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DVCTA - DaD Parting Ways?

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  • DVCTA - DaD Parting Ways?

    So, is it happening.....rumors abound.

  • #2
    I sit on the board of both organizations. Basically, each was an insurance liability to the other. Dressage at Devon is now it's own entity and has applied for non-profit status which should be finallized within a year. The separation was welcomed by both organizations.
    I support and enable the USA bred horse and the USA breeder.

    Comment

    • Original Poster

      #3
      "Basically, each was an insurance liability to the other."....hmmmm. Hasn't been a problem for 32 years what happenned?

      DAD is a show that grosses over half a million dollars. Did the members of DVCTA get to vote on the split? Will DVCTA get royalties from the show?

      Comment


      • #4
        this isn't really a surprise, from a business perspective. there are GMOs that runs horse trials as separate entities from the mother organization for the same reasons. but it doesn't mean the people running it will be any different. its just how its being run under its own name so the liability of the show doesn't take the rest of the GMO down with it. god forbid Sydney took a blow from the black knight and sued

        Comment


        • #5
          how perceptive of you rosinante - things are never what they seem in real life or the horse world. The thing I found curious is that there has been no mention, even by way of a formal good-bye statement, in any DVCTA publication, newsletter, or website. When things "appear" to be done behind the door of the membership at large one must wonder why. If it's so amicable a split why all the silence????
          while I have no trouble believing in talking lions, emerald cities, and winged monkeys, I refuse to accept there is no paperwork involved when one's house lands on a witch."

          Comment


          • #6
            They call it "circling the wagons"

            I certainly understand LoriK's wish to sanitize this- but I am quite removed from caring...so...here is what I have heard...

            My understanding is that there was allegedly at least one- possibly two- lawsuits that were aimed at DAD due to the fact that the DAD folks had entered into contracts with, in one case, a company that would bring in sponsors for the show. Apparently, DVCTA was not aware of the existence of this contract until such time as it had gone way south, and the company was threatening legal action.

            In addition, it is alledged that DAD promised substantial funds to USDF for the new headquarters in Lexington, without obtaining permission from DVCTA.

            My personal opinion is that things can only get better with the changes at the top. I think that it is apparent that any time you let people run rampant with control over something like this- which they consider to be a BIG deal, you wind up with huge issues. And they did.
            When someone shows you who they are, BELIEVE them- Maya Angelou
            www.americansaddlebredsporthorse.net
            http://www.asbsporthorse.blogspot.com/

            Comment


            • #7
              This split was just finallized in early September. I'm sure the members will read about this in the next newsletter.

              The DVCTA Board of Directors voted on the split. It was a hot topic in the monthly meetings for several months with the 'separation agreement' changing several times. These meetings are open to the entire membership. If any member wants to keep abreast about anything that DVCTA is doing, I suggest that you go to the meetings. There is not now, and never has been an intent to do anything 'behind the members backs'.

              There are financials from the show that will continue for DVCTA.

              Yes, the liability issue has been there since the show began, but after taking a long, hard look at the what if's, it was decided that one law suit against DAD could keep DVCTA from having other shows, clinics and horse trials, and one lawsuit against DVCTA could keep DAD from opening it's gates. DAD had been the tail wagging the dog for many years.

              BTW, I was not trying to 'sanitize' anything. I tend to be succinct when I post. Anyone who wants the long version, should stop listening to rumors and get to a meeting to hear first hand what's going on.
              I support and enable the USA bred horse and the USA breeder.

              Comment


              • #8
                My understanding is that with a lawsuit pending, DAD would be unable to have insurance that would allow the show to open- which is essentially what you were saying, Lori.

                If anything that I have stated as being "alleged" is untrue- for those who are not in the area, or do not wish to join DVCTA- please feel free to correct the "rumors".

                In the absence of such correction, my statements regarding the donation to USDF, and the lawsuits stand.
                When someone shows you who they are, BELIEVE them- Maya Angelou
                www.americansaddlebredsporthorse.net
                http://www.asbsporthorse.blogspot.com/

                Comment


                • #9
                  My understanding is that with a lawsuit pending, DAD would be unable to have insurance that would allow the show to open- which is essentially what you were saying, Lori.

