Announcement

Collapse

Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You're responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the Forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it--details of personal disputes may be better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts, though are not legally obligated to do so, regardless of content.

Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting. Moderators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts unless they have been alerted and have determined that a post, thread or user has violated the Forums' policies. Moderators do not regularly independently monitor the Forums for such violations.

Profanity, outright vulgarity, blatant personal insults or otherwise inappropriate statements will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

Users may provide their positive or negative experiences with or opinions of companies, products, individuals, etc.; however, accounts involving allegations of criminal behavior against named individuals or companies MUST be first-hand accounts and may NOT be made anonymously.

If a situation has been reported upon by a reputable news source or addressed by law enforcement or the legal system it is open for discussion, but if an individual wants to make their own claims of criminal behavior against a named party in the course of that discussion, they too must identify themselves by first and last name and the account must be first-person.

Criminal allegations that do not satisfy these requirements, when brought to our attention, may be removed pending satisfaction of these criteria, and we reserve the right to err on the side of caution when making these determinations.

Credible threats of suicide will be reported to the police along with identifying user information at our disposal, in addition to referring the user to suicide helpline resources such as 1-800-SUICIDE or 1-800-273-TALK.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it's understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users' profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses -- Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it's related to a horse for sale, regardless of who's selling it, it doesn't belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions -- Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services -- Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products -- While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements -- Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be "bumped" excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues -- Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators' discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the �alert� button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your �Ignore� list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you'd rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user's membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 5/9/18)
See more
See less

Anyone compete with a hackamore?

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    Anyone compete with a hackamore?

    I will often ride my horse bareback with just a halter and lead tied to the sides. Mostly because of the heat and me just being lazy. I don't school in the ring like this but out in the field (100 acres). Last night I did some cross country work and he was a prince.
    Proud Member of the Opinionated Redhead Club! RIP my dear Avery ~3/21/1995-9/21/2011~

    Extreme Cat!!! 2006 OTTB
    Magic Cat - Final Demand

    #2
    I have in the past competed XC in a hackamore. But I was leary of stadium if it was a tight, jumper course; the long big turns/curves on some courses were fine. I did do a few stadium rounds in it, would have worked better if she was listening to my turn cues. But she has a huge stride so I wasn't worried about time.

    My mare can get really strong on course, the hackamore kept her from pulling me out of the saddle. It was easy to regulate her speed, but tight turns were a little tricky with the hackamore I was using. I've been looking into other "bitless" options but now she can't jump so I won't be eventing her anymore.

    When I trail ride her I'm lazy and use a side pull. It basically a glorified halter. She works great in it. I was thinking about trying it for jumping but she hurt herself before I could, now can't jump anymore.

    Comment


      #3
      I used a hackamore for everything but my actual dressage test on my old one star horse. He had a facial deformity from a pasture accident as a yearling and using a bit would cut the one side open and it was quite painful for him. He went really well in the hackamore and I never had a problem steering or stopping even on the tight turns.

      My advanced horse switched to a hackamore for SJ as well. He was way to strong cross country for one, but too soft and gumby-like in SJ for even the happy mouth nathe I rode him in for dressage. He loved the hackamore and again never had any problems with even the tightest turns. Both horses however were incredibly broke and very sensitive so all I had to do was think turn and they would.

      Comment

        Original Poster

        #4
        What are the different types of hackamores? What about bitless bridles? Is one better than the other?
        Proud Member of the Opinionated Redhead Club! RIP my dear Avery ~3/21/1995-9/21/2011~

        Extreme Cat!!! 2006 OTTB
        Magic Cat - Final Demand

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by mjrtango93 View Post
          I used a hackamore for everything but my actual dressage test on my old one star horse. He had a facial deformity from a pasture accident as a yearling and using a bit would cut the one side open and it was quite painful for him.
          In these cases, I think the rules committee should be able to make an exception. It's physically painful for this horse to have a bit in his mouth, but the deciding factions can't be called upon to think outside the box and make an exception.

          I'm not talking about exceptions for horses who resent the bit and behave fussily because of it.

          Just My Opinion which means absolutely nothing. Just felt like a light rant was needed.

