Training the Halt

[floosha]

Hi everybody, this is my first time posting, so please don't be too harsh!

I ride a 9yr old TB gelding that was previously used as a hunt seat horse. I do have a very competent trainer and horse and I have made quite a bit of progress together. Our one big problem area is this horse hates to halt. He knows what woah is and will halt in hand, but once on his back (or while longing,) he tunes it right out. My trainer and I have been working on simple walk-halt transitions with the hope that he we can get to a point where it doesn't take 20 walk steps to finally halt. She has me riding him into a resisting hand and using my seat to get him to halt, and not simply pull back on the reins. He has the same issue with her riding him as well. However, we have been working on this for months and the walk steps have not decreased. It still takes many many steps to halt.

In a clinic we recently rode in, the clinician said I need to try a different route. He said to try using my hand, even if I have to give a little pull or tug, because the horse is clearly blowing my aids off. Well, it still took several walk steps to halt, and my horse became very very upset. He wanted to back up after we got the halt and got very spooky, reactive, and tense. He felt ready to blow. He would take off into this erratic, strung out canter, and seemed checked out.

An important note is this horse used to be very strong in hand for previous owner. When he got this way, she would halt him and back him up to get him paying attention. I am wondering is he associates halting with "getting in trouble," so to speak.

He is in a very mild KK bit and is utd on everything, including teeth. Saddle fits. I have tried different bits with the same result. I really don't know what to do. As I said, he knows how to woah and will do so quickly on the ground. I have tried voice aids, cookies afterwards, etc. He'd just rather keep trucking along, and gets upset when more assertion is used.

Please help. This horse is sweet and a lovely mover. Thank you so much!

[Lost_at_C]

Are you giving with your hands after asking for the halt??

The horse needs space to relax down into the halt and I find that many who are resistant are instantly cured by asking with the seat AND hand, then giving them room to do what they've been asked... this might be especially true if your boy is expecting harsh hands/backing commands.

[analise]

My only other thought is that once he does halt, you should relax too so he can associate it with release.

Of course, I accidentally taught my horse to halt when I exhale too loud so...

(no, really, for a long time when I was working on getting a nice halt, my instructor at the time encouraged me to exhale when I sat deep to ask for the halt. So now he associates an exaggerated exhale as a cue for slowing/stopping.)

I know he's an OTTB so it might take a while, but I suppose you can also always go the route of working him really hard for a long time so that when you finally ask him to halt, he wants to. Then end on that so he can associate it with being done/getting a treat/whatever.

[floosha]

Hi Lost, yes I have tried relaxing my hands, giving with my hands, giving to the point of big loops in the rein, keeping my legs soft around his body while giving,etc. It's very troubling...

[floosha]

I should mention that it has also been impossible to teach basics such as the turn on the forehand, due to this issue. Even the using the wall, he wants to charge ahead and won't stay at a halt. (If I can even get him to that point!)

[beowulf]

welcome to the forum!

it sounds like, from what you've said, he is simply ignoring you. whether it is out of indolence or maybe a training mishap, it is hard to tell and probably only he knows! i think your assumption is right that maybe he considers halting with getting in trouble - i have seen many tb's take that route while training.

how is he with other transitions? can you go from a canter to a trot? what do you do for this transition - do you squeeze with your thigh muscles? sit deeper? resisting hand with seat? what about a voice command? a loud exhale? sometimes, it can be easier to move up a transition to fix a smaller transition - i.e, if he is good doing trot to walk, why not "train him" to slow the gait by using voice aid first, then seat, then hand?

with my ottb, i had similar problems -- if i simply "pulled", he would desist the movement and halt crookedly on his own time -- because he was mulish (i later learned his mulishness was due to an improper saddle fit that had been refitted for him MANY TIMES!). i learned you cant win tug of war with a horse, and instead, offered "vibrating tension" in the reins as a last resort. he didn't have anything to pull against, and thus couldn't win. i'd ask for the halt by first saying "whoa", and then sitting deep into my saddle and using my seat to influence his gait to slow down -- and finally, the rein if he didn't listen.

