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Conformation Critique?

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  • Conformation Critique?

    This is my 6yo TB mare. Not the best pic, but I just took it on a whim after I untacked today.... I like this type, compact and catty, and am happy with her conformation (she's sound!) but always wonder what others see.

    http://www.facebook.com/album.php?ai...2.113310169444

    http://www.pedigreequery.com/vanitys+revenge

    Don't worry, you won't offend me (look at the rest of her album to see why).

    Jennifer
    Last edited by ThirdCharm; Dec. 31, 2010, 10:49 PM. Reason: add pedigree
    Third Charm Event Team

  • #2
    I like her!!!
    Great jump and she's quite nicely put together (she does look a bit up on her front pasterns but not bad.)

    She's a keeper!!!

    Comment


    • #3
      She's cute, I like her! Compact and catty are what I like too, describes my guy pretty well! Looks like she's a fun ride!


      Also have to add - I have the same half-chaps as you do. Love 'em!

      Comment


      • #4
        nice looking; bet she's quick, handy and clever with her body!
        breeder of Mercury!

        remember to enjoy the moment, and take a moment to enjoy and give God the glory for these wonderful horses in our lives.BECAUSE: LIFE is What Happens While Making Other Plans

        Comment


        • #5
          breeding is a crapshoot anyway

          some big names in sport horse breeding, Storm Bird, Bold reason
          Nashrullah,

          Something royal, Secretariats' dam As we can see though, it did Not contribute to her being a success at the track; but, does contribute to her being athletic with a good gallop
          breeder of Mercury!

          remember to enjoy the moment, and take a moment to enjoy and give God the glory for these wonderful horses in our lives.BECAUSE: LIFE is What Happens While Making Other Plans

          Comment

          • Original Poster

            #6
            Never been to the track.... her mom evented Intermediate so she was bred for sport...! (Obviously, though, mom and dad didn't make it at the track either!!!)

            Jennifer
            Third Charm Event Team

            Comment


            • #7
              She is lovely. What a bold, beautiful jumper she is.

              Comment


              • #8
                Just on conformation....I like her but she isn't my type. Only faults I really notice...which are not bad...is she is a bit straight behind and in the shoulder. I wouldn't expect her to have a ton of volume in her movement.

                She is a nice type that a lot of people will like. I personally prefer a more rangy type.
                ** Tact is the ability to tell someone to go to hell in such a way that they look forward to the trip. ~Winston Churchill? **

                Comment


                • #9
                  She looks cute. I especially like her expression over fences.

                  Is there a reason she's listed as a gelding on pedigreequery, though?

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    bornfree - I'll give you the slightly straight behind, however, a straighter hindleg helps them collect (http://www.jwequine.com/pdf/Conformation-Eventer.pdf)

                    However, I don't see the straight shoulder at all. I actually put this image in paint and worked on the angles, she is only slightly larger than 45 degrees, quite nice actually. Based on the photos of dressage, she has free movement in front.

                    At first glance I thought she had a nice pelvic length, but it looks like about 30 % or so of body length, 33% or more would be better off.

                    I think she has pretty decent stifle placement.

                    I'm not experienced enough with the LS joint, but I think hers is quite in front of the point of hip, not directly above it.

                    That's all I've got

                    Comment

                    • Original Poster

                      #11
                      That is a good question, don't even actually know how she GOT on pedigreequery as she is not JC registered!! Some hobbyist out there looking up the breeding of event horses and putting them in??

                      If/when I breed her adding suspension to her gaits will be the only thing I really look to improve.... I've gotten a 28 on her mom, and a 25 on her (at Training, so far her best on the Prelim test is a 32), just think what that could do with some additional movement! Her half-sister is by Formula One, and has some bounce, looking forward to that.... in a couple years....

                      Re: LS/Point of hip relationship.... (love that article), I would agree hers is in front of the point of the hip. In the article, it mentions most upper level horses have the LS ABOVE the PoH, and it says BEHIND the PoH is bad/limiting, but it does not say if there is any advantage to it being slightly more in front. Thoughts?

