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Eventing Nation booted from covering Event in Unionville, PA

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    Originally posted by Groom&Taxi View Post
    I am sad that the New York Times gave EN the honor of being a news organization at the same level as the Chronicle.
    Particularly since readers like Atl_Hunter & VHM (and others earlier in the thread who I failed to credit - mea culpa) did more research than EN & NYT combined. NYT treated EN like they were an AP wire service, rather than a source with an agenda of their own and party to the mess.

    For shame NYT! A good editor would have reminded its reporters to consider the source. Even in what is possibly a "fluff" piece.
    Last edited by MorganSercu; Sep. 22, 2020, 06:08 AM.

    Comment


      To be fair, this is just another news story to NYT. The NYT, much better than most of us, will have a good idea of the attention span of their readers. No mainstream coverage will go into the level of detail eventing fans prefer. There is also going to be an imbalance if neither Messrs Glaccum or Walker returned the NYT's calls.

      How did EN imagine they could use the mainstream media to their advantage back in the summer, when we now see what the further dent this latest coverage is making on eventing's image?

      On another note, by coincidence today the UK's National Trust has published details of 93 historic properties with links to slavery & colonialism. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-54244434

      Comment


        Originally posted by Happyhack View Post
        To be fair, this is just another news story to NYT. The NYT, much better than most of us, will have a good idea of the attention span of their readers. No mainstream coverage will go into the level of detail eventing fans prefer. There is also going to be an imbalance if neither Messrs Glaccum or Walker returned the NYT's calls.

        How did EN imagine they could use the mainstream media to their advantage back in the summer, when we now see what the further dent this latest coverage is making on eventing's image?

        On another note, by coincidence today the UK's National Trust has published details of 93 historic properties with links to slavery & colonialism. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-54244434
        That's a fair point (attention span) but I am still disappointed that the editor didn't insist upon a bit more digging than was exhibited. Plus that sort of research is what gives journalists a chance to impress the readers and their supervisors.

        I am pleased they have done so. I mean, they are a national trust and history is part of their mission statement - right? Did they collaborate with the Smithsonian too, by chance?

        https://nmaahc.si.edu/explore/centers/global-slavery

        Comment


          There are posters on this BB who have been complaining about eventing for years, advocating that it is too dangerous to continue, they must be overjoyed about the death of this upper level event and the negative portrayal in the media.
          http://weanieeventer.blogspot.com/

          Comment


            Originally posted by TheMoo View Post
            Diplomacy is clearly lost on the younger generations. Such a shame.
            Respect is lost in the younger generations. They have no respect for wisdom, no respect for logic and reasoning, no respect for someone else's point of view, no respect for the art of civil discourse, no respect for process, no respect for law. They are stuck in a perpetual state of arrested development, and like toddlers, they only respect their own selfish wants. EN has shown it is run by immature, spoiled, self-serving brats. Every single venue should yank their press credentials and ban them from their premises--permanently.

            Comment

              Original Poster

              Originally posted by enjoytheride View Post
              There are posters on this BB who have been complaining about eventing for years, advocating that it is too dangerous to continue, they must be overjoyed about the death of this upper level event and the negative portrayal in the media.
              I've never seen a single post of someone not wanting eventing to continue, come on now. Wanting it to be safe and caring about our sport go hand in hand.

              No one is happy about this drama right now, not that I have seen. Both sides are broken and many of us are in the middle totally lost.

              Comment

                Original Poster

                Originally posted by DownYonder View Post

                Respect is lost in the younger generations. They have no respect for wisdom, no respect for logic and reasoning, no respect for someone else's point of view, no respect for the art of civil discourse, no respect for process, no respect for law. They are stuck in a perpetual state of arrested development, and like toddlers, they only respect their own selfish wants. EN has shown it is run by immature, spoiled, self-serving brats. Every single venue should yank their press credentials and ban them from their premises--permanently.
                So how did the younger generation get this way? Parents? Internet? School?

                Comment


                  They may be younger than some or perhaps most of the people posting on this thread, but they aren't young adults either (which I define as 18-21). Ms. Wylie and Mr. Thier are in or near their 30's or thereabouts - yes? Plus business owners. So at this point, any lapses in manners that could be ascribed to their parents are years in the past. We're not talking about chewing with your mouth open, or elbowing someone aside to get the last seat on the subway.