to me, it seems as if your horse is being ostensible - but there has to be a reason why. it could be "trauma" from his last owner - it could be his bit or his saddle. if this is a perfect world and everything fits him perfect and he is comfortable, i would suggest not being the passenger anymore (as it seems to me that's what he sees you as: a passenger). if he doesn't listen to your voice command undersaddle, don't say it again. use your seat promptly. if he does not listen to that, vibrate your reins - if he blows through that, you do truly need to resort to halting him with the bit - DO release the second he gives. this doesn't mean you need to get after him, but he needs to learn to respect your commands. i would do this many times until he is obedient and sass-free. if your trainer is having the same problem as you it is likely not a rider error but a past training one, which means the two of you have to work together to convince him to overcome this barricade.

if it is not a perfect world and everything does not fit him flawlessly and he is not happy with the bit or the saddle or whatever else, maybe consider finding what the root of his issue is. i find horses don't act "mulish" for no reason; there is always a reason -- it's up to us to find it.


edit: OP, how green is he? he sounds like he's as green as they come. sometimes, with the "babies", they get a little worked up before they calm down - and it's okay to let them so long as they aren't dangerous. sometimes you have to push through their seemingly neurotic meltdowns and just praise and pat them and let them know theyre doing a good job -- with ottbs, it's ALWAYS darkest before dawn.

[Jealoushe]

Agree - this horse is not listening to your aids. Sorry but if it is to the point where he won't halt at all - an intervention must take place. Ask with your seat, shoulders, half halt, if nothing then HALT immediately, even if that mean pulling him up. Sounds like up to this point he has just been allowed to run away with you.

Repeat until horse realizes that those aids mean WHOA.

[VaqueroToro]

Do you have any walls/high rails handy where you ride?

Walk him right into the wall/rail and give your aids for the halt, seat in vast more quantity than hand (corners work well to start off with since it'll surround him). Do not let him turn from the direction you point him in. He'll have no choice but to halt and once does, give him a pet. Call it quits when he gives it to you in a calm fashion.

Repeat it into the wall/corner, and once he's consistent and calm there, try it facing the wall (so he's open on both sides), then a bit before the wall, etc.

ETA: Different discipline, but this might be worth checking out, ie, seat aid plus rapid series of half halts.

[floosha]

Thanks for the replies so far! He is a strange combination of green and not-so-green. He came to me with a big mix of weird training. Our biggest issue was getting him more used to contact, and we have made so much progress considering he was a bad bad curler. During long and low work he still prefers to go down and in, rather than down and out.

I can transition him off my seat downward from canter to trot very easily by stopping my following seat. Trot to walk is a bit harder because he wants to pop his head up sometimes or keep going at the same pace. Other times he listens to my seat. A big issue is he blows off half-halts. I get the impression he doesn't really know they are even happening, or he is ignoring them. Possibly he never learned them, other than just pulling back when he got going too fast over the jumps. Half-halts typically result in head-popping even when I am using my inside leg.

Using one leg still means speed up, not move over and away from. We have made recent progress in that area, and have a decent leg yield(walk trot, and canter) and shoulder-in on good days (walk only) but when he checks out, any leg means speed up. Not very good with mobilizing his shoulders and is very laterally stiff. Spent so much time getting him leg yield without just dragging himself sideways with his shoulders. (Believe me, it still happens!) Very very reactive to the whip, so I don't really ever use it. Sitting trot means it's time to canter in his mind, so he get's tense and rushes forward.

He does keep a great rhythm at the trot and walk, while his canter can be rushed. I am guessing from his jumping years.

That's just a brief run-down on his training. There are good things too and I am aware that I am making him sounds awful. I promise it's not true! If he would allow for the halt, I could utilize exercises like turns-on-he-forehand to get him laterally responsive and train a half-halt (or a better one at that.) Thanks, guys!

[floosha]

I will try using the wall in that manner. I usually ride outside and the fence is teeny tiny an I am not completely sure he wouldn't try to just jump it! I will go inside to try this. Thanks!

