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Gait question! (posted on te breeding forum too)

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  • Gait question! (posted on te breeding forum too)

    But since the rider wants to do dressage and I know a few folks here ride horses that have more than 3 gaits!

    Do young gaited horses can be confused with all those gaits? or is this young mare just lame?
    ~ Enjoying some guac and boxed wine at the Blue Saddle inn. ~

    Originally posted by LauraKY
    I'm sorry, but this has "eau de hoarder" smell all over it.
    HORSING mobile training app

  • #2
    Considering that many of these horses have been selectively bred for these gaits, it would be difficult for me to say that it is a lameness issue.

    I think it's a case of the horse doing what it was bred to do, vs an owner who wants the Walk, Trot and Canter of the more traditional breeds. Sorta like asking an eagle not to soar, but to flap his wings and dart like a swallow.
    Some riders change their horse, they change their saddle, they change their teacher; they never change themselves.

    Remember the horse does all the work, we just sit there and look pretty.

    Comment


    • #3
      I think it somewhat depends on the horse. I ride Saddlebreds, and some of them can be taught to rack and slow gait, but they don't generally do it unless under saddle. One horse I ride will default to a slow gait or a rack if you don't give a strong enough canter cue. He is not confused about his gaits, he will just take advantage of rider error.

      Comment


      • #4
        I have a RMH myself, and she will trot on a lunge/lounge/ longe line. Hardly ever under saddle. But I will go so far as to say that yes, its detrimental to the young horse to flounder along, mixing gaits, with no direction. If I ask my mare to gait off, and she picks up a trot we STOP and immediately start over. Im wondering if this newer rider is having trouble feeling what gait shes in, and asking for. If she wants to trot, I think its fine, albiet unusual. She needs to be very clear about TROT. In a young horse that hasnt really established gaits it seems like they drift along, in and out of a variety of gaits, and that just leads to clumsy, tripping horses. The gaitedness of these horses varies somewhat, so hard to say if the horse is just REALLY trotty in general- or what. A video would be helpful, and btw, there are a few really good youtube vids on gait to help nail what shes doing down. If shes not obviously lame other times, Im guessing she just has a mess of gaits and is head bobbing and/or hitching to get herself organized underneath herself.

        ETA: head bobbing usually isnt found in horses that dont have a running walk (TWH) but SOME Rockies do have an intermediate gait that is more like a run/walk than a slowgair/rack and would nod a little more...
        Last edited by Griffyn; Jun. 16, 2013, 04:33 PM. Reason: added something

        Comment


        • #5
          I posted this on the other forum also.

          Your young friend may have bought this horse without understanding the difference between gaited breeds and those we are more accustomed to seeing (WTC types). The RMH breed gait is a 4-beat lateral. What you're seeing is probably the mare doing a bit of what comes naturally or slopping down to a pace. If this young lady is interested in dressage (competing), she might be fairly limited, as I'm not sure how 'mainline' dressage judges would deal with a pace - and even less sure what they would do with the breed's natural gait.

          On the other hand, if she simply wants to learn and apply dressage principles for the betterment of her mare, and if the trainer can adapt for the mare's breed and not try to hammer her into the trainer's concept of a correct way of going, why not? Dressage, after all, is simply "training".

          Donning flame suit - shutting up now.

          Here's a link to an explanation: http://www.brightonridge.com/about_gaits.html
          www.ayliprod.com
          Equine Photography in the Northeast

          Comment


          • #6
            I don't understand the question.

            Does she want to do gaited dressage or traditional dressage?

            Comment

            • Original Poster

              #7
              She wants to do dressage. Not gaited.

              But the main problem is, no matter whatever discipline she wants to do, is WE (people at the barn) think that her mare is lame.

              The vet (which I wouldn't use for a lameness exam) told the owner it is because the mare is 'confused' with her gaits. And obviously, the owner believes the vet...

              I told her that if this was the case, being confused, than she should try to 'train' the gaits properly. The owner knows nothing about training any other gait than the traditionnal w/t/c and think it will go away?! or the horse will 'gait' properly on its own?! I don't know... I just suggested her to send a video of her mare to the breeder.

              My question is : WE don't know much about gaited horses (except of Standardbreds) so I was trying to gather information regarding what is considered as 'normal' in the development of a young Rocky Mountain or similar type of gaited horses.
              ~ Enjoying some guac and boxed wine at the Blue Saddle inn. ~

              Originally posted by LauraKY
              I'm sorry, but this has "eau de hoarder" smell all over it.
              HORSING mobile training app

              Comment

              • Original Poster

                #8
                Just read the replies on both thread and thank you all!

                WE don't want to hurt this young girl's feeling or tell her the wrong information but we just can't ignore the way her mare moving.

                She already had the vet over, as per our suggestion, but picked the wrong one!

                And she is not followed by any trainer. She wants to do it on her own... We have excellent trainers (hunter/jumper/dressage/eventing/reining) that come/could come to our barn but we know of none who deal with gaited horses.
                ~ Enjoying some guac and boxed wine at the Blue Saddle inn. ~

                Originally posted by LauraKY
                I'm sorry, but this has "eau de hoarder" smell all over it.
                HORSING mobile training app

                Comment


                • #9
                  .My question is : I was trying to gather information regarding what is considered as 'normal' in the development of a young Rocky Mountain or similar type of gaited horses.