                      Jennifer
                      Third Charm Event Team

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by TSHEventing View Post
                        bornfree - I'll give you the slightly straight behind, however, a straighter hindleg helps them collect (http://www.jwequine.com/pdf/Conformation-Eventer.pdf)

                        However, I don't see the straight shoulder at all. I actually put this image in paint and worked on the angles, she is only slightly larger than 45 degrees, quite nice actually. Based on the photos of dressage, she has free movement in front.

                        Straight behind is also more prone to injury....I prefer a touch more angle. That said...I have one who is as straight as well. Shoulder --while not "straight" straight...it is straighter and shorter than I like...it isn't the kind of shoulder that I'm personally drawn to but it does fit with the rest of her and and angles.

                        I don't see the freedom you are talking about in the photos....she looks like an ok mover. I'm sure she moves well enough for eventing dressage...but she isn't what I would pick for a big fluid mover with a lot of volume (that is true of many very good event horses)

                        As I said...nice mare but not my type...just a personal preference. I'm not seeing anything that would prohibit her from being a nice event horse....and I know several people that love her type. I'm just one who likes the rangy TBs....she's more of a sports car.
                        Last edited by bornfreenowexpensive; Jan. 1, 2011, 03:48 PM.
                        ** Tact is the ability to tell someone to go to hell in such a way that they look forward to the trip. ~Winston Churchill? **

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I think she's a "great type". Sound, athletic and pretty! Love the pix of you in shorts, teehee, with helmet and boots. I've been around several horses with the front pasterns upright like hers. And just like your girl, they have good shoulder movement and jump well. Plus sound, never discount a horse that can be an active event horse and stay sound.

                          You two look very good together.
                          Hillary Rodham Clinton - the peoples choice for president.

                          Comment

                          • Original Poster

                            #14
                            Heh heh... yes she is a sportscar! If I wanted a Volvo... I'd do Hunters. LOL!

                            She is an average mover. Nice, straight, correct, but definitely needs more swing and spring!

                            Jennifer
                            Third Charm Event Team

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              I think she could have more slope to her shoulder. The pasterns don't really bother me, they are about the same as the shoulder, and I've noticed that horses with tendon issues tend to be mis-matched in that area. She uses her forearm better than I expected over the jumps with that shoulder, and that's my main concern. I think her topline could use some developing, her throat latch is a tad coarse, and her loin is weak. Might work on trot-poles, even raised, working long and low to help build the topline.I'd like to see her hind-end match her front-end. Could be in slightly better weight.

                              So, not too bad at all And based on her photos, she looks like she's using her parts quite well. You guys look like a great pair, and I think you will go quite far together. She looks 'game' - not a conformational trait but a good one that I thought worth mentioning.
                              Last edited by goodmorning; Jan. 1, 2011, 10:26 PM.

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Originally posted by ThirdCharm View Post
                                Heh heh... yes she is a sportscar! If I wanted a Volvo... I'd do Hunters. LOL!

                                She is an average mover. Nice, straight, correct, but definitely needs more swing and spring!

                                Jennifer

                                LOL--she looks sporty! yeah...I like the more rangy longish TBs but that doesn't mean all my horses are that type. This is my little more sporty model (off the track model--I kept his racing name). But still more rangy than your mare.

                                http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fb...&id=1529558233

                                (FYI--All pictures posted were purchased)

                                He's such a fun ride (puts up with all my mistakes).

                                http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2kLtiu07iL8

                                If they are the right horse for you...they are the right horse for you (regardless of their conformation)!

                                Have fun with your girl--my guy is the same age....fun to watch them progess isn't it!
                                Last edited by bornfreenowexpensive; Jan. 3, 2011, 02:33 PM.
                                ** Tact is the ability to tell someone to go to hell in such a way that they look forward to the trip. ~Winston Churchill? **

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Originally posted by TSHEventing View Post
                                  bornfree - I'll give you the slightly straight behind, however, a straighter hindleg helps them collect (http://www.jwequine.com/pdf/Conformation-Eventer.pdf)

                                  However, I don't see the straight shoulder at all. I actually put this image in paint and worked on the angles, she is only slightly larger than 45 degrees, quite nice actually. Based on the photos of dressage, she has free movement in front.

