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Anky and Salinero are not coming to Las Vegas **UPDATE** All European horses arrived

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  • #41
    It is reasonable to expect to see top sport.

    Top sport in dressage is the current two most successful riders on their top sport horses.

    Here is a list of Anky's placings at World Cup:

    2008: 1e, I.P.S Salinero
    2006: 1e, Keltec Salinero
    2005: 1e, Keltec Salinero
    2004: 1e, Gestion Salinero
    2000: 1e, Gestion Bonfire
    1999: 1e, Gestion Bonfire
    1998: 2e, Gestion Bonfire
    1997: 1e, Gestion Bonfire
    1996: 1e, Bonfire
    1995: 1e, Bonfire
    1993: 9e, Cocktail
    1990: 9e, Prisco
    1989: 7e, Prisco


    Anyone who believes she has not contributed to the success of dressage, top sport dressage and in particular the growth of Woirld Cup Dressage..I must respectfully disagree with that.
    one oak, lots of canyons

    http://horsesportnews.wordpress.com/

    Comment


    • #42
      http://www.eurodressage.com/reports/...wildcard2.html

      Necessity is the mother of invention. Anky van Grunsven's partner Sjef Janssen is going to make sure that Anky will compete Salinero in Las Vegas. Janssen told the Dutch Press Agency ANP that he'll hire a lawyer if that is what it takes for Anky to get a wild card.


      As Janssen is now hitting a brick wall with the rule of two qualifiers -- a requirement which he himself passionately pushed through with the FEI as official rule -- he has told the press he won't accept his own rule. According to him, there is plenty of room in the rules to circumvent the problem.

      "The rules are not waterproof, that is clear," Janssen told ANP. "If the FEI wants it, Anky will compete, but apparently they don't want that. Formally, Anky is qualified with Painted Black and the instances seem to want her to take him to Las Vegas."
      Last edited by ridgeback; Mar. 22, 2009, 03:46 PM.
      Love and compassion are necessities, not luxuries. Without them, humanity cannot survive. Dalai Lama

      Comment


      • #43
        Originally posted by canyonoak View Post
        << And, just because rules have been bent before does not make it right in this case (or any other).>>



        and once again here is FEI's own World Cup Rule 490:

        Art. 490 General

        The FEI has the right to allow reasonable exceptions to the Rules for the World Cup Dressage.
        Come on canyonoak! Every organization puts that rider in their rules (to lessen the possibility of a lawsuit) But it still doesn't make the breaking or bending of rules right or fair.

        As I said, I guess it is just which side of the fence one is on when one cries foul!

        Catherine Haddad got caught up in a qualifying scenerio as I recall over the last Olympic team qualifiers. Hard luck for her and her fans and maybe argueably the US team? But, I am sure the USEF has such a rider in their rules that lessened the possibility of a law suit.

        And, didn't AIG have such a rider re: the bonus being handed out????

        Comment


        • #44
          What a mess! I'd be too embarrassed to actually try to break a rule I pushed through myself.

          Comment


          • #45
            Originally posted by claire View Post
            Come on canyonoak! Every organization puts that rider in their rules (so as not to get sued)

            As I said, I guess it is just which side of the fence one is on when one cries foul!

            Catherine Haddad got caught up in a qualifying scenerio as I recall over the last Olympic team qualifiers. Hard luck for her and her fans and maybe argueably the US team? But, I am sure the USEF has such a rider in their rules that lessened the possibility of a law suit.

            Lets not forget the U.S. also changed their rules half way through when Courntey went to Europe and didn't get the scores she needed so they changed the rule that scores could be dropped.
            Love and compassion are necessities, not luxuries. Without them, humanity cannot survive. Dalai Lama

            Comment


            • #46
              Originally posted by canyonoak View Post
              It is reasonable to expect to see top sport.
              Top sport in dressage is the current two most successful riders on their top sport horses.

              But. You are making my point. Dressage seems to be more of a Freestyle exhibition than a "top sport". And would be better off handled as such.

              As a freestyle exhibition it IS reasonable for the fans to "expect" to see favorite riders.

              As a Sport, there are objective rules and quaifications for the Superbowls of competition. And luck or hard luck figures in what teams and players get to go to the playoffs. Sometimes, it isn't the team or player with the most wins that goes to the playoff.
              And the "fans" are often disappointed.

              But Superbowl tickets are still sold out!

              Comment


              • #47
                This will be the third World Cup I've been to in Vegas. I really don't care if Anky shows up. Rules are rules. If anyone should know the rules, it's those riders competing at those levels. The FEI sticks to their drug rules; seems to me, they need to stick to these rules. By showing favoritism (no matter what some think are "good" reasons), it's disrespectful of the sport and disrespectful of the other competitors who have qualified in accordance with the rules.

                I, for one, would like to see some other riders have a shot at the brass ring. Seeing the same old head-to-head is boring. Why bother buying tickets when the outcome is always "predestined" to be the same?

                With the line-up of riders on the roster for Vegas, I think it will be a really exciting competition even without Anky.
                "Dreams are the touchstone of our characters." Henry David Thoreau
                Touchstone Farm
                www.bytouchstonefarm.com

                Comment


                • #48
                  This kind of bending over backwards every time Anky and partner don't get their way, thus not ensuring her of a win to me is just plain childish and poor sportsmanship.

                  It is very discouraging to me as a person who may only have 1 or 2 horses my entire life time that could compete grand prix to never have any success, even at the smallest show b/c of rule bending for big pockets and whinning attitudes that trickels down to even some of the smaller "arenas" so to speak.

                  Yes we may all love to she Anky compete, etc, etc but to me rules are rules.

