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Dressage Finals open to US citizens only

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  • Originally posted by paulaedwina View Post
    Of course it's not as easy and as cheap as those whose experience of the immigration process is from internet research think. No need to even respond. Those of us in the know simply smiled and thought, "well bless your heart."

    Paula
    It should NOT be EASY or CHEAP to become a US Citizen!
    We do not have an overpopulation of dogs, we have an under population of responsible dog owners!!!

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    • Originally posted by Arizona DQ View Post
      It should NOT be EASY or CHEAP to become a US Citizen!
      Why?

      I got it easy and cheap just by being born here.

      Is there some additional yearly certification rigamarole you propose?

      I would actually not be opposed to mandatory civil service or whatever else on an ongoing basis. i.e. every year you have to spend X amount of time or whatever. Any other ongoing requirements you think to not make citizenship here easy or cheap?
      The Noodlehttp://tiny.cc/NGKmT&http://tiny.cc/gioSA
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      • Originally posted by meupatdoes View Post

        And, to cite a random country, I would be perfectly happy to represent Tahiti in the Olympics. I don't want to give up my US citizenship, but if for some reason Tahiti takes enough interest in my riding skills to let me go to bat for them, I'm happy to oblige. It is a sports competition, not war.
        You'd actually be representing FRANCE, then

        I'm a permanent resident, and I don't have an issue with a National Championship being open only to citizens. I really don't see what the big deal is.
        Ottbs - The finish line is only the beginning!

        Comment


        • Originally posted by paulaedwina View Post
          Of course it's not as easy and as cheap as those whose experience of the immigration process is from internet research think. No need to even respond. Those of us in the know simply smiled and thought, "well bless your heart."

          Paula
          You talk out of your rectum.

          I did it.
          In fact it only cost me, at that time, $200 plus fingerprints.
          ... _. ._ .._. .._

          Comment


          • At the time!


            Here's what my rectum says; the citizenship application alone is about $600. It USED to be about $200, but times they are achangin'. Getting to that point where you're eligible to apply for citizenship takes YEARS and DOLLARS. I started working for NCI as an H1, went through a couple of those, and one J visa before I got my green card. Let's not talk about the lawyer fees that went along with that. And the stress. I have GERD from dealing with immigration. I understand why people might choose to sneak in!

            ArizonaDQ, it is neither easy nor cheap to become a citizen.

            From other people's rectums:

            How much does it cost to file an application for citizenship?

            It costs $680* to file an application for citizenship: $595* application fee and $85* fingerprinting fee. Please see the USCIS Immigration Forms website for the latest fee information

            http://www.cuny.edu/about/resources/...s/citizen.html


            Paula
            He is total garbage! Quick! Hide him on my trailer (Petstorejunkie).

            Comment


            • Oh please, just at least try to follow along.
              ... _. ._ .._. .._

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Equibrit View Post
                Oh please, just at least try to follow along.
                I'm missing something here. I specifically was referring to,

                You talk out of your rectum.

                I did it.
                In fact it only cost me, at that time, $200 plus fingerprints.



                I'm I missing humor again? It's been known to happen.

                Paula
                He is total garbage! Quick! Hide him on my trailer (Petstorejunkie).

                Comment

                • Original Poster

                  Oh my, this topic has got a little heated! Some excellent points have been made though...

                  Originally posted by Janet View Post
                  In Eventing, non citizens can compete, but the Championship goes to the highest place US citizen. One year it was at Over the Walls and my sister (not a US citizen) won, but the big trophy went to the second place rider, who was a US citizen.
                  Surely this would be a way to keep everyone happy? I do think it would be strange for a non-us citizen to win a US national championship. That said, I believe all members of the USDF should be treated equally. So I was torn on the issue and that is why I wanted others input. I would love to still compete and 'win' the class, but would be perfectly fine if they bestowed the championship title on the 2nd place us citizen. Also, it would be a boost to my horses resume to have competed at finals.

                  Originally posted by Discobold View Post
                  I agree. And, not to be rude, but how many of those complaining are really going to be personally affected by this rule? This is only for the Finals.
                  I hate to even bring this awful statement up. This is absolutely rude. My horse and I are having a good season, we plan on going to regionals. Will we win? Maybe not. But we are working our tails off and we will do our best. EVERYONE should have the thought that this rule COULD affect them and I hate that someone is trying to rain on everyone’s parade. If you work hard enough, it WILL happen… eventually!