                  What 'other' gaited horses do in their development would confuse the issue.
                  Rockies are supposed to be racky/saddle racky and offer a step pace type of gait- nothing like a running walk so let's talk Rockies.
                  -They should be pacey rather than trotty.
                  -Theforefore they are naturally lateral in their tendencies rather than diagonal.

                  If they get too smooshed into a small circle they are going to lose their lateral balance and offer all sorts of screwed up gaits. Circles on any gaited breed done faster than a dog walk you should be at least 20m in size, until and unless the horse is very well developed in their intermediate gaits and even then- you are careful and go pretty slowly in gait. Racking does not allow 'bend' in the ribs- it just doesn't- left legs are on rails, right legs are on rails. they may try to hop into a canter or attempt a trot or just hard pace to catch their balance- you cannot infer unsoundness in a gaited baby having trouble in side reins going to fast on a lunge line.

                  NORMAL? Lots of straight lines and gentle hill work and encouraging a gradually longer/bigger stride. circles are done at a normal walk. Rockies are naturally pretty well gaited- they just offer it if you aren't dinking with them. and not doing circles.

                  She was really dumb to pick a Rocky at try to teach it to trot. He's just not wired that way.

                  I do gaited dressage with a traditional dressage instructor.

                  Comment

                  • Original Poster

                    #10
                    Originally posted by katarine View Post
                    -They should be pacey rather than trotty.
                    -Theforefore they are naturally lateral in their tendencies rather than diagonal.
                    If they get too smooshed into a small circle they are going to lose their lateral balance and offer all sorts of screwed up gaits.
                    That is what she is doing and at the slowest motion she can get.

                    Racking does not allow 'bend' in the ribs- it just doesn't- left legs are on rails, right legs are on rails. they may try to hop into a canter or attempt a trot or just hard pace to catch their balance-
                    That is interesting and good to know.

                    you cannot infer unsoundness in a gaited baby having trouble in side reins going to fast on a lunge line.
                    Like I said, she is certainly NOT going too fast. She is going way too slow.
                    But then....I speak from a dressage/jumping point of view and from what you've stated before, she shouldn't even lunge the mare that way anyway!

                    NORMAL? Lots of straight lines and gentle hill work and encouraging a gradually longer/bigger stride. circles are done at a normal walk. Rockies are naturally pretty well gaited- they just offer it if you aren't dinking with them. and not doing circles.
                    I can recommend her that ; straight lines and gentle hill work.

                    But her 'normal' walk right now is mainly just lateral/pacing on the circle. So I will 'pressure' her to do huge circles/just go around the complete arena.

                    She was really dumb to pick a Rocky at try to teach it to trot. He's just not wired that way.
                    I do totally agree with you but what can you say to a 16yrs old who thinks she can do it all on her own? Unsolicited advices are rarely well perceived/received.

                    Her mare is a saint.

                    I do gaited dressage with a traditional dressage instructor.
                    I just read the level 3 NWHA gaited dressage test for reference.
                    There is obviously not trotting in there, all the different types of walk and canter.

                    Was your trainer familiar with those gaits before you started taking lessons with him/her? I don't know of any around here who would know about gaits, only some ex-racing Standardbred trainers but that has nothing to do with RMH...

                    ETA : I haven't find any Gaited dressage association in Canada...
                    ~ Enjoying some guac and boxed wine at the Blue Saddle inn. ~

                    Originally posted by LauraKY
                    I'm sorry, but this has "eau de hoarder" smell all over it.
                    HORSING mobile training app

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Yes...I got lucky

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        What is your role in all of this

                        Comment

                        • Original Poster

                          #13
                          Originally posted by katarine View Post
                          What is your role in all of this
                          We are at the small boarding place where everyone takes good care of their horses. We don't care much about what other people do as long as it is not dangerous or really wrong.

                          She's new here and it is now unfortunately getting more and more upsetting for everyone who has to ride with her.

                          The other boarders felt relieved when she said a vet would come see her mare but the result that vet gave (just being confused) was not well received by most of us... (It is not one of the vets we use, because we believe there are better lameness vet then this one...)

                          Anyway, I kinda calmed down everyone and said I would gather some more information about the breed before trying to talk to the young owner again. And I'm curious and want to understand what is going on!

                          I'm the one who rides with her the most.

                          It is quite frustrating to ride next to what I believe is a limping horse, on a regular basis and keep my mouth shut.

                          What can I say! I wish someone as knowledgeable as you lived closer...
                          ~ Enjoying some guac and boxed wine at the Blue Saddle inn. ~

                          Originally posted by LauraKY
                          I'm sorry, but this has "eau de hoarder" smell all over it.
                          HORSING mobile training app

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Well, that makes one of us

                            I don't see anything good coming from all of this - yall don't like her choice in vets, horses, training, or sport, and while I might be right there with you shaking my head if I saw it with my own eyes- she doesn't want help or she'd have hired help.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              All I CAN say is that any low level dressage trainer could help the horse learn how to seek the contact, to bend at a normal walk, to use themselves more gymnastically. Any of them that would be willing to try.

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