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Fence Judging Scenarios and Tips For Riders

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  • pony grandma
    started a topic Fence Judging Scenarios and Tips For Riders

    Fence Judging Scenarios and Tips For Riders

    I've just recently done some fence sitting, I'm usually working in other capacities. It was very helpful to renew my reflexes for various scenarios. So let's refresh other jj's and add the cases for rider tips.

    At one event I had to do an emergency hold. A horse got caught in a fence right after the one I was at and I could see what was happening - it was the 4th refusal so the pair had eaten up time so bingo there was the next rider. No time to get my phone screen open (and in the bright sunlight). Horse and rider were on me out of the blue. I did bring my own whistle that helped. So I told the TD, and the rider, that I added a minute to the hold time before I could get a timepiece going so rider could have that time for their reapproach. So first off after the event I went and bought my own stopwatch ($9 at WM) to carry with me forever and ever. So much easier to just hang around neck and reach down and click while stepping out. Not all events provide anything.... maybe only to designated holds but undesignateds often happen.

    At another I sat at the water where the combination was A/B for Prelim but # / # for T,N so I had some experienced riders that knew how to use the rules to get their horses feet wet - circling into the water between the #s. Then I had one rider present the exact same way 3X for 3 refusals at the log drop into the water. At some point there the rider should have backed up and used the available ramp down into the water to get the horse's feet wet before trying that last time. Just saying ….

    Then at BN the flags were set for an entry pass thru. One rider presented her horse to the water repeatedly but not at the flagged entry - which is not counted as refusals. Rider eventually retired. vs eliminated.

    I swear we could write a book entitled A View from the Fence Judge's Chair!

  • Larksmom
    replied
    my point in bringing up Longview was just that all the equestrian groups came together to say, yes e will use this facility. I wonder if the number of indoor arenas keeps people thinking, let's just have the show, here, no matter where it is. But I do wonder if they all came together and pledged to use it...It does make me sad to see those sports fields, equal to any in the country, and right next door, our orphan cross country course.

    Leave a comment:


  • rockonxox
    replied
    Was that at Pony Club weekend CindyCRNA ? When I've gone there are tons of parent and rider volunteers at that event. Maybe that is why it runs smoothly? I don't know. They always do food (sandwich and chips), have golf carts providing water, and give enough time between divisions to hike to the porta potty. If it is real far and you ask nice sometimes you can flag down a ride. Haven't made it to John's event yet... but one of these days I will!

    That is interesting about not being able to put up anything permanent at Heritage... but they do share the facilities with all sorts of sports so makes sense (even though it would be great to get permanent set ups for horse activities). I do love that we have both facilities in such a close radius instead of having to drive half a day like riders in other states do.

    Leave a comment:


  • CindyCRNA
    replied
    Originally posted by Larksmom View Post
    well doesn't MACTA do Longview as well? One thing that has just occurred to me is this: Heritage is a little older than Longview, but not by much. I remember being on some sort of a group way back when Longview was being created. The council was made up of all equestrian groups in the area. Quarter horses, Arabians, Morgans, gaited horses, HJ, Dressage eventing, driving and everyone else involved, what did each group need for a horse park. Most of course just need a ring. But in all the time that has passed, Longview has gravel parking, permanent stabling, a show ring, and a dedicated place for dressage rings. Plus of course, cross country course, and driving obstacles. Heritage has a nice cross country course. Period. Now that has nothing to do with the organizing, but IDK why that is. Weather in spring and fall here has been horrendous. Do all the other groups just go to Kemper or Sprint arena? Longview IS lovely. Why can't HP be upgraded so others can use it?
    No two different groups. Heritage Park I feel is always positioned to toss the horse park out. We are not allowed to put anything permanent there. The soccer fields bring more revenue. Longview is committed to the horse community.

    Leave a comment:


  • CindyCRNA
    replied
    Originally posted by rockonxox View Post
    I skipped the event at Heritage due to other commitments, but Larksmom and CindyCRNA that sounds incredibly disorganized compared to the events at Longview. I know this was at least one of the organizers first years so maybe some learning curve and hopefully next year will be much better. Although, if 4 years ago it was the same maybe it is a MACTA problem as a whole? I don't know. I will say that the part I was going to volunteer for was a mess. Good communication to start and then never heard official word back on what was needed if anything (although rain put a kink into plans). This year has just been a crap shoot with weather for every event!

    At the events I've volunteered at at Longview we 100% have always gotten assigned jumps out there. We didn't get to choose, we were handed our paperwork with the jumps pre chosen for us. We get a list for every jump we'll be monitoring for each level and we had breaks in between to ensure we could use the facilities and could move our chairs for the best vantage point of the next jump. We did roll call before each division to ensure coverage was prepared and in place. The Mill Creek Pony Club event runs a tight ship from my experience. If you get a chance to volunteer for it definitely do!
    Interestingly, the last time I JJ'd at Longview someone checked on us once and I pee'd by my jump. I had brought toilet paper in anticipation of this. I had a cooler and food. I don't remember if anyone offered food but I had plenty. I did prelim to starter that year so a long day. This was roughly 2-3 years ago. Often when they are short on volunteer's they are spread too thin, checking on people falls by the wayside. But I think John Staples is able to drum up sufficient volunteers.