                  If anything that I have stated as being "alleged" is untrue- for those who are not in the area, or do not wish to join DVCTA- please feel free to correct the "rumors".

                  In the absence of such correction, my statements regarding the donation to USDF, and the lawsuits stand.
                  When someone shows you who they are, BELIEVE them- Maya Angelou
                  www.americansaddlebredsporthorse.net
                  http://www.asbsporthorse.blogspot.com/

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    My understanding is that with a lawsuit pending, DAD would be unable to have insurance that would allow the show to open- which is essentially what you were saying, Lori.

                    If anything that I have stated as being "alleged" is untrue- for those who are not in the area, or do not wish to join DVCTA- please feel free to correct the "rumors".

                    In the absence of such correction, my statements regarding the donation to USDF, and the lawsuits, stand.
                    When someone shows you who they are, BELIEVE them- Maya Angelou
                    www.americansaddlebredsporthorse.net
                    http://www.asbsporthorse.blogspot.com/

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      ASB Stars,

                      The first lawsuit you mentioned happened prior to my DVCTA mebership (let alone election to the board), so I can not comment on the knowledge, or lack thereof by the DVCTA board when the contract was signed. It went on for years and was settled by the (then) president of DVCTA without the DAD committee agreement.

                      The other lawsuit was related to an accident/injury that happened at DAD. It had nothing to do with contracts. The judge dismissed it. This, however really opened the eyes of everyone concerned as to the insurance liability issue and was a catalyst for the separation.

                      The gift to USDF fit into the agreement that DAD can give a certain amount of money to 'other charities". It also fit into the DAD and DVCTA mission of education. That, too was done before I was elected to the board so I do not know when the DVCTA board was notified.
                      I support and enable the USA bred horse and the USA breeder.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        best of luck towards the future, everyone.

                        And a big thanks to you, Lori, you always keep everything pulled together so nicely. BTW, we loved the IBC#65 this year, everyone there had a great time. Thanks again for all your hard work.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          as someone who was on the BoD of a GMO (not DVCTA) for 5 years, i can tell you that the board of a GMO doesn't do anything without voting and considering the ramifications on the entire club and its members. when you run a special event of this magnitude it SHOULD be run as a seperate corporation to isolate it from the other activities. as was said you don't want a rider falling at a fence at a horse trial suing the DVCTA for negligence which then shuts down DAD. it may have been a heated debate and change is difficult, but it was the correct thing to do from a business perspective.

                          getting people to run on the board is difficult, nobody wants to devote that kind of time and responsibility and if they think they are singing up for a couple horse trials and a dressage show then end up being responsible for DAD by association it's even more daunting. its real easy though to sit back as a member and be critical of executive decisions. attend some meetings, even the annual banquet, understand why decisions are being made.

                          half the fun for me being on the BoD was seeing how these corporations run the events that we all take for granted. and you also get a lot of information about things that aren't apparent from reading GMO newsletters.

                          there are very few GMOs running activities of this magnitude anymore. its just good business practice.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by lorik View Post
                            ASB Stars,

                            The first lawsuit you mentioned happened prior to my DVCTA mebership (let alone election to the board), so I can not comment on the knowledge, or lack thereof by the DVCTA board when the contract was signed. It went on for years and was settled by the (then) president of DVCTA without the DAD committee agreement.

                            The other lawsuit was related to an accident/injury that happened at DAD. It had nothing to do with contracts. The judge dismissed it. This, however really opened the eyes of everyone concerned as to the insurance liability issue and was a catalyst for the separation.

                            The gift to USDF fit into the agreement that DAD can give a certain amount of money to 'other charities". It also fit into the DAD and DVCTA mission of education. That, too was done before I was elected to the board so I do not know when the DVCTA board was notified.
                            Lori, without saying more than I think that your answers are quite coy, considering the fact that you have been a part of DAD itself for many years, and the fact that every member of that tight-knit "disfunctional family" was more than aware of the details throughout, I don't question the absolute, and careful, veracity of your statement.

