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Pricing question

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  • Original Poster

    #21
    [QUOTE]
    Originally posted by CHT View Post
    How badly did horse flex? Does the horse show any secondary lameness issues such as back soreness?
    The horse flexed 2 -3. The horse then had joint injections and 2 weeks after the injections flexed negative

    Stifles would worry me as a buyer more than the hocks, but at the same time it is hard to just flex the stifles, so is the vet sure the stifles were positive, or is it that the hocks/stifles were flexed at the same time, and one of the two (or both) showed positive flexions?
    Interesting, 2 years ago, I took my horses to Tufts. This horse flexed positive in what they thought was R stiffle, they then blocked the stiffle and the horse was sound. This time there were no blocks, but when he flexed the say RIGHT stiffle, he would be on the LEFT side of the horse flexing the joint up and lateral

    But...if someone vetted the horse now, it would pass right? I guess as a buyer, I would appreciate your honesty. At the same time I would want to know that the injections do last for more than a couple weeks. If the horse stays happy/sound, with no secondary soreness, I would not expect the price to be dropped based on this.
    Yes he would pass now. And his Xrays were good. I have his complete vet record and relatively speaking he is cleaner than the vets anticipate for a PSG horse in there early teens

    Comment


    • #22
      Perfect Pony...while I agree it would terrify me to spend that much on a horse. I bought my FEI schoolmaster at age 15 with no PPE (sellers requirment). He had a few suspensory issues over the years...very minimal maintance needs...and refuses to retire at 22!
      Whispered Wish Weser-Ems: Breeding quality German Riding Ponies!
      Standing the stallion Burberry
      www.germanridingpony.com
      www.facebook.com/HighlifesBurberry

      Comment


      • #23
        Originally posted by Justice~for~Horses View Post
        When is the last time you had flexions and xrays done on your horses, Chisamba? Did they all flex negative? How about the rest of you?
        My thoughts, exactly. I don't know how many times I've seen people riding around on their "100% sound, needs no maintenance" horse......and observed an obvious gait irregularity. There are very, very few horses who can do FEI level work....real FEI level work....with power, bounce, crossing and expression....who don't need a little help to keep their well-used bodies and joints comfortable. Now, 1/2-assed dressage with little piddly staccato gaits isn't as wearing and the horses probably last longer.
        I have been seriously bouncing this around in my head for the last year or so. Wondering when dressage, yes even well-ridden and sympathetic dressage, becomes unfair for the horse. We ask so much of them and their bodies do show the wear and tear. I do think really good riders can "ride the horse to soundness" to some degree and really ineffective riders don't get the horse engaged enough to really work. It's the majority of riders who may push the horse enough to do pretty good dressage but don't have the horse perfect enough in body to avoid injury...... This thought goes nowhere because I have no answer other than to have my horse flexed every 3-6 months and have any abiding issues treated. She deserves that, as she works hard. All FEI horses deserve that.

        Comment


        • #24
          I would buy him if I could, and I think your price is reasonable. PPE's aren't "pass-fail," and it's unrealistic to expect a horse at that level and age not to need maintenance. Fwiw, when I was looking a few years ago and passed up a teen-age "schoolmaster," it wasn't the up-front cost (or the cost of maintenance) that gave me pause, but the prospect of dealing with a horse I might not be able to ride in a few years (because I already had one retiree - otherwise I would have done it).

          Comment


          • #25
            Yep. I'd buy the horse too. I think injections every 1-2 years is actually very little maintenance for an FEI horse. I would not lower the price.

            Comment


            • #26
              I think there are many sellers who would have just done the injections to create a horse that passed and not said a word about it.

              And to be honest, I would be suprised if someone was shocked/upset or in any way turned off by a PSG horse who needs some fairly standard sounding help.
              Freeing worms from cans everywhere!

              Comment


              • #27
                pricing

                I know of a PSG mare, 17 year old Lipizzan, whom I beieve is sound, for $12,000. Why pay 50k? Lips live a long time and are known for soundness.
                http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BHTSd...layer_embedded
                SEYCHELLINA
                Sire: SIGALVY SAGANA II S012-28
                Dam: ANGELINA M0424-84
                Breed: LIPPZZAN
                Breeder: SUE LOCKE
                http://TouchstoneAcres.com
                Touchstone Acres Lipizzans, Standing N. Samira VI (Gray), N. XXIX-18(Black), more in 2014

                Comment


                • #28
                  One class at PSG does not a PSG horse make.