          I now return you to your regular programming.

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by bludini View Post
            In these cases, I think the rules committee should be able to make an exception. It's physically painful for this horse to have a bit in his mouth, but the deciding factions can't be called upon to think outside the box and make an exception.

            I'm not talking about exceptions for horses who resent the bit and behave fussily because of it.

            Just My Opinion which means absolutely nothing. Just felt like a light rant was needed.

            I now return you to your regular programming.
            Believe it or not at 2 recognized events I was actually allowed special permission to compete him without a bit. Both times were because he had re-injured the area (his mouth was half sewn shut on one side with this wierd bubble from scar tissue) and I approached the ground jury beforehand. I was not allowed to ride in a hackamore or sidepull because the action is different and it would have been unfair for me to have a curb chain in a prelim test when nobody else did. What I got permission to ride in was a drop noseband with a rein attached to that lower ring. Colin was a saint and actually a higher level dressage horse so it was no issue, but I got some wierd looks in warm up with nothing on him but a drop noseband with a browband and a rein.

            Comment


              #7
              I have one mare who I have been riding at home in a mech. hack for two months, and she goes SOOOO much better o/f. I have not competed her in it yet, but have schooled xc and it made a huge difference. Turning is not a problem as she has always been excellent on the flat and turns off outside leg/rein. I usually ride her in the hack at home, but occassionally I throw the snaffle on for flatwork and she still goes great in that, so that isn't a problem....

              Jennifer
              Third Charm Event Team

              Comment


                #8
                Didn't Becky Douglas show jump at Rolex in a hack?
                RIP Kid Gloves (Holly) 1992 TBxHanv CCI*** mare.
                http://photobucket.com/tx3dayeventer/holly
                New mare: Miss Bunny Express (Missy) 1995 AQHA Jumper mare.
                http://photobucket.com/tx3dayeventer/missy

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by tx3dayeventer View Post
                  Didn't Becky Douglas show jump at Rolex in a hack?
                  Becky, Heidi, Amy with Poggio just to name a few. Kirsten Bonds old horse Diablo Centimo used to go in one as well. Plenty of people show in a hackamore!

                  Comment


                    #10
                    I ride my Nutty Woman with a Hack. She hates anykind of bit, which makes Dressage an interesting affair, even that we have surprisingly good scores.
                    Jumping in a bit is next to impossible, she concentrates on her hate for any bit on that piece of metal in her mouth and takes jumps down in record numbers.
                    The Hack was a recomendation from Mike Hubert and it works just nice. The Woman is very well trained and an easy stear, reacts nicely to rein and weight and leg imput.
                    With the standart leather nose hack she is exelent in stadium, but at Prelim a handfull in X-C.
                    Once past 500 and the juices flowing nicely it takes some power to step on the brakes.
                    I will try a covered bicycle chain Hack with 7 inch shanks next.
                    I tried a double bridle combination Hack with snaffel, no go, the bit thing.

                    Even on a very well broken and normaly easily to controll horse which is dandy with a hack, one should realy be careful going X-C, once the juices flow it could become to damm interesting.
                    That I have no use for them, does not mean, that I don't know them and don't know how to use them.
                    Caveman extraordinair

                    Comment


                      #11
                      I use an "English Hackamore" in the Dover catalog, the one with fleece on the inside of the leather noseband. It has great brakes, steering not so good, esp if they pop a shoulder out on a turn. Sometimes I feel that it's too much brakes and makes my guy jump flat...less round and thrusty from behind, more flat back, head up. Of course all of that is probablly due to rider error, but it only happens in the hackamore.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        My girl has been in a hackamore for jumping and X/C. She hates(hated???) contact with her mouth, especially over fences, and would grab the bit and run off. We also were under the mistaken impression that she had dental issues, and had a several week wait for the vet. So her rider at the time (a brave young teen) switched her to a jumping hackamore with short shanks. She stopped running off, while remaining eminently steerable by seat and legs. She's small and catty and super-athletic.

                        Now she's in (re)training, dressage only right now, and we've found a bit she accepts, at least on the flat. But I can say I'll go back to the hackamore if she goes back to her old tricks, once her jumping days start up again.
                        You have to have experiences to gain experience.