                            The fact that the DAD committee didn't settle the first lawsuit, for me at least, is more about the parent taking care of what the children had gotten into.

                            And the fact that you doo't know "when the DVCTA board was notified" is more indicative of the issues of which I speak. Shouldn't DVCTA have VOTED as to what funds where offered where- especially in light of the fact that DAD was simply a standing committee of DVCTA at the time? Rather than one individual, as an example, deciding for the group that they should donate, say 50K, without the approval of the GMO? Just asking...LOL...
                            When someone shows you who they are, BELIEVE them- Maya Angelou
                            www.americansaddlebredsporthorse.net
                            http://www.asbsporthorse.blogspot.com/

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              ASB,
                              Although I have been the breed show secretary at Dressage at Devon for quite a few years now, I was only added to the executive committee (now board) three years ago. The law suit in question happened long before that. Three years before being added to the ex. com. I started going to the general committee meetings just before the show to let them know how entries were coming. Then I started going to all of them the year after that. You seem to think I have a whole lot more knowledge than I actually have. I am really not being coy. I simply will not pass on information of which I do not have first hand knowledge. To do that is just to feed (or start) rumors.

                              The pledge to USDF was voted on in the executive committee meeting of DAD and also in the general committee meeting and is paid over a 5 year period of time.

                              As a 501c3, the books are open and are audited anually. Anyone can gain access to them. I really don't see the point in belaboring all of this.
                              I support and enable the USA bred horse and the USA breeder.

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                No, I don't either...but I do think more of the facts are available now to those who have asked than were before.

                                Thanks!
                                When someone shows you who they are, BELIEVE them- Maya Angelou
                                www.americansaddlebredsporthorse.net
                                http://www.asbsporthorse.blogspot.com/

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  and the blind shall see

                                  Originally posted by lorik View Post
                                  ASB Stars,

                                  The first lawsuit you mentioned happened prior to my DVCTA mebership (let alone election to the board), so I can not comment on the knowledge, or lack thereof by the DVCTA board when the contract was signed. It went on for years and was settled by the (then) president of DVCTA without the DAD committee agreement.

                                  The other lawsuit was related to an accident/injury that happened at DAD. It had nothing to do with contracts. The judge dismissed it. This, however really opened the eyes of everyone concerned as to the insurance liability issue and was a catalyst for the separation.

                                  The gift to USDF fit into the agreement that DAD can give a certain amount of money to 'other charities". It also fit into the DAD and DVCTA mission of education. That, too was done before I was elected to the board so I do not know when the DVCTA board was notified.
                                  Well, this back and forth banter is certainly intriuging. So much so that the "detective" in me did a little sleuthing LOL. Turns out the horse community is a small one. My trails led me to seek out a few prior DVCTA board members to ask a few pertinent Q's. Wow - what you find out if you ask the right peeps.

                                  First let's discuss the "gift" to USDF by DAD; I was told that the DVCTA Board learned about the money to be gifted after the fact - it had already been pledged when the then president learned about it. Understanding the liability posed to DVCTA (after all, if DAD would default, however unlikely) DVCTA would be on the hook to honor the gift. Wow - my thought was how would I like my relative to go out, secure a loan/liability in my name, and not tell me??? Whew! So the board voted that Dec. to "table" the pledge pending further information and financial info. until the new year. I was told that no one questioned the purpose of the gift, just the amount. Funnily enough, that was when all of the election fiasco (their words not mine) took place; the then president and vp were challenged in the election and resignations took place all around. If you look on the DVCTA's website you'll notice that there are several board members from the DAD comm. that gained seats on the board that year. USDF got their pledge. Hmmmm.....coincidence or just helpful volunteers caring about their association???? You decide.

                                  Also couldn't resist asking about lawsuits real or imagined. Yes, Lori is correct there was only one that was long standing - I believe they said five years or so w/DAD being unable to settle it. The then president (the "ousted" one, poor girl) settled it in a week with what I was told were careful negotiations and guidance from a very qualified law firm. So happy news for the gmo you'd think. Well, the DVCTA board was happy about it of course. But I was told that there were several DAD comm. members that attended a meeting to question the legality of the DVCTA president to settle the lawsuit without THEIR permission!!!! At this point the conversation got very funny because it was described to me that they came in with everything but "flaming torches". Heavens, don't you just love clubs??? Well, again I was told that the DVCTA leadership was certainly well within their rights to settle this to the benefit of the club - actually, I'd think it was their responsibility! So, I guess there was some disgruntled folks.

