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Step up from a, get this, mullen happymouth boucher bit?

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  • Step up from a, get this, mullen happymouth boucher bit?

    What would you say is the next step if a mullen happy mouth boucher bit is being ignored?

    This is a blurry photo of the exact bit.

  • #2
    Both of my mares "happy place" bit is the Happy Mouth double jointed boucher. It's a baby step up from a mullen mouth.
    http://www.doversaddlery.com/product...=X1814001&zmam

    Comment

    • Original Poster

      #3
      Originally posted by slp2 View Post
      Both of my mares "happy place" bit is the Happy Mouth double jointed boucher. It's a baby step up from a mullen mouth.
      http://www.doversaddlery.com/product...=X1814001&zmam
      ...I'm actually dumbfounded I didn't think of this, thank you! I tried him in a loose ring happy mouth french link, and I don't remember him particularly caring for it, although we are much further along now in our training that he may react differently to it. The stability the boucher off may also be a pro for him. For the first part of the transition from "bits = ow" to "bits = yum" he was going in a loose ring rubber dog bone, which he tolerated, and went "okay" in.

      I then bought the boucher and he got even better.. until he stopped paying any attention to it.

      Comment


      • #4
        My two suggestions would be the happy mouth double jointed boucher mentioned above or a metal mullen mouth boucher. The right answer would depend on the horse. If the horse has a particularly sensitive palate and does not like the feeling of a jointed bit, then go with the metal mullen mouth. If the horse finds either the metal feel objectionable or wants the bit quieter in his mouth (ability of the double jointed bit to only move on one side of the mouth vs a mullen mouth that will always move on both sides) then the double jointed happy mouth.

        From personal experience, I think the double jointed happy mouth boucher is a terrific bit. I have never used a metal mullen mouth bit, only seen them in tack shops.

        Good luck!
        Annabelle Mayr, Arcadia Farm
        Home of Fitz, Austria & Erin
        Now over the Rainbow Bridge: Daeo, Max, Finn, Jake, Seamus & Pleasure

        Comment


        • #5
          Note that if the middle piece in that bit "rolls" it is unclear whether it is legal for eventing, although bit 15 in the 2011 rules say "ordinary snaffle with a rotating mouth piece" which I would interpret as ok although the rule has been written this way since 2009 and I know that there have been differences of opinion. Another option would be: http://www.horsebitbank.com/hanging-...wide-256.phtml

          I also quite like this one: http://www.thehorsebitshop.co.uk/pro...c22b6d24838d43
          OTTBs rule, but spots are good too!

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by ake987 View Post

            I then bought the boucher and he got even better.. until he stopped paying any attention to it.
            This happened to my horse. What did you put him in after he stopped paying attention to the boucher? Do you think it was the boucher style or the mouthpiece style which he stopped paying attention to?

            Thanks.
            Airborne? Oh. Yes, he can take a joke. Once. After that, the joke's on you.

            Comment


            • #7
              What about just a plain french link loose ring? Either a happy mouth or copper alloy?

              Comment


              • #8
                Just a note, but keep in mind that french link does not always equal comfortable to some horses. I would be prepared to try both the French link and a single jointed bit, probably Happy Mouth.
                Amanda

                Comment

                • Original Poster

                  #9
                  Originally posted by AnotherRound View Post
                  This happened to my horse. What did you put him in after he stopped paying attention to the boucher? Do you think it was the boucher style or the mouthpiece style which he stopped paying attention to?

                  Thanks.
                  Well, I wasn't in a hurry to change anything, I like to see something consistently for at least a week's worth of work before I make a change like this. So, thus far, I've just been dealing with it and seeing if it could possibly be another factor. It seems pretty clear that it has just become ineffective since this is a problem for me, my trainer, and his lessee. Once I figure out what works for us next, I will let you know!

                  Comment

                  • Original Poster

                    #10
                    Originally posted by scubed View Post
                    Note that if the middle piece in that bit "rolls" it is unclear whether it is legal for eventing, although bit 15 in the 2011 rules say "ordinary snaffle with a rotating mouth piece" which I would interpret as ok although the rule has been written this way since 2009 and I know that there have been differences of opinion. Another option would be: http://www.horsebitbank.com/hanging-...wide-256.phtml

                    I also quite like this one: http://www.thehorsebitshop.co.uk/pro...c22b6d24838d43
                    As an eventing newbie, the last thing I want to do is show up and get DQed for an illegal bit, that would suck! I am fairly certain, though, that I have the resources to get a definitive answer if I really want to use a certain bit that's legality is kind of ambiguous.

                    Will look into those suggestions, thank you!

                    Comment

                    • Original Poster

                      #11
                      Originally posted by Sonoma City View Post
                      What about just a plain french link loose ring? Either a happy mouth or copper alloy?
                      I am going to try the plain french link happy mouth loose ring again, since I have one I can borrow. As I said, last time I used it, we were waaaaaay further back in our training, so it might be something that could work for us now, or even as a bit that I could go back and forth with. First time I used it, results were "meh", but he also did not really understand contact or accepting the bit at that time, so I think it is definitely worth looking at again. I have to figure out whether or not he is a fan of the loose ring, or something more stable, or if he just doesn't like the french link. Ahhh experimentsssssss!

