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Best Breed for Amateurs in Dressage?

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  • #21
    OH for Gawd's sake! It isn't size.. it is training. I am 5-5 and ride a 5 yr old Hanoverian that is at least 17 hands.I am 50 and an AA... He is out of Deniro.. Yes.. a more AA friendly sire but still. Folks.. if any horse can be light off the aids if taught correctly. I have ridden various breeds that were suppose to be more AA friendly and I wouldn't have any in my barn. The preconception about warmbloods is just foolish. Are they strong? yes!! But unless you let them know that, they are like any other horse. They are smart and more than willing to please and most have good gaits for dressage. Sorry.. I have owned Arabs/Qh/Ango/trak and I will take a nice warmblood anytime. Now adays, warmbloods are not that much more expensive than other breeds if you are not looking for 8 gaits.. I have owned dutch, Rheilander and Holsteiner breeds. Loved them all. AA horses are horses that have a great disposition and want to learn... All horses have their own set of issues.. ie.. my arab was the spookiest horse I have ever owned but I learned to sit a spook! The mind is the most important ingredient for an AA who is a novice. Any horse, any breed can fit that bill.

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    • #22
      Originally posted by blackhorse6 View Post
      I disagree.. A warmblood that that has been trained correctly is as ridable as any horse/any breed.. Yes, they tend to be bigger but can be as light off the aids "if" you ask once, tell and then make.. I don't get the "breed" thing.. The warm bloods have great minds and are more than willing.. That said..gaits can be bigger but if you want to move up the levels and do well...riding dressage is about riding the movement..It is training at its highest.. even for the AA.. JMHO
      WBs tend to have much bigger paces that can be harder to sit, especially if you're not used to it. I think that's the issue more than them not having the right sort of mind.
      Horse Show Names Free name website with over 6200 names. Want to add? PM me!

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      • #23
        I will step out to say, there ALREADY are a LOT of breeders on this side of the pond that are producing amazing youngsters!

        esdressage, I would LOVE to have your friends come see my youngsters. Right now, I have the best I have ever bred, waiting for new owners, BUT what you have brought up is a marketing issue, one that all of us seem to be challenged by or else your friends would be buying our horses. There is still the "thrill" of buying in Europe despite the amount of excellent quality horses right here. We suffer from people thinking that the US is just too huge/expansive so it is easier to go buy in Europe (it may be easier, but I doubt less expensive). I love my warmblood mares and have also had a sane, fun TB to ride/compete. I know of several true ammy riders that should look for QH in the mix but typically they are built so downhill they cannot fairly compete unless they have a lot of something else in there as well.

        I have also heard that the Andalusian, Lusitanos are well suited for amateurs.

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        • #24
          I think it really depends on the amateur and what their goals are. If they want to show, then the trainer should look for a warmblood that has innate tick tock rhythm and a naturally uphill build. The ammy can get a decent score on this horse without having yet to know all the finer points of dressage--but once they learn about straightness and how to ride corners, etc., then they can get a great score! I have seen this with lower level amateurs, buying a nice wb that, for some reason or another (usually kind of dumb and lazy, or long in the back, not sharp, older, etc.), is not a pro horse, but moves with a natural uphill balance and a natural regular rhythm. They can post the trot at training level, so what does it matter?

          WBs have been bred for the sport. When some of the directives are already installed by nature, it makes it easier. There are plenty of wbs with calmer temperments and not hot that a top rider might not want for themselves, but is perfectly fine for the lower levels. If you get a big horse though, it has to be built uphill because a big heavy warmblood that is naturally balanced on the forehand is going to take strength and/or skill to rebalance.

          Something a little long in the back, might be more comfortable to sit--again, not something I would pick for the upper levels, but might be a winner at the lower levels.

          There are actual wb lines known for temperment and calmness--stay away from the more modern, hotter types.

          I hope I won't get flamed, but I'd steer you away from any off breeds. Friesians, which tend to attract amateur riders, are not easy to ride well....iberian horses can be super sensitive....crosses, well you never know what you are going to get...and anything downhill built is going to take skill to rebalance. Why not start out already ahead of the game?

          Also, for smaller adults, I do like the pony warmbloods.

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          • #25
            I think traditional Arabians are a wonderful choice -- sturdy, nice gaits, and very attuned to their people.

            One example -- I have his granddaughter, who looks like she will be just as much fun.
            Originally posted by HuntrJumpr
            No matter what level of showing you're doing, you are required to have pants on.

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            • #26
              Hmmm, let's see. How about...AMERICAN SADDLEBREDS?

              Lovely to sit on, will kill themselves to get it right, and you can find them with either extravagant gaits, or less so, like any other breed.

              Affordable, and sound-- and natural pocket ponies.

              I've owned or trained one of everything else, and I came back to them. What else can I say?
              When someone shows you who they are, BELIEVE them- Maya Angelou
              www.americansaddlebredsporthorse.net
              http://www.asbsporthorse.blogspot.com/

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              • #27
                I like TBs and even better yet a TB x WB!
                "Success comes in cans, not in cannots!"