                        1998 Morgan mare Mythic Feronia "More Valley Girl Than Girl Scout!"

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by mjrtango93 View Post
                          Believe it or not at 2 recognized events I was actually allowed special permission to compete him without a bit.
                          Who do you appeal to, the TD, I imagine. And how might this be able to be determined earlier, before the actual event, who might I go to within the USEA and get an answer? I only ask b/c we are working with an OTTB who almost had his tongue cut in two with a bit at the track. Obviously he'll go in a jump hackamore as much as possible. I will experiment with some tongue relief bits, but not much is legal for dressage. He's such a good guy despite his somewhat shady history of scanky claiming trainers. He's certainly deserves to be able to be useful beyond his injury. TKS!
                          The cue card kid just held up an empty cue card. For a minute there I thought I had lost my sense of humor. --- Red Skelton

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by pony grandma View Post
                            Who do you appeal to, the TD, I imagine. And how might this be able to be determined earlier, before the actual event, who might I go to within the USEA and get an answer? I only ask b/c we are working with an OTTB who almost had his tongue cut in two with a bit at the track. Obviously he'll go in a jump hackamore as much as possible. I will experiment with some tongue relief bits, but not much is legal for dressage. He's such a good guy despite his somewhat shady history of scanky claiming trainers. He's certainly deserves to be able to be useful beyond his injury. TKS!
                            The two times I was granted permission I did it at the event. The first day I went and found the president of the ground jury and TD and spoke with them. The ground jury would come take a look with the vet and agree on the fact that the bit would cause issue and unneeded discomfort. I never did it before like say going through the USEA or anything but just on a case by case deal. There were also many shows that I was turned down and warmed him up in a hack or a noseband and then threw a bridle on right before going down the centerline and then dropped the bit out the second we were done.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by good booie View Post
                              What are the different types of hackamores? What about bitless bridles? Is one better than the other?
                              http://www.horse.com/Western-Tack/Hackamores.html

                              They have a pretty wide selection of hackamores, depending on what you were looking for (stopping, rating, or turning) each one would be better for a specific issue. I'd stay away from the mechanical hackamores.
                              To be loved by a horse, or by any animal, should fill us with awe-
                              for we have not deserved it.
                              Marion Garretty

                              Comment


                                #16
                                Originally posted by pony grandma View Post
                                Who do you appeal to, the TD, I imagine. And how might this be able to be determined earlier, before the actual event, who might I go to within the USEA and get an answer? I only ask b/c we are working with an OTTB who almost had his tongue cut in two with a bit at the track. Obviously he'll go in a jump hackamore as much as possible. I will experiment with some tongue relief bits, but not much is legal for dressage. He's such a good guy despite his somewhat shady history of scanky claiming trainers. He's certainly deserves to be able to be useful beyond his injury. TKS!
                                Originally posted by mjrtango93 View Post
                                The two times I was granted permission I did it at the event. The first day I went and found the president of the ground jury and TD and spoke with them. The ground jury would come take a look with the vet and agree on the fact that the bit would cause issue and unneeded discomfort. I never did it before like say going through the USEA or anything but just on a case by case deal. There were also many shows that I was turned down and warmed him up in a hack or a noseband and then threw a bridle on right before going down the centerline and then dropped the bit out the second we were done.

                                I'd just like to say, THANK YOU to both of you for the obvious devotion you show for your horses' comfort. I really believe that a petition needs to be made to the rules committee, REPEATEDLY until they see the light and can offer this kind of dispensation for these cases.

                                There needs to be an addendum to the rules that states, "in the case of mouth or head injuries(healed) where it is apparent that the horse is in discomfort due to the bit, special dispensation may be granted by the ground jury..." so that the ground juries, TDs, etc are aware that they can grant this permission. Perhaps, down the road, a "card" can be presented to the owner/rider that they would present at the time of entry to simply show this problem has been reviewed and bitless permission has been granted for this horse.