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by DownYonder View Post

                    Respect is lost *****. They have no respect for wisdom, no respect for logic and reasoning, no respect for someone else's point of view, no respect for the art of civil discourse, no respect for process, no respect for law. They are stuck in a perpetual state of arrested development, and like toddlers, they only respect their own selfish wants. EN has shown it is run by immature, spoiled, self-serving brats. Every single venue should yank their press credentials and ban them from their premises--permanently.
                    I mostly concur with your quote - I just edited it some to make a discussion point.

                    I think there are some generational dynamics in play, but it’s more a matter of a general societal dysfunction. Maybe part of the intense political cycle, maybe part of Covid isolation and restrictions making many people unbalanced mentally to a degree, and in addition... maybe the general amplifying effect social media has on drama of all kinds. Add to it, the fact that no one seems to value the importance of critical thinking about subjects from multiple points of view anymore, and the fact that everyone is looking to win an argument in 280 characters or less.

                    All of it has led to a loss of respect and manners when talking about any number of topics... large and small. I have peers (I’m in my 40’s) that I used to be good friends with, but who have gone bonkers this last year in particular, and I just have to cut my losses and walk away from the relationships. I’ve had an easier time recently conversing thoughtfully and maintaining friendships with some “horse friends” who are in their 20’s than some who are in their 60’s. It’s been overwhelmingly because of folks getting belligerent about politics or Covid.

                    However, outside of horses, I do seem to have a much easier time maintaining rewarding respectful friendships with folks who are a decade or two older than myself.

                    Just some food for thought on the generational aspect.

                    As for booting EN from venues... I wholeheartedly agree. I think leadership with the governing bodies should have stepped in before this blew up though, and communicated clearly that it was NOT ok for EN to harass organizers or the land owner. Not if they want to continue being treated as a media outlet with press credentials, and given access to recognized competitions.

                    Comment


                      Originally posted by Jealoushe View Post

                      I've never seen a single post of someone not wanting eventing to continue, come on now.
                      I have. More than a single one. (And no, I am not talking about you.)

                      Comment


                        Please realize that "booting EN" is not just a matter of press credentials. Outside of VERY few large events (Rolex, Fair Hill, Red Hills, Plantation?) there is no such thing as "credentials." Most events, even upper level ones, are free and open to the general public. They are happy to have any press. For many years, EN relied on competitors to submit a little write up of an event they attended, and/or ammy photographer friends to donate a handful of pictures. Anyone can go to Morven, FL Horse Park, KHP and write about an event, take some pics. Having a "press pass" really only matters at Rolex and major international events.
                        A clever person solves a problem. A wise person avoids it.
                        ? Albert Einstein

                        ~AJ~

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by EventerAJ View Post
                          Please realize that "booting EN" is not just a matter of press credentials. Outside of VERY few large events (Rolex, Fair Hill, Red Hills, Plantation?) there is no such thing as "credentials." Most events, even upper level ones, are free and open to the general public. They are happy to have any press. For many years, EN relied on competitors to submit a little write up of an event they attended, and/or ammy photographer friends to donate a handful of pictures. Anyone can go to Morven, FL Horse Park, KHP and write about an event, take some pics. Having a "press pass" really only matters at Rolex and major international events.
                          Gotcha. And that makes sense. A good take from someone looking at it with a cooler head than myself right now.

                          Like everything else in this mess... there aren’t easy answers I guess But it’s obvious in hindsight that EN crossed a line with their tactics related to their decision to take on an activist role instead of a media one, and damaged the sport and many people and businesses that were literally built up around this venue in the process. I hope the blowback and criticism they are seeing from major names within the sport, as well as so many many people within area II is enough to make them back away from this sort of thing from here on out.

                          Comment


                            If we want the equestrian community (and our country) to survive, we need to find a way to navigate these issues that does not demand ideological purity and shunning of people and places that aren't deemed 100% politically correct. Otherwise I suspect many more venues will be lost, and the wounds inflicted by eventers on each other may never heal.

                            I thought this article was quite accurate as to what happened here:

                            https://theconversation.com/history-...nd-well-140888

                            From the article:

                            Nobody is more dangerous than he who imagines himself pure in heart, for his purity, by definition, is unassailable.


                            Author James Baldwin’s words, written in the America of the late 1950s, captures perfectly a feeling in the air that is currently troubling public discourse in many Western countries. Increasingly, questions once treated as complicated inquiries requiring scrutiny and nuance are being reduced to moral absolutes. Just look at Trumpism.

                            This follows a now dismally familiar pattern: two camps are identified, the acceptable “for” and the demonised “against”. The latter are cast beyond the pale, cancelled and trolled. Identity politics has become a secular religion and, like any strict sect, apostates are severely punished.

