• Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.

Announcement

Collapse

Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.

Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 1/26/16)
See more
See less

Question about Tennessee Walking Horses

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Question about Tennessee Walking Horses

    I'm looking to buy "one more horse" . Looking at a TWH gelding (I currently own a TWH gelding). I need help regarding this prospective gelding's hind end. When he walks/running walks, his back legs look wobbly, sort of all over the place. I think it looks worst in the hock movement -- they sort of "go out" at the hock. My TWH doesn't go like this. Seller says it's the "older type TWH" (he's got Carbon Copy in his papers) and that's it's normal. I rode this gelding and under saddle he seems to move fine. I will have a PPE prior to purchase, but any ideas about his hind end? Something I should be concerned with later on down the road (he's 11 now)?

    Oh Great COTHers -- help!!!
    If you cannot set a good example, at least serve as a terrible warning....

  • #2
    does he sort of "scissor" his back legs? My old TWH did that and I was also told it was a "classic" TWH thing. He was a Hard Texas Cash foal and had Sun's Delight D, Coin's Hard Cash etc. as grandsires.

    I don't know if this is what you are seing, and I don't know a ton about TWHs, just sharing my personal experiences here.

    Comment


    • #3
      I have known some that sort of twist when they walk and some that kinda tight rope walk. All are sound with no problems. I was told it is the old style.
      http://community.webshots.com/user/snafflebitz

      "My Saddlebred can do anything your horse can do" Clique

      Comment


      • #4
        Can you video him for us?

        Short of that, watch him from behind. If it's in his hocks I'd worry.

        Is he is putting his foot down and then twisting the whole leg from hip to hoof? In our out?

        Does the hoof print stay clear and forward facing or does the dirt smear as he moves?

        Does his hock rotate in/out/around as his hoof contacts the ground???
        Crayola posse ~ Lazer Lemon yellow
        Take time to give...it is too short a day to be selfish. - Ben Franklin

        Comment

        • Original Poster

          #5
          Originally posted by DairyQueen2049 View Post
          Can you video him for us?

          Short of that, watch him from behind. If it's in his hocks I'd worry.

          Is he is putting his foot down and then twisting the whole leg from hip to hoof? In our out?

          Does the hoof print stay clear and forward facing or does the dirt smear as he moves?

          Does his hock rotate in/out/around as his hoof contacts the ground???

          Can't video -- he's too far away and I don't think the seller is that savy.

          He puts his hoof down (angled out -- I think) and twists his hock, and I *think* the hoof moves (smears) possibly to become straight. There's a LOT of wigly movement in the hock area. Twisting movement that's almost circlular at the hock in motion. Very noticable.

          He's not lame. He also is not as muscular in the hind end as I'd like to see. But then again, maybe I'm wrong in assuming he needs to look like my TWH. He rode out fine; didn't stumble or seem to have any issues (aside from being owned by a timid rider and he doesn't seem to know how to canter -- but he gaits great). Maybe the canter issue is related to the hocks??? I just don't know.

          I don't want to incur the PPE expense if this is something I should just walk away from now.

          Help!!!
          If you cannot set a good example, at least serve as a terrible warning....

          Comment


          • #6
            Now would be a good time to walk away from this TWH and keep looking until you find one that doesn't send off the warning bells in your head. Trust your instincts!

            Sounds to me like he's not obviously lame because he's not being ridden and once he's ridden or trailered any distance, the lameness will become more obvious. Also sounds like a pelvis problem. Think us with lower back issues. And he's compensating which is why you've got the twisty leg/hock motion.

            Good luck.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by CanterQueen View Post
              Seller says it's the "older type TWH" (he's got Carbon Copy in his papers) and that's it's normal. I rode this gelding and under saddle he seems to move fine. I will have a PPE prior to purchase, but any ideas about his hind end? Something I should be concerned with later on down the road (he's 11 now)?

              Oh Great COTHers -- help!!!
              it's called wringing and no the old horses did not have it....it limits movement,twists off shoes behind and makes going forward at speed or any distance a LOT harder than it should be....
              Production Acres,Pro A Welsh Cobs
              I am one of the last 210,000 remaining full time farmers in America.We feed the others.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Tamara in TN View Post
                it's called wringing and no the old horses did not have it....it limits movement,twists off shoes behind and makes going forward at speed or any distance a LOT harder than it should be....
                We breed the Carbon Copy line (have one old direct Carbon Copy), and several horses out of the Carbon Copy championship bloodlines line (Mark of Carbon , Touch of Mark, Touch's Macho Man) and ours do not have wobbly hocks.

                Regarding wringing hocks, I've seen wringing hocks in the show ring (I think), but I thought it was due to how the horse was shod. The horse would step down with the hind foot and then twist it. Is wringing actually passed in some TWH bloodlines and not man-made?

                Comment


                • #9
                  my now 3 YO did this a ton as a leggy 2 YO...very twisty hocked, slightly twisting her hinds inward just after the weight bearing phase of her stride) ...she's in training now and getting solid trail and road miles under her belt, building hind end strength...I noticed in her videos I shot that she's gotten much less wringy (what a great term, it's new to me, lol) as her stifles, butt, etc gets better muscled.

                  Some are really extreme, though- she was not.

                  Comment

                  • Original Poster

                    #10
                    Update

                    Well, I passed on this gelding. Actually, we couldn't come to an agreement on purchase price. I would have done and extensive PPE prior to actually taking the gelding, but they want more for him (lots more) than I think an unfinished trail horse should go for.

                    I knew this going in and did ask if the price was negotiable. Seller said it was, but we couldn't come to an agreement.

                    Maybe I'll start a thread about prices in this current market and if sellers have been having a hard time selling their horses.
                    If you cannot set a good example, at least serve as a terrible warning....

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by TouchMeKnot View Post
                      Is wringing actually passed in some TWH bloodlines and not man-made?
                      well yes to both as breeding is supposedly a "planned" thing ...you will see it most in horses whose hind cannons are just too long regardless of who is on the papers...not long enough and you have no overstride...too long and there is sort of spider-y movement to the hind legs...either out or in..

                      done right there is a proper balance between a saddling horse and one with overstride but not pacing...

                      you can shoe to make it less noticeable it but the wring then"rests" in the hock itself and does more damage...

                      best
                      Production Acres,Pro A Welsh Cobs
                      I am one of the last 210,000 remaining full time farmers in America.We feed the others.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Bad legs and motion are in the breeding. They get passed on in families, expecially with line breeding. This would be why you watch a horse go, before you get on. Horse books show how to view a straight leg, from top to bottom, both front and hind legs. Each breed has their own proportions for being good at their jobs, but straight legged, crooked legged, twisting motions are something that needs to be noted before you continue with a sale horse to buy. Can you live with what is being shown to you?

                        Wringing of hocks, twisting of pelvis joints, cranking the leg each stride, add MUCH wear and tear to the joints of leg. Can cause problems with horse going many miles in rough conditions. May never bother anything on a ring horse, who never goes down a trail.

                        Every big name horse has a lot of produce, grandkids, that are much less horse than he was. The Dam adds 50%, and she may have been a piece of trash someone loved enough to breed. Some stallions do breed true. On most of their foals, you can read their imprint for the good or bad. The gaits, star, good temperment or terrible legs come on thru.

                        I would pass on a horse with severe, wringing hocks. Lots of wear and tear happening in those joints every stride, which accumulates over time and use.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Thanks for the info on the length of cannon bone and how it contributes.

                          Comment

                          Working...
                          X