                                Again, I'm not talking about horses who resent the bit simply because they don't like being told what to do. My mare is so soft mouthed that I ride her in a rubber dog bone, no metal in the mouth at all, on all three phases. It has made me very cognizant of my hands and the effectiveness of my communication through my hands. No, I'm talking about these instances where the horse is tortured by the bit but is an amazing, willing partner nonetheless.

                                This can work, but it will take some time. Remember, there was a time, not too long ago, when we couldn't have copper in the mouth, couldn't carry a whip in dressage, couldn't use "tongue relief" bits in any way.

                                Comment


                                  #17
                                  Originally posted by AmandaandTuff View Post
                                  http://www.horse.com/Western-Tack/Hackamores.html

                                  They have a pretty wide selection of hackamores, depending on what you were looking for (stopping, rating, or turning) each one would be better for a specific issue. I'd stay away from the mechanical hackamores.
                                  How do you define mechanical hackamore? Most of the hackamores on the link are what I would consider mechanical hackamores (utilizing leverage), the others are bit/mech hack combinations.

                                  Jennifer
                                  Third Charm Event Team

                                  Comment


                                    #18
                                    I agree that all of them are mechanical hackamores, but some are described/named a mechanical hackamore vs. something like the little S or beetle hackamore.

                                    http://www.horse.com/Western-Tack/Ha...ize-WBF15.html

                                    http://www.horse.com/Western-Tack/Ha...ore-WBE41.html

                                    http://www.horse.com/Western-Tack/Ha...ore-WBA22.html

                                    Those are what are referred to as 'mechanical' hackamores over here in the western world. They wouldn't work at all unless you plan on just neck reining, they can do too much damage to the face if you direct rein. I've seen many horses get hurt, not to mention they apply much more pressure per pound than most other hackamores due to their longer, straight, even forward shanks. I used one the first time I rode my horse in a hackamore and he resorted to rearing at the slightest pressure.
                                    To be loved by a horse, or by any animal, should fill us with awe-
                                    for we have not deserved it.
                                    Marion Garretty

                                    Comment


                                      #19
                                      Originally posted by bludini View Post
                                      I really believe that a petition needs to be made to the rules committee, REPEATEDLY until they see the light and can offer this kind of dispensation for these cases.

                                      There needs to be an addendum to the rules that states, "in the case of mouth or head injuries(healed) where it is apparent that the horse is in discomfort due to the bit, special dispensation may be granted by the ground jury..." so that the ground juries, TDs, etc are aware that they can grant this permission. Perhaps, down the road, a "card" can be presented to the owner/rider that they would present at the time of entry to simply show this problem has been reviewed and bitless permission has been granted for this horse.

                                      I'm talking about these instances where the horse is tortured by the bit but is an amazing, willing partner nonetheless.
                                      And THANK YOU too! Both us and the horse! Exactly the point to be made. I will send my thoughts along regarding this to USEA. I can understand a dressage horse needing to be bitted to be used exclusively for that discipline, but eventing should be able to factor some considerations for these very special cases.

                                      And thanks to the forums here I did find this exceptional buy for a hackamore. http://www.beval.com/Products/Sheeps...e/2101200.aspx
                                      The cue card kid just held up an empty cue card. For a minute there I thought I had lost my sense of humor. --- Red Skelton

                                      Comment


                                        #20
                                        My TB/Standardbred functions the best in a hackamore. I used the really short shanked kind with the leather on the outside and fleece on the inside plus Sealtex wrapped around the chain part of the curb. She's a total princess- the fleece can't be worn down or stiff, take off the Sealtex and she freaks, put on a leather curb and she won't stop. The leather has to be formed to her skinny head which takes me about 6 weeks of shaping it before I can use a new one on her. Consequentially, I always have one on her bridle and two mor being "worked" behind the tack room door. It took me months (and five other types of hacks) to find the right combination for her.

                                        So, she has her Boucher french-link for dressage and everything else is in her hackamore. She steers beautifully with leg so steering isn't much of an issue. She's happy, focused and rarin' to go with her hackmore. Before I tried a hack, we went through 15 different bits and she fought every one of them. Yes, her teeth had been floated, no back pain, etc. She is just really fussy with bits. We found what worked for us and I'm totally thrilled!

                                        Comment

                                        Working...
                                        X