    Leave a comment:


  • Larksmom
    replied
    I really want to scribe because so many people say it is such a great learning experience. But I write slowly and if I speed up, no one can decipher it. So I haven't tried yet!

    yeah, I thought so too! Until I got in that booth and the poor judge! They need to have training for scribes just as they do for judges! It would have been fine if I were any good at it. but just think of looking at your test. EVERYONE wants lots of comments, and the scribe has to write that legibly. So I probably won't offer that again. What I used to do way back in the way back was pick up judges from the airport. Now THAT was fun! Sometimes I got to take them to dinner.

    Leave a comment:


  • OverandOnward
    replied
    Originally posted by Larksmom View Post
    Well, yes it was a mess. This happened 4 years ago too. The course builder, a TERRIFIC guy, drove us out around the course, and people just jumped off at random spots near a jump. When it came to novice, I was near a jump marked as novice, but when we did the soundcheck, someone else called out the number of a jump where I thought I was sitting. After he called out rider # is clear over that fence, I realized the numbered jump where I was sitting wasn't flagged. And to add to the fun, it was POURING rain. I am trying not to be specific where it was, as I do not want to cause an incident. The organizer is ...prickly
    I have never heard of not assigning jj's to jumps. And have volunteered at quite a few horse trials in two different areas.

    There is just one HT that I will not volunteer at any longer because of ... well, the experience of being a volunteer there, I'll just say that. I'm not the only one. I was actually warned by another well-respected volunteer, thought I'd stick it out because I wasn't in the key position that she was, only to give up on it after a year.

    Even though most volunteers I know will stick out some less-than-ideal circumstances for the good of the sport and the riders, everyone has their limits. A HT can unfortunately get a reputation as just not a worthwhile way to spend a few hours (or a full day). I suspect that in those cases usually there is someone in a key coordinator/organizer position who is obdurate and can't be dislodged.

    Originally posted by Larksmom View Post
    hehe I tried scribing 4 years ago. I WAS TERRIBLE!!! I guess I didn't realize you had to have readable handwriting and write at some speed. For the sake of al involved, I will NEVER volunteer for that again!


    I really want to scribe because so many people say it is such a great learning experience. But I write slowly and if I speed up, no one can decipher it. Afraid I'd be fired after a test or two! So I haven't tried yet!


    Originally posted by quietann View Post

    Thank you! It was not half as hard as getting oblivious pedestrians -- including a completely oblivious mom with a toddler -- out of the way of a Preliminary horse galloping right at them at the recognized event a few years back.
    .......
    How about one of the competitors who had finished her round, taken her horse back and untacked, and then brought her haltered horse out to graze ... all the way out onto the course.

    It wasn't a short walk to get there and the volunteers hollering at her to **move** horse coming! couldn't figure out why THERE. She wasn't hearing them because it was in a galloping part and none of the jj's were that close to her. She finally looked up toward the jump , saw the horse approaching the jump and about to be galloping right over her, and the jj waving at her, and realized where she was. It was kind of funny as she was hastily trying to get out of the way but her horse wasn't keen to give up on the grass.

    I suspect she wanted to watch friends ride their courses while grazing her horse, and just didn't realize where she had ended up.

    Leave a comment:


  • Larksmom
    replied
    well doesn't MACTA do Longview as well? One thing that has just occurred to me is this: Heritage is a little older than Longview, but not by much. I remember being on some sort of a group way back when Longview was being created. The council was made up of all equestrian groups in the area. Quarter horses, Arabians, Morgans, gaited horses, HJ, Dressage eventing, driving and everyone else involved, what did each group need for a horse park. Most of course just need a ring. But in all the time that has passed, Longview has gravel parking, permanent stabling, a show ring, and a dedicated place for dressage rings. Plus of course, cross country course, and driving obstacles. Heritage has a nice cross country course. Period. Now that has nothing to do with the organizing, but IDK why that is. Weather in spring and fall here has been horrendous. Do all the other groups just go to Kemper or Sprint arena? Longview IS lovely. Why can't HP be upgraded so others can use it?

    Leave a comment:


  • rockonxox
    replied
    I skipped the event at Heritage due to other commitments, but Larksmom and CindyCRNA that sounds incredibly disorganized compared to the events at Longview. I know this was at least one of the organizers first years so maybe some learning curve and hopefully next year will be much better. Although, if 4 years ago it was the same maybe it is a MACTA problem as a whole? I don't know. I will say that the part I was going to volunteer for was a mess. Good communication to start and then never heard official word back on what was needed if anything (although rain put a kink into plans). This year has just been a crap shoot with weather for every event!

    At the events I've volunteered at at Longview we 100% have always gotten assigned jumps out there. We didn't get to choose, we were handed our paperwork with the jumps pre chosen for us. We get a list for every jump we'll be monitoring for each level and we had breaks in between to ensure we could use the facilities and could move our chairs for the best vantage point of the next jump. We did roll call before each division to ensure coverage was prepared and in place. The Mill Creek Pony Club event runs a tight ship from my experience. If you get a chance to volunteer for it definitely do!