                            This can lead to a “purity spiral”, with the more extreme opinion the more rewarded in a pattern of increasing escalation. Nuance and debate are the casualties, and a kind of moral feeding frenzy results.
                            ...
                            As polarisation intensifies, people are increasingly loath to consider opinions that don’t reinforce their own. Quite literally the road to hell can be paved with good intentions.

                            Comment


                              Originally posted by EventerAJ View Post
                              Please realize that "booting EN" is not just a matter of press credentials. Outside of VERY few large events (Rolex, Fair Hill, Red Hills, Plantation?) there is no such thing as "credentials." Most events, even upper level ones, are free and open to the general public. They are happy to have any press. For many years, EN relied on competitors to submit a little write up of an event they attended, and/or ammy photographer friends to donate a handful of pictures. Anyone can go to Morven, FL Horse Park, KHP and write about an event, take some pics. Having a "press pass" really only matters at Rolex and major international events.
                              And note that this year...with COVID...most people were asked NOT to attend the event. Way too much of deal is being made of their “credentials being revoked”...no one was supposed to attend and EN shouldn’t have been thinking of sending anyone regardless. EN is not real media...never has been. Its a social media blog.....that has grown into a business...but has never had anything other than opinion pieces. But today...social media can and clearly does have major impact ...both good and bad.

                              I do think it is an awfully slow news cycle that this made an article on the NYT....but that says a lot about the NYT. How about an article on the horses and farms hit by the fires out west? How about stories on the impact on equestrian business of COVID. This was picking low hanging fruit for clicks for NYT too.

                              Even if the sport of eventing loses Plantation Field....life will go on. Yes it sucks...just as when Chesterland stopped running.....or when the land around Gladstone was sold to a golf course (we lost the old Essex there...that was the coolest venue to compete at). Or any of the many many many other events closed because of burn out, divorce etc. Most events only last about 10 years and we have been very lucky to have had many last longer in recent memory.. In this case, it also sucks because this happened seemingly out of nowhere and likely didn’t need to have happened if people had just respected each other and taken time to have civil discussions over TIME. There are just so many larger issues in the world....and added, while I will personally be impacted by the loss of this venue and miss it (and I’m NOT happy about it)....I also acknowledge that its not like the land has been sold to be made into a strip mall. It is sad as this really has been built into one of the best venues for our sport....but I also am not going to add into the drama. Life and eventing will go on.
                              ** Tact is the ability to tell someone to go to hell in such a way that they look forward to the trip. ~Winston Churchill? **

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by TheMoo View Post

                                I was speaking about the staff at EN and the people leaving comments on social media. Why are you picking this fight? Every generation deals with gross generalizations. Your’s seems to be the only one to act like it’s new. Do you disagree that EN lacked diplomacy? Or do you want to stay off topic?
                                In an earlier response to you, I made it abundantly clear that I agree EN lacked diplomacy. Rather than building on that agreement, you asked me if I was my generation's representative.

                                Originally posted by ake987 View Post

                                [...] I'm a member of a "younger generation" who completely agrees that a lack of diplomacy and display of utter idiocy and misplaced self-righteousness resulted in the loss of a premier event in our county and I don't believe that the responsibility of that outcome falls squarely on the shoulders of those "younger generations".
                                I'm not picking a fight, I think this has been a civil dialogue - especially compared to what has been posted on other social media platforms. You raised the subject of a lack of diplomacy due to generational differences, ascribed responsibility for the situation to that, and I commented on it. Others have continued that conversation in a meaningful way that has added to the discussion.

                                Comment


                                  Originally posted by Virginia Horse Mom View Post



                                  Huh. That’s probably just me being very very cynical and attributing a Machiavellian business strategy to EN in terms of their desire to rush this thing, when it was likely more just a matter of intense and sincere political ideology. But still... it’s something worth thinking about.
                                  From a strategic perspective, polarizing content is a known way to drive revenue as it also drives site traffic. Site visitors will share, repost, comment across multiple channels, all while driving traffic to the article, and therefore, the site. As the site is monetized, the publisher will benefit from the multiple clicks on digital banners surrounding the content.

                                  EN stood to benefit more than anyone from all of this. As influencers, it appears they have gained a following from their move, which may result in a near term bump in their monetized digital performance. It would be interesting to see the long term revenue gain/loss. But...what share of wallet does EN get from the mid-to-late career equestrian vs the young woke up and comer? At the end of the day, EN is a business. It's always interesting to follow the money trail.