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by paulaedwina View Post
                    At the time!I started working for NCI as an H1, went through a couple of those, and one J visa before I got my green card. Let's not talk about the lawyer fees that went along with that. And the stress. I have GERD from dealing with immigration. I understand why people might choose to sneak in!
                    I completely understand! I grew up in an H1-B family and it is so insanely stressful. I remember sitting outside the INS office at 5am when I was 11 so my parents could do their permanent residency interviews, which were quite invasive. My mom cried so many times from the stress of the whole process. Citizenship is expensive and if you travel extensively the in-country requirement can be hard to meet and it can generally be a hassle, especially if you live far from a processing centre. But the citizenship process is often a dream compared to the hell of getting permanent residency for so many people, at least if you have a straightforward application.

                    I definitely think becoming a citizen should be cheap. There is no reason to bar access on economic grounds.

                    Comment


                    • It took the company that brought me over here almost two years to get my Labor Certification, proving to the labor board that they needed me due to special skills. They had to advertise my position and interview every applicant, then show why no one met the criteria.

                      Then it took two years just waiting to be assigned a date for a final interview, at which point I had to fly to London (my home embassy) and undergo a full medical, complete with blood tests and chest x-ray, and an hour-long interview. I paid almost $200, then flew back to the US. And that was just for my green card.

                      What people forget is that it isn't just the cost of the citizenship, but the cost and time of the residency that precedes it. And keep in mind, this was AFTER a US company had proved to the Dept of Labor that they needed to hire me. It cost them four years of immigration lawyer fees as well.

                      All this was for a special skills category. I can't imagine how difficult it must be for a regular applicant.

                      For my US citizenship, I have to document every single time I've been in and out of the country since obtaining my residency, where I went on every visit, who I visited, what the purpose was, etc. Just the research alone would take weeks, which is why I haven't bothered to apply.

                      Comment


                      • And let's not forget that when you first come to the US... You aren't allowed to work here! So no income, lots of fees, medicals, etc. to pay for, plus cost of living while waiting for USCIS to make their decision... My savings are pretty much drained by now

                        Anyways, by the time I can afford to show enough to even make it to Finals, I will probably be a citizen anyways

                        Comment


                        • Op, i was reading equine canada rulebooks and they dont mention anything of non citizens not being able to do national champs,

                          They did stress about citizenship for judges and stewards!

                          Meh the only citizen issue we got is the whole stupid riff qubec started itself between provinces, but thats a whole nother issue! It still spills out into the sport
                          Beyond the Ring-para dressage, training, coaching
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                          • Originally posted by carolprudm View Post
                            Is dual citizenship an option? My mother was born in the US of native Swiss parents. She had the option of dual citizenship. Had she taken the option I would have in turn had the same option.

                            ETA:When my grandparents arrived here they became Americans. While they loved their homeland and went back when they could they were now in their minds Americans. They learned english, Schweizerdeutsch was spoken only when they didn't want the children to understand.
                            Some countries allow dual citizenship; US is not one of them. When I discussed this issue with my immigration lawyer, she basically told me, "no, US will not come and chase you down to make you surrender your old passport, but US does NOT recognize dual citizenship." She repeated this sentence with a stone face. This is kind of a gray area.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Libera View Post
                              And let's not forget that when you first come to the US... You aren't allowed to work here! So no income, lots of fees, medicals, etc. to pay for, plus cost of living while waiting for USCIS to make their decision... My savings are pretty much drained by now
                              I don't understand this. If you are here on student visa or tourist visa, you are supposed to be here as a student or tourist. Of course you should not be allowed to work. Why should you?


                              Originally posted by SBrentnall View Post
                              For my US citizenship, I have to document every single time I've been in and out of the country since obtaining my residency, where I went on every visit, who I visited, what the purpose was, etc. Just the research alone would take weeks, which is why I haven't bothered to apply.
                              Once you become a citizen, they can not deport you. That is why the citizenship process is so.... well, I don't know the word.... Funny enough though, both my interviews (permanent resident and citizenship) went rather nicely. They didn't ask me any invasive questions. The officers were quite pleasant. We joked a bit; they asked a bit question like why I was there; where I got my graduate degree (they were Sooner fans); where I worked; whether i liked my job; etc. And that is it.

                              Now the time when I tried to renew my working VISA? Yike. There were a couple of errors on my working VISA, the VISA I waited for three months to get... What are the errors? The first one was the year of my birth: year 1917, which would have put me close to 97 years old at the time; and the second, sex: male.