                                  I guess what all of this says to me, providing it is true, is that a "divorce", separation, or whatever you wanna call it, between the gmo and the show was a necessary thing or finding anyone to take the DVCTA leadership would become, I would think, increasingly difficult. I mean who wants to be responsible and put up with that kind of stuff? Yikes! Very sad indeed.

                                  Last but not least I have to address the notification to the gmo's membership about a decision of this magnitude. Lori, notifying the membership in the newsletter after the fact is like shutting the barn door after the horse is galloping down the driveway. I also take issue with your assertion that the meetings are open to all members. Well, if no agenda is published to notify the membership at large that something BIG is being discussed that seems to be a bit back door does it not? Minutes do not appear in any of the newsletters I've ever seen so how is the membership to be kept informed of any of this? Is it not unreasonable to expect the membership to attend all meetings on the off chance that something of import is being discussed? Maybe even a mass mailing outlining what's in the works would have been a prudent and respectful way to proceed? Maybe the membership will be delighted with the separation and decisions made on their behalf. After all, that is why they elect their board. I do think though, that the DVCTA membership was done a disservice to be left out of this club-altering decision regardless of the ultimate outcome.

                                  Finally, best wishes to DVCTA and DAD as separate entities - long may they wave.
                                  while I have no trouble believing in talking lions, emerald cities, and winged monkeys, I refuse to accept there is no paperwork involved when one's house lands on a witch."

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    You've got the right of it!

                                    Your explanation is EXACTLY what I have been given to understand. However, I'll take it a step further....

                                    My understanding is that the DVCTA board- at that time- was appalled at the stance taken by DAD- in essence, DAD had already become it's own entity, in the mindsof those at the top. They considered themselves to be autonomous. The contract that was signed with the sponsorhip firm was executed by them, allegedly, without the blessing of the DVCTA BOD. Whe the deal went south, they found a pro bono attorney who, apparently, made things even worse- antagonizing the principle, who was referred to, by one of the DAD top doggies, to me personally, as "Mr. Slimy Sport". Not a great way to address those you were doing business with, eh?

                                    The DAD folks then determined that they simply would take over the BOD of DVCTA, allegedly, and worked very hard to get the positions on the board, encouraging like-minded people to join and vote, lobbying members for proxies, etc.

                                    This, I believe, was the election where Lori came to be on the BOD of DVCTA, along with others.

                                    I am quite sure that they all believe that THEY have the correct view, and that THEY are the ones who can get this done- better, perhaps, than anyone else. Maybe so, but time will tell, as DAD is reorganized into a kinder, gentler, organization.
                                    When someone shows you who they are, BELIEVE them- Maya Angelou
                                    www.americansaddlebredsporthorse.net
                                    http://www.asbsporthorse.blogspot.com/

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      Memories of events are often colored by opinion. I'm sure that all of the principles in all of these events remember things differently from one another.

                                      During the time in question, DAD had no representation on the DVCTA board of directors. This, to me is akin to 'taxation without representation'. And, yes, I was one of the newly elected board members at that time.

                                      Since that election, the meetings have been friendlier, the clinics and educational opportunities have multiplied exponentially, the horse trials have been re-instated, and the club is getting more younger members involved in the day to day workings of DVCTA. It is my opinion that DVCTA is a stronger club now than it was three years ago with more to offer it's membership.
                                      I support and enable the USA bred horse and the USA breeder.

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        Your statement is incorrect. There have been for years, 2 DAD liason positions on the DVCTA Board. Whether or not they chose to report for DAD to DVCTA, was their personal decision. From what I recall in my experience from the DVCTA mtgs, (& my mental status is so far pretty good,) the DAD liason slept through most DVCTA mtgs. & had to be awakened to make his statements on behalf of the club.

                                        Comment

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