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                • #28
                  How about a TB/Andalusion cross. Knew one once who was an absolute saint with anyone riding. I'm also a pure TB lover, and I do think they can be amazing with amateurs. But I would not put a TB with a really beginner amateur per se just because they are so sensitive and naturally very forward. But for an ammy with a decent skill level they are hard to beat.

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                  • #29
                    I'll have to say Warmbloods if you are looking for a "marketable" horse for Dressage and/or Jumping. They have been purpose bred for "sport" and many breeders, especially in the US breed for Ammy friendly temperaments.

                    Not all WBs are BIG. We have bred many "medium sized" ones that have went on to be very good Ammy horses while still being competitive. Showing is expensive and I've yet to meet an Ammy that didn't want to do well. A well trained WB isn't going to be any harder to ride than any other horse. In fact, a WB with a soft, supple top line is quite easy to sit.

                    We've worked with a lot of breeds over the years and the WBs we are producing now have the best work ethic and are easier to train than any horses we have ever worked with.
                    Patty
                    www.rivervalefarm.com
                    Follow us on facebook - https://www.facebook.com/pages/River...ref=ts&fref=ts

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                    • #30
                      Originally posted by ambar View Post
                      I think traditional Arabians are a wonderful choice -- sturdy, nice gaits, and very attuned to their people.

                      One example -- I have his granddaughter, who looks like she will be just as much fun.
                      Ooh, I like him! *drool* Good luck with the grandaughter! Arabians really can be fabulous.

                      patch work farm
                      - Glad to hear about your breeding program! I think you're right that both marketing and perception play a big role. There should be a link to your website on your posts! Free marketing

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                      • #31
                        This is a fun thread!

                        And though I agree that it is really the individual horse, it's mindset, and it's trainability, etc... there is one particular breed that I think is the ideal AA horse

                        APPALOOSA!!!

                        Now, having said that I know there are lots of people out there who think Appys have APPYTUDE!!!

                        However, when I was a relatively strong, juinor rider (in my teens), transitioning from my little grade appendix QH mare (we had done everything in 4-H from WP to games to HUS) to a horse that I could really learn to jump on, my instructor had a old style, stock horse bred, roaned out, rat tail, Appy mare named Tess who was just the bomb! She was barely 15HH but could jump the moon and, boy, did she teach me! And, always took care of me...

                        So, when I returned to the horse world a few years ago, after a two decade absence, I knew I wanted to have Appys again...

                        Not only do the older foundation lines have "Spanish" influence which makes them more capable of moving up the levels, the horses that survived the warfare lauched by the American Calvary, also survived a 1000+ mile trek with Chief Joseph and his tribe...

                        And, everyone knows they can jump!

                        Though there are so many wonderful breeds we can choose from, I really hope to further develop ideal, affordable, AA appaloosas for years to come!

                        And, I think Melyni is correct also... after all, Appys and Knabs do share a common ancester somewhere from the Orient or Eastern Europe!

                        Martha

                        Proud owner of Waps Heracles, 2009 Appaloosa Sport Horse Association IBC Winner at Dressage at Devon!
                        Gleann Oighrig LLC
                        Showing, Sales, Breeding, and Boarding
                        Manakin-Sabot, Virginia

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                        • #32
                          It takes a good match of horse and rider. It's not all about size or breeding. There are some AAs who can ride a variety of horse breeds and types. On the other hand there are some horses who need a certain type of rider. I won't target one breed or type for ammys.
                          You know, everybody thinks we found
                          this broken-down horse and fixed him,
                          but we didn't. He fixed us. Every one of us.

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                          • #33
                            Originally posted by ASB Stars View Post
                            Hmmm, let's see. How about...AMERICAN SADDLEBREDS?

                            Lovely to sit on, will kill themselves to get it right, and you can find them with either extravagant gaits, or less so, like any other breed.

                            Affordable, and sound-- and natural pocket ponies.

                            I've owned or trained one of everything else, and I came back to them. What else can I say?
                            Yup.

                            Rode many a Warmblood in my day - tall ones, short ones, sweet ones, rank ones, in Europe and here in NA. Ridden TBs, and various others in less numbers.
                            Have ridden or trained a number of Saddlebreds - they are extremely light to the aids (there's simply no comparison between a nice Saddlebred and even the lightest, most responsive WB, I'm sorry), extREMEly easy to train, easy to sit, very intelligent and turn themselves inside out to figure out what you want and give it to you. Sturdy, low maintenance, great feet, built uphill... THE breed that Dr Deb Bennett makes a *point* of saying is seriously overlooked as a Dressage mount. They also are very, very much tuned into their riders - which is really nice when you're in a scary situation and they don't check out and leave you in the dust on your hiney.

