you read, better not read. -- Japanese Proverb

                          Comment


                          • #33
                            For this area, she is priced very low. I've sold "PMU" green horses for over 10k, with some mileage in the hunt field. If I were looking for a hunt prospect, I would be very interested in her.

                            And my huge draft cross was a delight to ride. The air was a bit thin up there, but the big plus was that no one ever asked me to get a gate out hunting. He wasn't that heavy but he was not a horse I'd take above Novice or perhaps Training.

                            My experience with draft crosses is that they can have problems with feet. I would definitely x-ray the front feet, regardless of the price. It's well worth it, imho.
                            -Ann

                            Comment


                            • #34
                              Doesn't look too bad and price is always what a seller will accept and a buyer is willing to pay. Do think not worth a whole lot more anywhere for what is, essentially, a crossbred out of a mating for purposes other then performance characteristics and absolutely, totally dead green at this point.

                              I have been at this awhile and have looked at tons of horses both live back when and now on video. I see some things that concern me the way this one is presented.

                              One area of concern when you look at all the videos is the total of about 4 minutes walking and trotting sort of crabbing around crooked shaking it's head to the right and 30 sec walking hesitantly to the left. I would want to see it go to the left too...as it makes me wonder how bad it is to the left-usually the strong way in babies. Ask to see it w-t-c BOTH ways, even if they have to lunge it. Just always wonder if they are hiding something when such an obvious ommision-anything to the left- is presented as a "demo".

                              I realize it is really green (despite the ad copy of how much it knows) and working in a mixed use arena (with reiner spinning in the background) but I would sure like to see more then a minute or two at trot as well as something halfway relaxed at the walk instead of gawking outside the circle ignoring the rider. Does not have to be good, just has to keep going long enough to evaluate movement.

                              Despite those yellow flags, they are offering a one month trial and at 3500, IF it is sound and halfway sensible, makes me think it might be worth considering. If you take advantage of the trial, don't lowball what might be a pretty reasonable price for what this one MIGHT be. Usually if they offer a trial, they really are not trying to hide anything-just READ whatever terms/contract they want CAREFULLY in case it's a xx% non refundable deposit and actually a really expensive short term lease on a horse that does not really know how to canter yet and does not go left.

                              Ask to see it do a little more ...and, you know, I would probably not be that insistent on getting on it myself-you can see more then you can feel with something this green. Not sure this one knows very much, especially if it gets scared...and I have heard the term "s/he never did that before" once too often over decades to ever believe it.

                              On behalf of most of COTH, tell that gal to forget the poofy hair and put on a fracking helmet, especially on that greenie with a metal railing around the indoor and others in the ring.

                              Let us know how it goes, I am curious with this one. Might suit. Lots to recommend persuing it.
                              When opportunity knocks it's wearing overalls and looks like work.

                              The horse world. Two people. Three opinions.

                              Comment


                              • #35
                                For this area, she is priced very low. I've sold "PMU" green horses for over 10k, with some mileage in the hunt field. If I were looking for a hunt prospect, I would be very interested in her.

                                And my huge draft cross was a delight to ride. The air was a bit thin up there, but the big plus was that no one ever asked me to get a gate out hunting. He wasn't that heavy but he was not a horse I'd take above Novice or perhaps Training.

                                My experience with draft crosses is that they can have problems with feet. I would definitely x-ray the front feet, regardless of the price. It's well worth it, imho.
                                -Ann

                                Comment


                                • #36
                                  Originally posted by vineyridge View Post

                                  TB x Percheron is a very popular type for the hunt field, especially for men. They are harder to get and keep in condition, but once in condition, they can be good for a field rider. They are not as popular for staff horses.
                                  It can be a very nice cross but it is always a crap shoot with the 50/50 crosses. A 1/4 or less Perch is more common. You may see the cross in England more with their good footing but they don't hold up as we'll with our footing here and do not always have the speed for first flight. But every horse is an individual.

                                  This filly too me just looks like she will be a more heavy type when she finishes maturing. Not what I would want if my goal was training but you can never really tell. I would watch how she goes and how light of a mover she is. It bothers me that her canter isn't very good. That can be a real weakness with some of the draft crosses and it is a bugger to improve.
                                  ** Tact is the ability to tell someone to go to hell in such a way that they look forward to the trip. ~Winston Churchill? **

                                  Comment


                                  • #37
                                    An observation from past experience. Many of these horses at 6 look a lot more Percheron than the TB they looked sorta like at 4.

                                    I'm with bornfree on this.
                                    Some riders change their horse, they change their saddle, they change their teacher; they never change themselves.

                                    Remember the horse does all the work, we just sit there and look pretty.

                                    Comment

                                    • Original Poster

                                      #38
                                      Thanks everyone for the great advice! I have a lot to consider and will know what to look for when I check her out tomorrow. I WOULD prefer to get a horse to training so if she definitely isn't the type to make it that far I might have a lot to think about after seeing her.

                                      Also, color matters nothing to me. The only difference between a plain bay and a grey to me is that greys are harder to keep clean!
                                      Eventers of the West
                                      A Facebook group I created for Eventers in the West Region of the U.S.
                                      Remy - My OTTB Gelding! Love him to pieces!

                                      Comment


                                      • #39
                                        I think she's adorable!!! Very nice brain it looks like, especially for a young green horse (and mare
                                        She should be just fine for what you're wanting - Perch / TB x's can be awesome!! The ones I've known, and I've known quite a few, plus one being a stallion for Eventing breeding, have gone to Training, Prelim with no problem. Even Int. I wouldn't get hyped up about the registry or pmu issues. Out of the one's I've known, a few were pmu foals and as 3 yo were sold for $8,000. With the right training etc, they can be a great versatile horse. I'd say go for her!! If you can talk her down in price, great, but if not, I still feel you'll have something that if trained properly, and she can prove herself, in a few years that price will triple for you if you decide to sell. These x's can be very amateur friendly and can be competitive, so you usually have a good market (at least in our area.)
                                        Good luck and I'm not being biased coz I'm a sucker for greys lol ...I really like her sire's pedigree too!

                                        Comment


                                        • #40
                                          I've know several of Perch/TB crosses that have competed at the high level of eventing. None were more than 1/4 Perch....and none looked as heavy as this mare does now. Several had the Perch on top...and they seemed lighter than the ones crossed with the TB on top. I've know more that while they could go training, they struggled with the speed and had significant issues from the pounding.

                                          There are exceptions to every rule but that is what I'm putting out there. It can be a very nice cross but a 50/50 cross has a lot of risk and can really vary from horse to horse. If they do not have a canter now...that doesn't bode well for an event horse. This mare looks to me like a cute Perch...not like a TB.....that is the difference to my eye.
                                          ** Tact is the ability to tell someone to go to hell in such a way that they look forward to the trip. ~Winston Churchill? **

                                          Comment

                                          Working...
                                          X