                  Looked up the scores for Seychellina, and she lacks recent scores, only has one score for PSG, and hasn't exactly got the best track record score wise (40s and 50s and 4rth?). Even the video you posted is old.

                  Not that we know what the OP's horse has done, but I would not value a confirmed consistent PSG horse based on comparing to the mare shown in that video.
                  Freeing worms from cans everywhere!

                  Comment


                  • #29
                    The mare in the video is not a good mover. She has high knee action, her shoulders are not as free as they should be, and she is sitting not very much at all. She barely moves under herself at the trot. This is not a PSG horse.
                    Banter whenever you want to banter....canter whenever you want to canter.

                    Comment


                    • #30
                      Originally posted by CHT View Post
                      One class at PSG does not a PSG horse make.

                      Looked up the scores for Seychellina, and she lacks recent scores, only has one score for PSG, and hasn't exactly got the best track record score wise (40s and 50s and 4rth?). Even the video you posted is old.

                      Not that we know what the OP's horse has done, but I would not value a confirmed consistent PSG horse based on comparing to the mare shown in that video.
                      Ditto that -

                      Mike Pineo - um yeah.

                      Comment

                      • Original Poster

                        #31
                        Originally posted by CHT View Post
                        I think there are many sellers who would have just done the injections to create a horse that passed and not said a word about it.

                        And to be honest, I would be suprised if someone was shocked/upset or in any way turned off by a PSG horse who needs some fairly standard sounding help.
                        Thanks for that. I am an amateur and I really love this horse, but I don't have the time for him and he is too young and talented to retire and I am not wealthy. So....my biggest objective is to find him a loving home where he can be useful.

                        it would be very easy to not disclose the vet reports and a new vet coming in to do a PPE would have no clues. Esp. as the xrays are clean.

                        Comment


                        • #32
                          Originally posted by dudleyc View Post
                          I don't have the time for him and he is too young and talented to retire and I am not wealthy. So....my biggest objective is to find him a loving home where he can be useful.
                          As evidenced by the 60 to 80 Thousand dollar price tag. Sorry, couldn't help myself....
                          On the Internet, nobody knows you're a dog

                          Comment


                          • #33
                            Originally posted by dudleyc View Post
                            Horse for sale in 60k - 80k range. Confirmed PSG gelding, early teens, very very safe. Sells with complete vet records.

                            Horse had problems with vetting. Clean xrays but positive flexions on both hocks and both stiffles. Horse had joint injections and now 2 weeks latter flexes clean. (2 years prior, horse had Right stiffle and both front cannon joints injected - no other history of sports medicine issues). Horse has had no routine maintenance

                            Vet recommends evaluations every 6 months, possible injections every 6 months and monthly polyglycan or legend injections. To be fair, vet thinks this is a horse that is sounder than expected.

                            So now that the horse will need some maintenance, how much should the asking price change?
                            are you as a good rider as the horse your intending buying with questions like you have asked on other threads i think not


                            so it would be a waste of time buying a horse that has far more knowledge than you do and one that no doubt you would be over horsed with

                            people like yourselves often think if i buy a horse like this i can win xyz
                            but unfortunately you a---- have to keep that horse as a competition horse and what hes/she acustomed to- and ride it over bigger tracks or bigger competitions of which if one isnt and doesnt understand the basics then one isnt going to get far and for the horse is question it would be an ill match and the horse would be later deemed as a git when in truth ---------- hes a competition horse with a novice on his back that hasnt a clue

                            so horse is sold of as cheap ------- beleive e i know as i re- school and re trina horses all my life and i have common little things to really expensive joblets and got them all back to where they should be in decents homes and doing the jobs that they were intented for

                            so price doesnt come in to really its down to how much knowledge you have to offered a horse a home at the level you are at - and or a horse that has the knowledge to take you a little farther then you was with his own knowledge