                      Comment

                      • Original Poster

                        #12
                        Originally posted by yellowbritches View Post
                        Just a note, but keep in mind that french link does not always equal comfortable to some horses. I would be prepared to try both the French link and a single jointed bit, probably Happy Mouth.
                        So far, the bits I have tried the most of have been single jointed, and all of those were big-time rejects (according to the horse). Every time I tried to take up contact, he got defensive, so I am fairly certain his palette is too low for the nutcracker effect of a single jointed bit to not bug him, since he does not get defensive with an unjointed bit.. jury is still out on his feelings on double jointed, since I have only tried one. (first bit he went in was the mildest of what I had at the time: D ring happy mouth, single jointed. HAAAAAAAAAAAATED it!)

                        I'm also not opposed to trying different materials, I'm just not sure where to start between all the choices...

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          My horse ran up through Prelim in a mullen happymouth. When he started to get strong xc....we moved up to a D-ring snaffle.

                          I've had others who started in an HS Duo (which I think is even more mild). They all moved into a loose ring myler comfort snaffle or a KK Ultra snaffle when I needed more.
                          ** Tact is the ability to tell someone to go to hell in such a way that they look forward to the trip. ~Winston Churchill? **

                          Comment

                          • Original Poster

                            #14
                            Originally posted by bornfreenowexpensive View Post
                            My horse ran up through Prelim in a mullen happymouth. When he started to get strong xc....we moved up to a D-ring snaffle.

                            I've had others who started in an HS Duo (which I think is even more mild). They all moved into a loose ring myler comfort snaffle or a KK Ultra snaffle when I needed more.
                            So, just a D-ring single jointed snaffle? I wish those weren't "out" for us, but he really seems to object to the single jointed bits. If it's causing pain, I certainly don't blame him, though!

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by ake987 View Post
                              So, just a D-ring single jointed snaffle? I wish those weren't "out" for us, but he really seems to object to the single jointed bits. If it's causing pain, I certainly don't blame him, though!

                              Yup...just a plan D-ring snaffle. I think I still did dressage in the mullen mouth.


                              If you haven't tried the myler comfort snaffle...I'd give that a go. I've had a lot of my TBs really like it. They seem to prefer how thin it is. Just make sure you try the ones that are legal for dressage.
                              ** Tact is the ability to tell someone to go to hell in such a way that they look forward to the trip. ~Winston Churchill? **

                              Comment

                              • Original Poster

                                #16
                                Originally posted by bornfreenowexpensive View Post
                                Yup...just a plan D-ring snaffle. I think I still did dressage in the mullen mouth.


                                If you haven't tried the myler comfort snaffle...I'd give that a go. I've had a lot of my TBs really like it. They seem to prefer how thin it is. Just make sure you try the ones that are legal for dressage.
                                I've wondered about myler bits.. does their design cause the bit to have a different or milder action than a typical snaffle? My concern is maintaining enough contact without "nutcracking" him for the whole ride. Right now, my contact seems exaggerated to me because I'm simply still getting used to it.. whereas all I used to do was ride around at the buckle!

                                The whole concept of contact as I now know it is relatively new to me still, so a lot of times I'm riding and thinking "I must be hurting him! This can't be comfortable!" even though he is going around beautifully collected with great rhythm and impulsion, and several professionals have assured me I am maintaining appropriate amounts of pressure. Urgggh.

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  no nutcracker effect with the Myler comfort snaffle at all.

                                  http://www.doversaddlery.com/product...&ids=977791259


                                  But if you just have a following contact...you shouldn't really have a "nut cracker" effect even with a single jointed snaffle all the time. There are also many bits out there that reduce that effect...even as single jointed snaffles. See this one (I've used it before too)

                                  http://www.doversaddlery.com/herm-sp...1-01882/cn/86/
                                  ** Tact is the ability to tell someone to go to hell in such a way that they look forward to the trip. ~Winston Churchill? **

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    To clarify, is this dressage "ignoring" or jumping "ignoring" the bit or both?

                                    Comment

                                    • Original Poster

                                      #19
                                      Originally posted by Beam Me Up View Post
                                      To clarify, is this dressage "ignoring" or jumping "ignoring" the bit or both?
                                      Well, a bit (haaaaha) of both. I'd like to refine our flat a lot more before I get too concerned with jumping. But, as far as jumping goes, he doesn't rush or pull, but gets INCREDIBLY heavy. I've been doing a lot of core strengthening, lost over 30lbs, so I know for him to still be yanking me out of the saddle, is not for lack of strength on my part!

                                      For dressage, I have been doing our sessions somewhat like this: Stretches, walk for 10 min at buckle, get a soft contact and maintain this for another few minutes before going through about 10 minutes of trotting, and when I feel we have been able to maintain forwardness, rhythm, and correct carriage, I will then ask him to collect more with my seat, leg, and rein aids. My rein aids are all but ignored. The amount of contact that I need to take to get any reaction from him is not in any way subtle or refined! I am not looking to "bit him up" or throw something harsh in his mouth, but his attitude has gone from "I can't" (when he was physically unable) to "I won't", it truly feels as if he is actively ignoring the bit. I'm also thinking that a broken bit that will help differentiate the cues on each side might be helpful. IDK. I'm frustrated.

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        What about a double-jointed copper boucher, like this
                                        Topline Leather -- Bespoke, handwoven browbands & accessories customized with Swarovski crystals, gemstones, & glass seed beads. The original crystal braid & crystal spike browbands!

                                        Comment

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