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Can't Turn Right

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  • #61
    Originally posted by angel View Post
    First of all, you do not use your legs per se. What should be happening is that your stirrups need to be correctly weighted for the movement at hand. ... This also means that your upper torso is being pulled forward, and your seatbones are coming off the saddle. These things definitely negate any attempt for correct weight aids.
    BINGO. If you are leaning your weight into the outside (left) stirrup, you're telling her to go left. You're probably collapsing your hips and weighting your outside stirrup.


    • Original Poster

      Wait, hold up.

      Weight in inside stirrup, but inside hip forward?


      • #63
        LOL....Arab Mare...canter around the room to the right with your left hip leading...you will then be in counter canter. Seriously...canter around the room yourself...see which hip leads in either direction. lol


        • #64
          Oh lordy dont weight either stirrup. Sit on both seatbones evenly. This is the basics, peeps. She needs to find her rear end and her outside before she gets into subtle sophistications like weight aids!
          "Kindness is free" ~ Eurofoal
          The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances.


          • #65
            I should add... Inside seatbone forward, outside seatbone back is on the longitudinal plane (back to front) .. Not the lateral plane (side to side) and NEITHER involves putting more weight in one seatbone than the other..

            A little reminder, that LMEqT has never been told any of this and she pushes her pony over off her outside flawlessly. If she uses an inside rein it is a guiding rein. If no ne ever makes it more complicated than it has to be, it never WILL be complicated
            "Kindness is free" ~ Eurofoal
            The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances.


            • Original Poster

              Okay, going riding this morning. We'll see what works out.


              • #67
                Originally posted by AzuWish View Post
                Why not learn how to ride the horse as she is turning right, and then add your aides?

                If you have a friend to help you, out her on a lunge line right and hop on. Don't do anything except follow the horse.

                If you don't have a friend to help you, try a round pen. Use a whip and voice for transitions, no legs or seat or reins. Just follow the horse.

                I used that method for the left lead on my horse. Once I learned how to ride it, I could start adding aides. Then I could start asking outside the round pen.
                Just wanted to reiterate my post. Sometimes the simplest solution works best. Learn to follow horse right, then learn to ride horse right.


                • #68
                  Spectrum: When you are riding canter in a clockwise direction on a horse that is hollow right, you need more weight in your outside (left) stirrup. Here is another way in which to think of this. Riding the horse is as if you are sitting on a barrel which is in the water. You want to stay balanced on that barrel, or you are going to find yourself swimming. If the barrel is rolling to your right, what do you need to do with your weight to keep the barrel from dumping your off the right-hand side? You must get more weight back on the left side of the barrel in order not to loose your seat. The barrel of a hollow right horse is rotating toward the right-hand side....always. So too, do most people rotate....right-handedness.

                  The problem has to do with the left hip of the horse. It wants to stay rotated from the hipsocket more toward the left. It also tends to want to stay in a higher position. When we do lateral movements, it is to better help the horse learn to rotate the joints equally either direction. A spur can assist with this, i.e. the encouragement to rotate that joint in the opposite direction. The whip is to encourage the horse to step under more deeply.

                  I am not saying that a rider should ride with spurs, because a rider must be very in control of her body, and be able to feel correctly what the horse's body is doing. This is also true of the use of the whip. The whip and the spur are not used within the same timing either, because they are only being used as a hind leg leaves the ground, and must only be used for the purpose mentioned.

                  Now when you ride that hollow right horse in a counterclockwise direction, things feel pretty good because the motion itself is helping to counteract the incorrect body position. But, the torso is still wrong. The rider still has too much weight on the right-hand side, and needs to get the horse's torso rolled back toward the left a bit for balance.

                  So do you take the canter, or aid the canter from the inside or the outside. Most horses do learn to take the canter from the outside, but unless the rider learns how to feel the incorrect balance, and starts the canter correctly to fix that balance, later movements will become difficult. A simple trot to canter transition works just fine from the outside leg. However, once we get to Second Level, and need our simple change, i.e. canter/walk/canter, there will be a problem because the rider is not aiding the horse correctly to keep the canter in balance. With the hollow right horse, the left lead canter really needs to come from the rider's inside groin area, not the outside leg. With the hollow right horse, the right lead canter needs to come from the outside leg/spur. Every step you ride must be with the thoughts on how you and the horse are crooked, and what this means for applying your aids.


                  • Original Poster

                    I'm not worried about the canter really. I'm worried about the trot.


                    • #70
                      Same problem, all gaits, all movements. Everything hinges on how well the rider can feel the crookedness and correctly fix the problem. Horse is still like riding a barrel on the water...too much on one side, both horse and rider begin to lose balance and fall sideways toward the side where there is too much weight being taken without enough underpining to support it. Right hind must be kept under better, or there is too much tension on the left hind muscles to allow proper rotation. Both effect how the diagonal front legs move...whether a shoulder is lifted and extended by the correct degree, which allows the correct length of stride.


                      • #71
                        TTEAM labyrinth

                        I would use this to "chunk down the aids walk in so that the first turn is to the right; then,1. turn right hand to the right; when horse yields to the rein, 2. use inside leg to tell horse to move forward; outside rein will be filled as horse turns to the right; 3. use thumb and first finger on outside rein to halt horse at end of next channel.
                        breeder of Mercury!