[eventingcpa]

A wall would be my first option. But you mention he is very good from the ground. Have you had your instructor and/or a ground person walk with you and halt him from the ground when you give the aid? Try having them lead you and you say verbally whoa and give your seat aids (or whatever voice command you use) to get him to halt and have the ground person ask at the same time or have the ground person ask for the whoa as long as you can time your aids to theirs. It may help him make the transition. Don't forget to make a big fuss over him when he gets it right. It takes a lot longer to over come these types of fears in horses. Good luck

[ippo]

Many TBs are super sensitive in the back which makes them very reactive to the rider's seat. It can be a blessing and a curse. It sounds like you may be using a driving seat to halt. The power of your seat may greatly over power the use of your reins. While the reins may ask for halt, your seat may be saying get going. A sensitive horse will answer the seat and ignore the reins. By flexing your abs to freeze the mobility of your spine and hips, you should be able to get the halt. It is important that you do not lean behind the vertical to give your arms strength for leverage as this will cause a driving seat. I doubt that your horse is ignoring you. It actually sounds like he is trying to please but there may be some miscommunication going on that can be resolved by your core.

[floosha]

Yes, the clinician worked with him on the ground while I was riding for both the halt and trying to get him to move laterally. We were over time, so he had to stop. He had a very hard time and even said he was surprised by how difficult it actually was because he went so beautifully the rest of the lesson (when we were working on other things). I will try to use my seat differently to ask for the halt and see if that works! I feel so awful that I might have ruined any trust he had developed by using my hands in a "harsher" manner.

[Winding Down]

I know this sounds silly, but how about giving him a treat when he halts? I keep sugar cubes in my pocket to encourage horses to stand after I've mounted. They expect a treat on the off side after I've mounted and its amazing how well they stand at the mounting block.

This could be temporary, of course. You certainly don't want to halt at X and have him swing his head around searching for your hand... ;-)

Silly and very simple....

Also, try bending him with a shoulder fore when doing downward transitions.

[merrygoround]

When asking for the halt, the seat stops, it doesn't push down it doesn't Tl forward, it just stops. The thighs close which stabilizes the seat, the lower leg stays on to bring the hind end up. The fingers close, and then softly open, not as a loose rein but quiet, and maybe a little vibrating. Since he understands " whoa", use it simultaneously.

If these aids are ignored the hands get very,very strong , for just long enough to get a halt, and then relax immediately, as the clinician suggested. Make sure your seat stays put, and that your core says "no go". Don't forget to pat and praise.

I find trot to halt easier than walk-halt.

As far as him losing trust. He will immediately regain it if you no longer find it necessary to prolong the halt, by trying to be nice. If he was used to a strong hand before, it may take a few times to get the message through.

Stay consistent. Don't give it one or two tries and give up. If he gets the halt, and threatens to get upset, pat, praise and trot on.

[meupatdoes]

Feed him a treat when he halts. Feed him another one if he stays there quietly for five seconds. And ten. And fifteen.


Make it a happy place.

If he is flying backwards with tension just putting more aids on and "making him do it" is not going to solve it.

[Jealoushe]

You said the horse is not responsive to half halt and does not go off your leg - this needs fixing asap. If you are riding with a trainer perhaps you should try a new one who might have some better ideas for you to help teach these things.

[merrygoround]

Having a half halt, being able to do transitions within the gait, are all a necessary part of riding and training.

But first you must have the halt. It treats work, use them.

[carolprudm]

I third or fourth treats.
Will your horse halt on the ground from a verbal cue? Try using that in the saddle.

FWIW super sensitive Sophie halts with no physical aids just a soft "MMMMM" I don't know if it's the sound or the slight tension in my abs. She was trained (not by me) that "GOOD!" meant stop and look for a treat

[Justmyluck]

You aren't riding him in a large arena and asking for halts on a straight line are you?

I'd take him to a round pen and ask on a small circle. Shapes slow down their momentum. Always ask in a corner or on a circle. Also halt means halt now and that needs to be established. With a person on the ground and a rider up. Ride halts said horse if its not immediate ground person steps up and halts the horse. Rider offers treat from the saddle, to associate treat with riding not ground work. Keep going until horse responds to riders cue first. Then ask in round pen always treat when he halts, progress to arena ask in the corners always rewarding. Then you can phase out the treats. Some times you give him one some times you don't.