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  • Hands?

    Just watching this awesome horse and it was hard for me to NOT watch the rider's hands. So busy, and looks at times to be pulling on the horses mouth.

    Coming from a saddle seat background, it is very difficult for me to watch constant hand movement. In my world a pinky wiggle on the curb or simply raising or dropping hands is all that's needed. The colt I'll be showing this year I have to be careful to stay out of his mouth because he's so light and responsive to the tiniest cue. Granted, I am not asking my horses for canter pirouettes and such.


  • #2
    Half halts. It's a dressage thing. Granted the aim in dressage is to make all aids invisible. But in a show atmosphere, sometimes one needs to be a little more emphatic.
    "Against stupidity the gods themselves contend in vain" ~Friedrich Schiller


    • #3
      I love that her curb rein has a bit of a loop in it. I hope my hands can be that "bad" someday.


      • #4
        Originally posted by shakeytails View Post
        Granted, I am not asking my horses for canter pirouettes and such.
        You're probably not asking for transitions within the gaits, either, or for movements at exact spots, or for major collection. Half-halts are part of dressage. Sometimes they require more hand, sometimes they don't.
        Donald Trump - proven liar, cheat, traitor and sexual predator! Hillary Clinton won in 2016, but we have all lost.


        • #5
          They do move a lot don't they?

          For comparison why not post the junior league eq championships http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YibYhcmK3S0 .

          The eq championship consists of a rail portion and then a pattern. This is 2010 and it is timing me out, or I would try to list the pattern.

          I have some theories but my dressage experience was long ago and not extensive.
          Courageous Weenie Eventer Wannabe
          Incredible Invisible


          • #6
            You cannot compare the two. They are apples and, I don't know, dishwashers.
            Donald Trump - proven liar, cheat, traitor and sexual predator! Hillary Clinton won in 2016, but we have all lost.


            • #7
              Originally posted by SaddleFitterVA View Post
              I love that her curb rein has a bit of a loop in it. I hope my hands can be that "bad" someday.
              Me too!


              • #8
                Honestly I saw just as much hand movement in the eq class as with Damon Hill, although in the eq class it was more up and down. I hardly think you can say any of the riders were being harsh, but that JMO.


                • #9
                  At saddle seat, you get a curb shank that is about a mile long, a bit that is probably twisted wire or even bicycle chain, and you don't ask the horse to do anything other than walk, trot, and canter, change direction, and repeat.


                  • #10
                    You may as well compare roping riders to dressage. Those are some seriously long shanks on the Weymouths, the curb reins all seem quite tight, there is nowhere near the precision required in that pattern.

                    I also don't want hands like any of those riders. Wrong discipline, wrong position, and if most of them moved their hands down, it looks like the would be very hard, non-following hands.


                    • Original Poster

                      Originally posted by SaddleFitterVA View Post
                      I love that her curb rein has a bit of a loop in it. I hope my hands can be that "bad" someday.
                      Hey, I never said her hands were "bad"! I just like to think of upper level dressage as more fine tuned with fewer visible signals to give the appearance of effortless communication between horse and rider.

                      I know I couldn't ride that animal anywhere close to properly- I'd push the wrong button and be sitting on the ground wondering WTF just happened, LOL!


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by SillyHorse View Post
                        You cannot compare the two. They are apples and, I don't know, dishwashers.
                        Eh ... the clothes look a little similar.

                        Originally posted by Gloria View Post
                        At saddle seat, you get a curb shank that is about a mile long, and you don't ask the horse to do anything other than walk, trot, and canter, change direction, and repeat.
                        Also, you're not penalized for jigging at the walk or turning your horse's nose to the rail and jigging sideways to get a walk/canter transition.

                        Please note: I am NOT dissing saddleseat in general, nor the young riders in the video in particular. Dressage is just a whole 'nother ballgame. The hands are going to look different because it's a different discipline with different equipment, different standards, etc etc etc.

                        Said Captain Obvious.
                        "... if you think i'm MAD, today, of all days,
                        the best day in ten years,
                        you are SORELY MISTAKEN, MY LITTLE ANCHOVY."


                        • #13
                          In dressage, a still hand can be a restrictive hand. We strive to follow (and in some instances) not follow. The goal is a hand (or elbow) that is elastic


                          • #14
                            The other thing you probably are not factoring in is there is some *serious* movment to that dressage horse. You really need to compare the hands to the neck and saddle and then decide if there really is much movement in them.

                            Same reason that judges have to look at hocks or elbows if the socks are uneven on a horse to mitigate the fact that the socks *can* make them look a little bit off.


                            • #15
                              I love her hands. I want to be as precise with my half-halts, as judicious with my curb rein and as kind to my horse with all of my aids as she is to her horse.

                              I never will be, but I can always dream...


                              • #16
                                Yes her hands do appear to be active, but look at what her horse is doing! There is a whole lot happening in that arena, it has to happen on the mark, and the count, within the rhythm of the music. And that boy is jumping up! Add to that some horses like to know sometimes that you are there. She is riding on the snaffle.
                                Some riders change their horse, they change their saddle, they change their teacher; they never change themselves.

                                Remember the horse does all the work, we just sit there and look pretty.


                                • #17
                                  that video makes me so happy! i love damon hill and i love that he is classically trained and ridden - and it shows.

                                  yes, her hands looked a bit backwards feeling, but who cares? that was one heck of a ride!


                                  • #18
                                    I think a little bit of the reason it appears her hands are moving so much is because all the joints of the riders body are moving quite a lot...because the horse is probably quite bouncy to sit. When the rider's hands 'bounce' in exact sync with the horse's gaits it generally does not interrupt the horse's way of going. Unless the rider truly has 'bad' hands. Does the horse look disturbed?
                                    Horses don't lie.


                                    • #19
                                      Also, if you watch carefully, there is a lot of give, give, and give in Langehanenberg's hands to encourage the horse to reach out more. The backward feeling some may see is the result of returning to neutral after the giving, and she is giving the horse every chance to be freerer, and the result is quite obvious. That horse would not have moved so brilliantly if that rider were not so generous with her hands. That is completely different from "pulling on the horses' mouth" that is commonly seen in a lot of saddle seat riding even at top levels, where the riders' hands appear to be still, while in reality choking the horses to death. Remember, the horse is moving, so if you hands appear to be "non moving', you are moving against the horse.


                                      • #20
                                        I cannot believe that anyone here is critiquing Helen Langehanenburg's use of the hand in her ride. Really?
                                        How many international quality FEI horses have you ridden?
                                        I would love to be able to ride even a little bit like she does. Sheesh! You guys are harsh!