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Dressage at Devon-Thorncroft no longer beneficiary?

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  • #41
    Originally posted by wineberrywillie View Post
    Yes, this is true of the former chair. In his defense, he ran an excellent show & he was a great leader for the team. He was fiscally responsible & fair. Mr. Hall was his side kick & driver at the time but elevated to chair because he had the correct male equipment to herd the hens.
    Too true and too funny! But that is DR. Hall to us mere mortals!
    When someone shows you who they are, BELIEVE them- Maya Angelou
    www.americansaddlebredsporthorse.net
    http://www.asbsporthorse.blogspot.com/

    Comment


    • #42
      What saddened me was the forced exit by many on both DAD & DVCTA sides. People who had been with the show since close to the beginning or at the beginning where forced out. They were good, responsible, loyal volunteers who put in countless hours all year round, for the benefit of the show. No agenda, no pictures of them in the MainLine Times, no ulterior motives but just loyalty. They were dismissed because those at the top, did not want to run a fair, balanced & fiscally responsible show. And if you didn't agree with those in charge, you were dismissed. If you were friends with those maligned, you were considered "one of them" & were dissed. I spent 12 yrs with DAD in a chair position. I am not bitter by a long shot because I escaped the negativity & back stabbing which had became overwhelming. As I was told by the breed show chair, as she slit my throat, "this is DAD business & it doesn't reflect on our friendship."

      Comment


      • #43
        (hit reply by accident!)
        So it doesn't shock me that TEC & DAD have parted ways. Unless business, which this relationship was, is conducted fairly & with honesty, it will fail. Under the previous chair, the relationship was very amicable & TEC was shown respect & the behind the scenes show ran well. TEC put in a lot of blood, sweat & tears for almost 20 yrs (more or less- I longer count) with DAD yet in later years, had the minimal voice. I knew it was the final nail when the show went to professional mgmt.

        Comment


        • #44
          Originally posted by ASB Stars View Post
          DAD hired a "consultant" to bring in sponsorship monies. There was a disagreement about whether or not he should have been paid for certain sponsorships. He got cranky. Initially, DAD did not take him at all seriously, and had an attorney who was essentially a "friend to DAD" helping them handle it- gratis. Then, they realized that they were in this a bit too deep-- but, still did not report back in a transparent way to the "Mother Ship"- DVCTA.

          DVCTA was bearing a huge amount of liability for decisions made outside of their actual control. Of course, DAD's attitude was "how dare you question our ability to make these decisions!". This was during the Dr. Jim Hall era.

          I did know that the breed show secretary, the performance show secretary and the show manager were all compensated- but, I did not realize that they drew salaries- which I would define as being paid year round- not just during the show, and the immediate time prior, in preparation.

          I did hear, true or not, that the Breed Show Chair's USDF Convention trip had been covered by the show, but, as stated, I am not sure how true all of that is. Of course, I do tend to believe it.
          Ok....no surprise....goes in line with the DVCTA member's request to "see the books".

          Guess what goes around comes around in the karmic universe.

          Will be interested to see if DaD can continue as a show. Takes lots of volunteers to pull off such a show.

          Interestingly...checked old files....back ~20 yrs ago (1992) DVCTA had 641 members.

          Year & DAD Donation to Thorncroft
          1991 -- $25,000
          1992 -- $38,000
          1993 -- $50,000
          1994 -- $20,000
          1995 -- $44,000
          1996 -- $46,000
          1997 -- $62,500
          1998 -- $67,500
          1999 -- $75,000

          DAD donations to DVCTA
          1994 -- $4,000
          1995 -- $4,000
          1996 -- $4,000
          1997 -- $4,000
          1998 -- $6,000
          1999 -- $6,000
          Last edited by pluvinel; Dec. 23, 2011, 01:03 PM.
          Do not confuse motion and progress. A rocking horse keeps moving but does not make any progress.
          Alfred A. Montapert

          Comment


          • #45
            Originally posted by wineberrywillie View Post
            I escaped the negativity & back stabbing which had became overwhelming. As I was told by the breed show chair, as she slit my throat, "this is DAD business & it doesn't reflect on our friendship."
            Well, at least you were looking at her when she got you- me, she simply stabbed in the back- apparently over and over, but by then, I didn't much care.