                            Not saying they're better than everything else mentioned, but they should definitely be given some serious consideration, especially since the nice sport-type ones can be had for a pittance.
                            www.jlsporthorsesales.net

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                            • #34
                              It ain't the breed. It's the hoss, boss!!!!

                              Every breed has its losers and winners. Every breed has atypical representatives out there,for better or worse,
                              Some riders change their horse, they change their saddle, they change their teacher; they never change themselves.

                              Remember the horse does all the work, we just sit there and look pretty.

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                              • #35
                                My first choice for an adult amateur who was somewhat ambitious would be a Friesian. I have worked with several different breeds of horses and by far the Friesians I worked with were the most fun! They were forward, friendly and SUPER WILLING and best of all as close to bomb-proof as anything I have ridden. Plus you can also drive them which is way more fun than most people would think.

                                However there is huge range of temperaments in all breeds - I have trained crazy Quarter Horses and lazy Thoroughbreds.

                                Certain Warmbloods can be great too. I have 2 young Dutch Warmblood crosses who are SUPER quiet - they have been so easy to train and take to new things very well. I know some very HOT warmbloods but I also know quite a few who are total packers.

                                I know several Quarter Horses who do okay in dressage - but if I was shopping for a dressage horse I probably would not take the chance and instead go for a breed more naturally built for the job. My motto is that "Dressage is hard enough - might as well have a horse that is made for the job". There are always exceptions to the rule though - my old QH gelding would have made a wonderful amateur dressage horse, but I have worked with a pile of QHs and most are not very suitable for competitive dressage.

                                My other picks would be:
                                - Morgans
                                - several large pony breeds such as Welsh Cob, Connemara, Fjord, Haflinger, etc.
                                - Andulusian

                                I have never ridden one myself but I have heard good things about Lusitano Horses.

                                I have quite a few friends who show Draft/TB crosses in dressage and do quite well (one is competing at Grand Prix) - but personally I am not a fan. I think they can be quiet but when they do have an "episode" they are soooooo strong. So if you are shopping for one I would definitely try in out thoroughly before purchasing. I guess I have just been drug around and ploughed over by one too many draft crosses in my life.

                                As for Arabs I find they can be hit-or-miss, some excel at dressage and some find it hard to work through the back. But I would most definitely look at Arabs if I had a small adult amateur looking for a dressage horse. Some of my favourite horses have been Arabs or Arab crosses.
                                Be firm, fair, kind, clear, consistent, patient, and, above all else, maintain a sense of humour.
                                www.stargazerfarm.ca

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                                • #36
                                  Originally posted by mitma View Post
                                  And, everyone knows they can jump!
                                  Too true. George Morris is always giving the appies props in the Practical Horseman jumping clinincs. As the proud owner (formerly, in my youth) of two amazing appies, I'm always glad to see it. Great horses!

                                  Comment


                                  • #37
                                    Originally posted by mitma View Post
                                    This is a fun thread!

                                    And though I agree that it is really the individual horse, it's mindset, and it's trainability, etc... there is one particular breed that I think is the ideal AA horse

                                    APPALOOSA!!!
                                    Yep, I would go with an Appaloosa also. But then, I am a bit biased.

                                    Comment


                                    • #38
                                      Originally posted by merrygoround View Post
                                      It ain't the breed. It's the hoss, boss!!!!

                                      Every breed has its losers and winners. Every breed has atypical representatives out there,for better or worse,
                                      150% behind this post. You have got to have a smart person with you to sniff out the details- but really there are GREAT horses in EVERY breed..to recognize true potential is worth more $$ that the price of the horse....If you ask me...(of course noone does...haha)!
                                      "the man mite be the head but the woman is the neck and the neck can turn the head any way she wants..." -smart greek woman

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                                      • #39
                                        appys rule!

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                                        • Original Poster

                                          #40
                                          I found the comment that longer backs tend to be easier to sit interesting. I had never thought about that before for some reason....as a teenager I had a super long backed wb cross...and she was nice to sit....

                                          Saddlebreds are an interesting option for dressage. I recently bought a little saddlebred/arab cross for lessons, and I absolutely love him for rideability, and how balanced he is. We have a saddlebred x draft in the barn too right now...an older gelding who seems nice enough (although I am pretty sure his owner bought him for his thick mane and tail!)

                                          I agree that some warmbloods are easier to sit than others; I have an arab/wb cross pinto that is very amateur friendly, but in general I find that their gaits (trot and canter) require more flexibility than the typical amateur who sits at a desk all day has...and up here anyway, the ammy friendly warmbloods aren't cheap! Of course posting the trot is an option, but I find that until a rider can sit the gaits, the amount they can learn is limited. Hard to feel the horse's back and know what leg is doing what when you are only in the tack half the time!

                                          I have enjoyed reading the opinions on the different breeds, and find it interesting how the perception on the same breed can differ so much between people involved in the same sport.
                                          Freeing worms from cans everywhere!

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