                  I will always love and respect dressage, but if the FEI gives in to Anky, once again, I will loose a LOT of respect for the sport/competition aspect of dressage period.

                  Comment


                  • #49
                    Ok, stick a fork in it. I was on the fence about Anky, still willing to give her the benefit of the doubt in terms of her training and riding. But if this accurate reporting, then sorry. This is not a person I can admire or even respect, and that goes for her training methods. There's a real character flaw showing here.

                    And Sjef, ugh.

                    *throws tomatoes*
                    Ring the bells that still can ring
                    Forget your perfect offering
                    There is a crack in everything
                    That's how the light gets in.

                    Comment

                    • Original Poster

                      #50
                      Originally posted by MelantheLLC View Post
                      Ok, stick a fork in it. I was on the fence about Anky, still willing to give her the benefit of the doubt in terms of her training and riding. But if this accurate reporting, then sorry. This is not a person I can admire or even respect, and that goes for her training methods. There's a real character flaw showing here.

                      And Sjef, ugh.

                      *throws tomatoes*
                      Accurate reporting

                      You probably don't like accurate reporting, because if you do you have to go through the rules and regulations of the FEI, with an open mind !, before giving a valid opinion.

                      I know that this is not going to happen but I trully wish that the whole Dutch Team stayed home.

                      Theo

                      Comment


                      • #51
                        Originally posted by freestyle2music View Post
                        Accurate reporting

                        You probably don't like accurate reporting, because if you do you have to go through the rules and regulations of the FEI, with an open mind !, before giving a valid opinion.

                        I know that this is not going to happen but I trully wish that the whole Dutch Team stayed home.

                        Theo
                        Yeah, that's what the AIG bonus guys said too.
                        Ring the bells that still can ring
                        Forget your perfect offering
                        There is a crack in everything
                        That's how the light gets in.

                        Comment


                        • #52
                          You know: I just wanted to see the reigning Olympic Champion(s / World Champion(s)/ European Champion(s)/ World Cup Champion(s) one more time.

                          (Which for me will probably be last time, as I doubt that I will go to Euros and very much doubt will go to WEG.)

                          I don't want to see half the partnership, but the whole partnership.

                          That is top sport.

                          And that is what the FEI says it is here to promote.

                          This entire situation has very little to do with "rules and regulations" and everything to do with power and politics.

                          I do so hope reason and sportsmanship and fairness win out.

                          And even as I write that, I can already see the responses.

                          We will just have to agree to disagree.
                          one oak, lots of canyons

                          http://horsesportnews.wordpress.com/

                          Comment


                          • #53
                            Originally posted by canyonoak View Post
                            You know: I just wanted to see the reigning Olympic Champion(s / World Champion(s)/ European Champion(s)/ World Cup Champion(s) one more time.

                            Love and compassion are necessities, not luxuries. Without them, humanity cannot survive. Dalai Lama

                            Comment


                            • #54
                              As a freestyle exhibition it IS reasonable for the fans to "expect" to see favorite riders.

                              As a Sport, there are objective rules and quaifications for the Superbowls of competition. And luck or hard luck figures in what teams and players get to go to the playoffs. Sometimes, it isn't the team or player with the most wins that goes to the playoff.
                              And the "fans" are often disappointed.


                              Perfectly stated Claire! The FEI needs to decide if it's worth making dressage into an exhibition. That said, I think of the World Cup as very much an exhibition rather than a dressage competition. It is a very fun atmosphere (at least it was the year I went, the first year it was in Vegas) in which the crowd actually participated, even clapping along in time with one of the riders' passage! Not at all the same as any CDI I've ever been to! However if the crowd is actually having "fun" would that not attract more sponsors? My only worry is that all competitions would end up like that... but I do not think that will ever happen anyway!
                              So... sport, or exhibition??
                              www.dressagevision.com

                              Comment


                              • #55
                                If all someone has to do is sue or threaten to sue to get on the team or in a competition, then we might as well have the courts decide who wins and skip the actual competition! Because then the ones who "win" will also be the ones who have the deepest pocket. Wow...what a great sport that would be!
                                "Dreams are the touchstone of our characters." Henry David Thoreau
                                Touchstone Farm
                                www.bytouchstonefarm.com

                                Comment


                                • #56
                                  And if it had been Debbie McDonald in the same situation? Or Isabell? Would love to see the difference in the responses. The FEI is a business. That is why rules have built-in loopholes. There is so much more to it than one person going to one horse show. FEI contact info is at www.horsesport.org - if this is so important to you, tell them.

                                  Comment


                                  • #57
                                    Playing field should be level for everyone regardless of who you are. Why should Anky not have to follow the rules? To say she is number one isn't a good enough reason. I wonder if they would be making such a fuss if she had beaten Isabell this weekend?
                                    Love and compassion are necessities, not luxuries. Without them, humanity cannot survive. Dalai Lama

                                    Comment


                                    • #58
                                      Ah yes, but again, if you go back to the FEI rule that Canyonoak posted, not a rule is being bent if they let her take Sal instead of PB.

                                      Comment


                                      • #59
                                        Originally posted by Coreene View Post
                                        Ah yes, but again, if you go back to the FEI rule that Canyonoak posted, not a rule is being bent if they let her take Sal instead of PB.

                                        Well this is like Clinton saying it depends how you define is. Like I said I don't feel this is reasonable especially since this is a rule Sjef wanted and got becareful for what you wish for.
                                        Love and compassion are necessities, not luxuries. Without them, humanity cannot survive. Dalai Lama

                                        Comment


                                        • #60
                                          What made Sjef ask for this 2 qualifier rule in the first place?
                                          Ring the bells that still can ring
                                          Forget your perfect offering
                                          There is a crack in everything
                                          That's how the light gets in.

                                          Comment

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