                            and any horse that has problems with his flexions is a horse that going to have health problems all his life a horse that has hock injections says it all here in uk we dont do hock injection willy nilly

                            they only done on medical grounds - and thats says a lot so a horse thats selling for that kind of money------ isnt worth it as it will be off work more than its in work - and agin you will get frustrated not being able to ride and go forwards as the hrose works back to front then his engine is in his rear for jumping he need its for lift off, for dressage he needs to show his power in his movements from back to to front to elevate himself .flex and extent
                            for racing he needs that engine to frust that power forward to come somewhere for driving he needs it to help pull forwards

                            so hocks and legs are very important with out them he cant do the things we as humans want him to do

                            Comment

                            • Original Poster

                              #34
                              Originally posted by goeslikestink View Post
                              are you as a good rider as the horse your intending buying with questions like you have asked on other threads i think not


                              so it would be a waste of time buying a horse that has far more knowledge than you do and one that no doubt you would be over horsed with

                              people like yourselves often think if i buy a horse like this i can win xyz
                              but unfortunately you a---- have to keep that horse as a competition horse and what hes/she acustomed to- and ride it over bigger tracks or bigger competitions of which if one isnt and doesnt understand the basics then one isnt going to get far and for the horse is question it would be an ill match and the horse would be later deemed as a git when in truth ---------- hes a competition horse with a novice on his back that hasnt a clue

                              so horse is sold of as cheap ------- beleive e i know as i re- school and re trina horses all my life and i have common little things to really expensive joblets and got them all back to where they should be in decents homes and doing the jobs that they were intented for

                              so price doesnt come in to really its down to how much knowledge you have to offered a horse a home at the level you are at - and or a horse that has the knowledge to take you a little farther then you was with his own knowledge

                              and any horse that has problems with his flexions is a horse that going to have health problems all his life a horse that has hock injections says it all here in uk we dont do hock injection willy nilly

                              they only done on medical grounds - and thats says a lot so a horse thats selling for that kind of money------ isnt worth it as it will be off work more than its in work - and agin you will get frustrated not being able to ride and go forwards as the hrose works back to front then his engine is in his rear for jumping he need its for lift off, for dressage he needs to show his power in his movements from back to to front to elevate himself .flex and extent
                              for racing he needs that engine to frust that power forward to come somewhere for driving he needs it to help pull forwards

                              so hocks and legs are very important with out them he cant do the things we as humans want him to do
                              ????

                              Comment


                              • #35
                                oh you own him and hes got problems

                                then yo need to find him a home and drop your price ----as hes high maintenance for the average joe bloggs

                                her he wouldnt sell for much at all 1200 quid with those problems

                                Comment


                                • #36
                                  I agree with the ???
                                  Freeing worms from cans everywhere!

                                  Comment


                                  • #37
                                    Originally posted by goeslikestink View Post
                                    oh you own him and hes got problems

                                    then yo need to find him a home and drop your price ----as hes high maintenance for the average joe bloggs

                                    her he wouldnt sell for much at all 1200 quid with those problems
                                    Um...occasional injections =/= high maintenance. I don't believe for one second that you've ever ridden, let alone retrained any kind of upper level horse.

                                    Comment


                                    • #38
                                      Hahaha

                                      Comment


                                      • #39
                                        confirmed how? regional level? CDI? what?
                                        most horses I'm seeing from 11-13yrs WITH declared maintenance, and recognized scores (but not a record as a young rider winner, etc) are going nationally around $35-40k
                                        www.destinationconsensusequus.com
                                        chaque pas est fait ensemble

                                        Comment

                                        • Original Poster

                                          #40
                                          Originally posted by Petstorejunkie View Post
                                          confirmed how? regional level? CDI? what?
                                          most horses I'm seeing from 11-13yrs WITH declared maintenance, and recognized scores (but not a record as a young rider winner, etc) are going nationally around $35-40k
                                          Thats helpful. I set the price with advice from 2 BNT - although BNT's that do NOT SELL horses. I think his initial asking price was too high.

                                          He is a horse that is safe, 3 very good gaits and can do all of the movements well and easily, but he is a regional horse - a very good schoolmaster. I have already turned away inquiries from people looking for something National / CDI or to go on to the GP.

                                          Comment

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