                                  Comment


                                    Maybe EN should donate any additional profits from this month versus last to a charity. That would show they didn't intend to nor will they tolerate profiting off of a bad decision.

                                    (hahaha, fat chance that will happen)

                                    Comment


                                      Originally posted by EventerAJ View Post
                                      Having a "press pass" really only matters at Rolex and major international events.
                                      Changes CAN be made.

                                      ... _. ._ .._. .._

                                      Comment


                                        Originally posted by atl_hunter View Post

                                        From a strategic perspective, polarizing content is a known way to drive revenue as it also drives site traffic. Site visitors will share, repost, comment across multiple channels, all while driving traffic to the article, and therefore, the site. As the site is monetized, the publisher will benefit from the multiple clicks on digital banners surrounding the content.

                                        EN stood to benefit more than anyone from all of this. As influencers, it appears they have gained a following from their move, which may result in a near term bump in their monetized digital performance. It would be interesting to see the long term revenue gain/loss. But...what share of wallet does EN get from the mid-to-late career equestrian vs the young woke up and comer? At the end of the day, EN is a business. It's always interesting to follow the money trail.
                                        Thanks for further explaining the business side of this, and how every click and share actually is tied to revenue.

                                        I also concur 100% about the market analysis... targeting the younger, “woke” segment of their audience is a smart thing in terms of long term revenue streams and a sustained audience. Which they need.

                                        I wish I thought that people e-mailing advertisers about their frustration with how EN went about this would move a needle... but sadly... I doubt it will, for understandable business reasons. My guess is EN will get a good short term business bump from this, but it might have a break even impact in the long run.

                                        After taking a breath and pausing to consider some aspects of it all more... I’m with Groom & Taxi - it is INCREDIBLY disappointing that the NYT article gave Leslie Wiley the journalistic credence it did. Describing her as an editor of an eventing focused blogging site seems like it would have been more accurate... and touching upon the aspect of the story that Ms. Wiley and Mr. Thier not only had decided to act as independent advocates, and thus actually CREATED the name change controversy they were ALSO “reporting on (that’s a journalistic no no), but ALSO had a business model that meant they stood to see a revenue boost for EN because of the controversy they had gotten rolling (also a journalistic no no)? That would have been informative to NYT readers to mention, and help everyone better understand the full scope of this situation, and underlying dynamics pertaining to the parties involved so that readers could... you know... judge for themselves what to make of it.

                                        Ugggh. Thanks for explaining the money side of clicks on sites like this though more fully.

                                        I guess the best way at this point for frustrated people to express their opinion on ENs role, is to forever refer to them as a “click bait” platform... it seems fair, and it certainly is insulting given their own grandiose aspirations to be some sort of social change leader for everyone in the sport.
                                        Last edited by Virginia Horse Mom; Sep. 22, 2020, 01:48 PM. Reason: Typos and clarity

                                        Comment


                                          Originally posted by Horsegirl's Mom View Post
                                          If we want the equestrian community (and our country) to survive, we need to find a way to navigate these issues that does not demand ideological purity and shunning of people and places that aren't deemed 100% politically correct. Otherwise I suspect many more venues will be lost, and the wounds inflicted by eventers on each other may never heal.

                                          I thought this article was quite accurate as to what happened here:

                                          https://theconversation.com/history-...nd-well-140888

                                          From the article:

                                          Nobody is more dangerous than he who imagines himself pure in heart, for his purity, by definition, is unassailable.


                                          Author James Baldwin’s words, written in the America of the late 1950s, captures perfectly a feeling in the air that is currently troubling public discourse in many Western countries. Increasingly, questions once treated as complicated inquiries requiring scrutiny and nuance are being reduced to moral absolutes. Just look at Trumpism.

                                          This follows a now dismally familiar pattern: two camps are identified, the acceptable “for” and the demonised “against”. The latter are cast beyond the pale, cancelled and trolled. Identity politics has become a secular religion and, like any strict sect, apostates are severely punished.

                                          This can lead to a “purity spiral”, with the more extreme opinion the more rewarded in a pattern of increasing escalation. Nuance and debate are the casualties, and a kind of moral feeding frenzy results.
                                          ...
                                          As polarisation intensifies, people are increasingly loath to consider opinions that don’t reinforce their own. Quite literally the road to hell can be paved with good intentions.

                                          Excellent post and very insightful. I would respectfully submit however that both sides of the political spectrum seem fully committed to the increasing escalation of socio-political warfare.

                                          Comment

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