                              I called, and after three hours of solidly on hold listening to boring music, I finally talked to some woman. I explained the situation (the age and the sex were wrong).

                              She asked, "how do you know the sex is wrong?"

                              I was so shocked to be asked this question that I believe I was silent for a solid ten seconds. Eventually I regained some kind of wit and told her, "I'm looking at the mirror, and I'm certain I'm a female and not a male." She did not want to believe me.
                              Last edited by Gloria; Apr. 26, 2013, 11:44 AM.

                              Comment


                              • Not being able to work is tough. I went to school here in the states so my dad was paying my tuition which is out of state and foreign exchange. So it helped that I could work as a library page for 20 hours a week. I was able to work on my student visa, but it had to be for the school and it couldn't be for more than 20 hours.

                                Paula
                                He is total garbage! Quick! Hide him on my trailer (Petstorejunkie).

                                Comment


                                • Originally posted by SBrentnall View Post
                                  For my US citizenship, I have to document every single time I've been in and out of the country since obtaining my residency, where I went on every visit, who I visited, what the purpose was, etc. Just the research alone would take weeks, which is why I haven't bothered to apply.
                                  To get/maintain a US security clearance, I have to provide the government the same information every 5 years. It's not a big deal. The gov should verify who you are, what you do, who you know before putting down the welcome mat.
                                  Visit my Spoonflower shop

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                                  • I don't think she is saying they ought not do it, she's saying it's too much of a hassle to make the leap from PR to citizen?

                                    Paula
                                    He is total garbage! Quick! Hide him on my trailer (Petstorejunkie).

                                    Comment


                                    • Originally posted by paulaedwina View Post
                                      I don't think she is saying they ought not do it, she's saying it's too much of a hassle to make the leap from PR to citizen?

                                      Paula
                                      I read it as it was too much of a hassle to document her time in and out of this country to bother with attaining citizenship. Why should it be streamlined? The answers are not necessarily less relevant because someone has been a PR for 5 years vs 10 years. A number of overseas trips would be more of interest than a single vacation to the Bahamas.
                                      Visit my Spoonflower shop

                                      Comment


                                      • Originally posted by Gloria View Post
                                        Some countries allow dual citizenship; US is not one of them. When I discussed this issue with my immigration lawyer, she basically told me, "no, US will not come and chase you down to make you surrender your old passport, but US does NOT recognize dual citizenship." She repeated this sentence with a stone face. This is kind of a gray area.
                                        It doesn't recognize it in that it treats you only as a US citizen and there's no special status, but it does allow it - it's not against the rules or anything. There would be no basis on which to require someone to give up foreign citizenship. Except, I think, if you're running for president? I have dual citizenship, soon to be triple. Meanwhile, my country of origin used to make you relinquish other citizenships, which is why I waited so long to become a US citizen - I would have had to give up my original citizenship based on that country's rules, which would have really limited my future options. I only naturalized in the US when that law changed.

                                        Whether or not you can work depends on your original status. If you're here as H1-B you can work, but your family members cannot unless they have a basis for work permission separate from your H1-B status. Many types of visas (tourists, students, journalists, other temporary work H visas, etc.) do not allow dual intent, which is to say that they will not let you in if they think you wish to gain permanent residency and you cannot apply for it simultaneously. Only things like H1-B, K visas, E visas, etc. allow dual intent.

                                        In my experience this is why so many H1-B families end up leaving even if their original intent was to stay. The process is just too much (especially if you switch processing centres!), it can feel so unstable to not know if it has a permanent home, spouses (overwhelmingly women) have no financial independence or the satisfaction of a career, your kids can't even get summer jobs. I grew up around so many brilliant women who had had thriving careers and suddenly they're sitting at home with nothing to do for years on end, waiting for green cards.

                                        Comment


                                        • For me personally, the only stress in getting a green card was having to sit still for my photograph.

                                          On the other hand, they would not complete my father's application (to which I was attached) until they got a letter from the Chief of Police in Cairo Egypt to say that, between the time he was born there and the time he left (about age 3) he had not acquired a criminal record. It finally arrived a few days before we were scheduled to move.

                                          But I do not understand all the discussion of living here BEFORE getting a green card. In those days, you HAD TO BE living outside the US to apply for a green card. Is this no longer true?

                                          We certainly never lived in the US (only visited as tourists) before we got our green cards.
                                          Janet

                                          chief feeder and mucker for Music, Spy, Belle and Tiara. Someone else is now feeding and mucking for Chief and Brain (both foxhunting now).

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