                                  At first glance I thought she had a nice pelvic length, but it looks like about 30 % or so of body length, 33% or more would be better off.

                                  I think she has pretty decent stifle placement.

                                  I'm not experienced enough with the LS joint, but I think hers is quite in front of the point of hip, not directly above it.

                                  That's all I've got
                                  I really don't think you can often tell LS placement without feeling it. Muscle can be deceptive - but feel for the dip in the spine and you can tell exactly where it is.

                                  I don't mind the shoulder at all. Sure I'd prefer a longer/more sloped shoulder, but I really appreciate her humerus, so that helps make up for it I think in her reach in front.

                                  I like her general hip shape, though would like to see a slightly longer femur to make more angle there.

                                  Originally posted by ThirdCharm View Post
                                  That is a good question, don't even actually know how she GOT on pedigreequery as she is not JC registered!! Some hobbyist out there looking up the breeding of event horses and putting them in??

                                  If/when I breed her adding suspension to her gaits will be the only thing I really look to improve.... I've gotten a 28 on her mom, and a 25 on her (at Training, so far her best on the Prelim test is a 32), just think what that could do with some additional movement! Her half-sister is by Formula One, and has some bounce, looking forward to that.... in a couple years....

                                  Re: LS/Point of hip relationship.... (love that article), I would agree hers is in front of the point of the hip. In the article, it mentions most upper level horses have the LS ABOVE the PoH, and it says BEHIND the PoH is bad/limiting, but it does not say if there is any advantage to it being slightly more in front. Thoughts?

                                  Jennifer
                                  The reason directly above is best is the back has little actual movement - and direction above the hip best allows the horse to take advantage of that ability to move. In an ideal horse you design yourself, they'll be perfectly lined up for max athleticism, but many horses can do well even if not. Given her compact build, the lack of alignment (because I'm guessing you've actually felt it out on her, not just going off your photo) may be part of her lack of movement, in addition to the pasterns. Both limit springiness.

                                  She's very much my type in general - I don't do well with the longer horses, I think because I'm so short. My guy has a huge stride, but short back, and we are a great match. She's certainly a horse I would be proud to own and work with, and I hope (and think from the album) you are!
                                  Originally posted by Silverbridge
                                  If you get anything on your Facebook feed about who is going to the Olympics in 2012 or guessing the outcome of Bush v Gore please start threads about those, too.

                                  Comment

                                  • Original Poster

                                    #18
                                    Actually I'm just going by the pic.... I have no idea what the LS would feel like! I think I'll ask my chiro next time she comes out, though, definitely she'll be able to tell me! :-)

                                    She is fun! And sound :-). Hoping to go Advanced on her, in a couple years....

                                    Jennifer
                                    Third Charm Event Team

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      I thought she looked a bit upright in her pasterns too, but looking at your album she's not bothered by it! Lovely jumper.

                                      I hope you bought the photo from Shannon Brinkman in your album. Otherwise posting a proof is copyright infringement, which is illegal. While the photo may be OF you, it does not belong to you.

                                      It's a very nice pic so if you haven't bought it already, you should.
                                      Last edited by Bogie; Jan. 2, 2011, 01:30 PM.
                                      Equine Ink - My soapbox for equestrian writings & reviews.
                                      EquestrianHow2 - Operating instructions for your horse.

                                      Comment

                                      • Original Poster

                                        #20
                                        Yes, I did, otherwise it would say "Copying this image illegal Please purchase www.shannonbrinkman.net" like the proofs on her website. I even police my students' Facebooks in case they are foolish enough to screen capture a proof..... :-)

                                        Some of the other pix in my album were purchased from hoofclix.com (I do like the watermark copyright thing everyone has started to do since I am terrible at remembering to put a photo credit in the caption....), but some are taken by students at shows and at home.

                                        Any more comments? :-) Maybe I'll post another horse, this has been interesting.

                                        Jennifer
                                        Third Charm Event Team

                                        Comment

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