    Leave a comment:


  • CindyCRNA
    replied
    Originally posted by RainWeasley View Post

    How does that even work, if they don't assign a jump? Do people just fight over them?
    They drive around with a truck load of volunteers and stop at each jump and ask for takers and people pile out of the back.

    Leave a comment:


  • quietann
    replied
    Originally posted by frugalannie View Post

    And Quiet Ann, you were terrific! Not easy to flag a disappointed rider down, and you made it seem like something you've done before. Your responses on the air were prompt and clear. Very much appreciated by this rookie! See you at the spring classic!
    Thank you! It was not half as hard as getting oblivious pedestrians -- including a completely oblivious mom with a toddler -- out of the way of a Preliminary horse galloping right at them at the recognized event a few years back.

    I think that I inherited my mother's no-nonsense teaching voice.

    I've had to stop people on course before, but usually just because they are being overtaken, or someone ahead of them is in trouble. The only other one I've had to send back to the trailers was a few years ago, a girl who fell off and landed on her bum. EMTs checked her out, she was fine, and she was really polite about it. The Spring Classic is always a bit more ... entertaining.

    Leave a comment:


  • Larksmom
    replied
    hehe I tried scribing 4 years ago. I WAS TERRIBLE!!! I guess I didn't realize you had to have readable handwriting and write at some speed. For the sake of al involved, I will NEVER volunteer for that again!

    Leave a comment:


  • SolarFlare
    replied
    Originally posted by frugalannie View Post

    Now there are those volunteers who only want to be dressage scribes, but that's a different matter .
    HEY! THAT'S ME!

    I always scribe...but then again, the events I volunteer at seem to always need one, and I commit early and always show up on time, so they know they can rely on me.

    Leave a comment:


  • pony grandma
    replied
    https://useventing.com/events-compet...valuation-form

    P.s. move we'll take you here!

    Leave a comment:


  • Larksmom
    replied
    Yes, it was recognized. I signed all my sheets and put my phone # on all of them. There were only a few problems, and I checked with the TD. She saved me from going back and causing mayhem. They just didn't say 'You go here and you go there'. The TD did assign the first and last fences as they had to have stopwatches. I never got an order of go for any division. I do want to fill out an evaluation but I don't quite know where to go to do so.
    Listen, my horse has been dead for over 10 years. I have almost no contact with anyone anymore, and truthfully, it was this thread that encouraged me to go volunteer. I was thrilled to do it!! There is nothing like the smell of horses in the morning! But this has left me with a bad taste in my mouth.
    One good note, some young girl, walked by and said, 'thank you for volunteering!

    Leave a comment:


  • pony grandma
    replied
    Larksmom is this at a recognized event?

    I've been taught that a copy of the fence assignments goes to both scoring and control - along with the cell phone #s in case they need to speak with the fence individual. I've received those calls when I've been sitting at a fence - if your score sheet does not match control's, if you did an emergency hold, rider/horse fall that needs a private call vs radio transmissions... and these issues happen at the unrecognized level especially! Far more activity with less experienced competitors.

    How do they deal with designated hold fences - whether recognized HT or not, that is going to be needed. And not everyone is comfortable or educated to do those. Plus they're given a stopwatch, a flag and marker cones. And not everyone has the experience for some of the fences with questions.

    You can anonymously submit an event evaluation. And should,

    Leave a comment:


  • Larksmom
    replied
    Well, yes it was a mess. This happened 4 years ago too. The course builder, a TERRIFIC guy, drove us out around the course, and people just jumped off at random spots near a jump. When it came to novice, I was near a jump marked as novice, but when we did the soundcheck, someone else called out the number of a jump where I thought I was sitting. After he called out rider # is clear over that fence, I realized the numbered jump where I was sitting wasn't flagged. And to add to the fun, it was POURING rain. I am trying not to be specific where it was, as I do not want to cause an incident. The organizer is ...prickly

    Leave a comment:


  • Lusoluv
    replied
    Aaahhh...thanks for the explanation Gardenhorse!

    Leave a comment:


  • trubandloki
    replied
    Originally posted by RainWeasley View Post

    How does that even work, if they don't assign a jump? Do people just fight over them?
    Thank you for asking what I was thinking.

    Not even the morning of when they give you all your stuff is a jump assigned? They just send you out there in a free-for-all first come first served basis?
    That is weird and seems like it adds a ton of time to the morning set-up trying to make sure there is someone at every jump.

    Leave a comment:


  • RainWeasley
    replied
    Originally posted by Larksmom View Post
    Well, I Jump judged this weekend. I hadn't done it for 4 years, and maybe 30 years before that. Both times, we weren't assigned a jump. I want to help, and I don't ride anymore, but I swear, if they do not assign jumps next year, I will say no thanks
    How does that even work, if they don't assign a jump? Do people just fight over them?

    Leave a comment:

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