                        remember to enjoy the moment, and take a moment to enjoy and give God the glory for these wonderful horses in our lives.BECAUSE: LIFE is What Happens While Making Other Plans


                        • #72


                          • #73
                            lol might as well add my two pennies worth as this is a common problem but normally the other way round as in my horse wont turn left

                            so - most of the time its rider error,which in turn makes the horse stiff as people will ride how they write

                            if one right handed- then the horse is stronger on the left hand side so people say hes stiff on left visa versa in this case but the horse isnt so much as stiff- its just he can turn his head and get away with it
                            and or advade you and that can be in handling ridden or driven

                            as humans tend to favour one side - they ride like it as they are weaker on the opposite side
                            but the horse - is stronger on the side the humans are weaker and there avades you - because it can

                            so one has to fitten the human up - by making one ride equally on both sides

                            so think it was angel , eq trianer and insideoutsideleg,
                            that said - transitions - which is correct and also it was angel that mentioned position - think position position etc and tack

                            so knock out any - issues like ill fitting tack thats saddle bridle and bit
                            sit central to the horse- get a trianer to look at you from behind
                            and then go back to basics and learn everthing in walk 1st once mastered move up to trot etc as alot of this is lack of co ordination and strenght via the rider meaning fit up your self on your right hand side
                            and work the horse evenly on both riens dont do small circuits always go large so you have the room to move ---------- practice bigger bends - like serpetines using the full length and width of the school making 3 huge loops making sure you touch the sides of the school, do large figures of 8.s not pear drops like small one end and huge the other plenty of varied work
                            halts, half halts, walks and trots use all the walk paces and all the trot paces once mastered then use canter

                            dont bore the horse to death- on small circuits or same old thing
                            encourage the horse- via using different idea and have some imagination
                            cones, tyres poles, lpace them in a line - and bend through them ie cones for exsample do it walk once you have mastered corners and big loops
                            then in trot then canter make it fun foryourselve as much as for you horse
                            place poles on ground in boxed or simulate roads turn left and right so its a simluated junction ------- use your imagination and play with your horse as its all schooling and not boring ok and look

                            here on my helpful links pages read 1st page and links


                            read link 4 and 5 meredith manor

                            and this will tie in to what angels been saying

                            then go and read the rest as it will be helpful to you

                            and never ever pull your horse round this causes mouth brusing and makes the horse have a hard mouth and this bad hands
                            goes against the grain

                            think - a horse is much much stronger than you but as a rider you can much stronger than him when your on top- as its mind over matter
                            in other words dont ever say cant----------- this is telling the horse hes won
                            Last edited by goeslikestink; May. 20, 2012, 09:09 PM.


                            • #74
                              honestly: it is very difficult to get riding lessons over the internet....

                              find a trainer and ask them to help - it will work a heck of a lot better


                              • #75
                                nose to tail?

                                How is the horse doing nose to tail circles? either in the stall or the corner of the arena? that gets them bending through the ribs; one of the "checkoffs" for turning.
                                breeder of Mercury!

                                remember to enjoy the moment, and take a moment to enjoy and give God the glory for these wonderful horses in our lives.BECAUSE: LIFE is What Happens While Making Other Plans


                                • #76
                                  YES indeed!

                                  YES, YES, YES , sitting balanced over the seatbones may be "simple" but, not easy
                                  Originally posted by EqTrainer View Post
                                  Oh lordy dont weight either stirrup. Sit on both seatbones evenly. This is the basics, peeps. She needs to find her rear end and her outside before she gets into subtle sophistications like weight aids!
                                  breeder of Mercury!

                                  remember to enjoy the moment, and take a moment to enjoy and give God the glory for these wonderful horses in our lives.BECAUSE: LIFE is What Happens While Making Other Plans


                                  • #77
                                    You have no idea how familiar this sounds. I also have an arab mare who can't turn right. Turns out, its not her problem, it's mine and my trainer is trying her damnedest to beat it out of me.

                                    My attempts to turn often go something like this:
                                    1) Motor down the long side in a good working trot
                                    2) Decide to turn to the right
                                    3) Turn head to look in the direction of travel
                                    4) Clamp my left elbow and shoulder such that I'm holding the pony's head slightly to the outside, no matter what my inside hand is doing
                                    5) Turn my shoulders to the outside
                                    6) Hips follow shoulders, so my entire body is pointing somewhere off in left field and god only knows what my legs are doing.
                                    7) Pony twists her neck, pops her left shoulder and goes sliding off the turn like a spun out sport car AND gets very indignant about the whole thing (yay, mare).

                                    Last week, my trainer put me on a lunge and we worked on just getting my shoulders going in the right direction and my left arm to stop clamping and bracing against my horse (no reins, can't brace).

                                    This week, we'll address the hips problem (hips follow shoulders when I'm doing it wrong but they don't seem to want to follow my shoulders when I'm doing it right).

                                    Even just a getting the upper body pointed in the right has helped immensely. It feels WRONG, like I'm twisting around to her tail but the mirrors show that I'm actually finally parallel with the pony's shoulders on the turn.


                                    • #78
                                      ^ This. So many times students turn their HEADS the direction they want to go, but nothing else does!

                                      Arab_Mare, how's it going?


                                      • #79
                                        The "turn the key" exercise was pretty much a miracle for me and my OTTB. Seriously disturbing (but awesome!) that something so ridiculously easy like changing your hand position could influence the entire horse in front of the leg!


                                        (Now if only we could get a magic solution to keep the back end working correctly at all times as well... )
                                        A quick tutorial on interval training: Conditioning your horse for eventing


                                        • Original Poster

                                          It's doing okay. I've been mentally dropping her, and whenever she leans on my outside aids I automatically drop them and straighten her because I think she's bulging. If I hold tight, she usually leans and then turns. Sometimes. It's work in progress, but it's progress.