            Still in all, you need to take a number on that one- she's left alot of people in her wide wake...
            When someone shows you who they are, BELIEVE them- Maya Angelou
            www.americansaddlebredsporthorse.net
            http://www.asbsporthorse.blogspot.com/

            Comment


            • #46
              Originally posted by pluvinel View Post
              Ok....no surprise....goes in line with the DVCTA member's request to "see the books".

              Guess what goes around comes around in the karmic universe.

              Will be interested to see if DaD can continue as a show. Takes lots of volunteers to pull off such a show.

              Interestingly...checked old files....back ~20 yrs ago (1992) DVCTA had 641 members.

              Year & DAD Donation to Thorncroft
              1991 -- $25,000
              1992 -- $38,000
              1993 -- $50,000
              1994 -- $20,000
              1995 -- $44,000
              1996 -- $46,000
              1997 -- $62,500
              1998 -- $67,500
              1999 -- $75,000

              DAD donations to DVCTA
              1994 -- $4,000
              1995 -- $4,000
              1996 -- $4,000
              1997 -- $4,000
              1998 -- $6,000
              1999 -- $6,000
              Being the parent organization & the one who bore much responsibility, I felt DVCTA deserved more but the wealthy child refused to support the struggling parent.

              Comment


              • #47
                Originally posted by wineberrywillie View Post
                Being the parent organization & the one who bore much responsibility, I felt DVCTA deserved more but the wealthy child refused to support the struggling parent.
                Actually, it was the "parent" that refused to own up to its "parental" responsibilities and provide oversight and rein in its wayward "child."
                Do not confuse motion and progress. A rocking horse keeps moving but does not make any progress.
                Alfred A. Montapert

                Comment


                • #48
                  Originally posted by pluvinel View Post
                  Actually, it was the "parent" that refused to own up to its "parental" responsibilities and provide oversight and rein in its wayward "child."
                  True. BB attempted but it was a different & more friendly/respectful regime.

                  Comment


                  • #49
                    The reality is that the DAD crew truly believe their own hype- biggest this, and bestest that. You are as good as your weakest link. And, I am sure that they are going to find that out, sooner than later.
                    When someone shows you who they are, BELIEVE them- Maya Angelou
                    www.americansaddlebredsporthorse.net
                    http://www.asbsporthorse.blogspot.com/

                    Comment


                    • #50
                      Some context

                      Originally posted by pluvinel View Post
                      Actually, it was the "parent" that refused to own up to its "parental" responsibilities and provide oversight and rein in its wayward "child."
                      Basically I agree with you. However, let's add some context. Keeping with the parent/child relationship it goes like this:

                      Do a bit of research and you'll discover that any DVCTA president that had the 'go along to get along' additude toward the overgrown, spoiled brat of a child had a splendid term in office. I seem to recall that the one in office during the 'split' was even rewarded by the DAD'ers with a basket of wine at the annual meeting; talk about a 'handful of silver'.

                      Any president that took the reins of responsibility seriously and dared to confront the, as you put it, wayward child, was put through hell in its various incarnations. Suffice it to say, it was never a pleasant experience. For a volunteer position with NO salary it was simply not worth the resultant stress.

                      So in fairness to the entirety of DVCTA officers, past and present, understand that there were those who tried. And as I said in a previous post, the membership was MIA in fighting for what was rightfully their show.

                      Comment


                      • #51
                        Originally posted by pluvinel View Post
                        Ok....no surprise....goes in line with the DVCTA member's request to "see the books".

                        Guess what goes around comes around in the karmic universe.

                        Will be interested to see if DaD can continue as a show. Takes lots of volunteers to pull off such a show.

                        Interestingly...checked old files....back ~20 yrs ago (1992) DVCTA had 641 members.

                        Year & DAD Donation to Thorncroft
                        1991 -- $25,000
                        1992 -- $38,000
                        1993 -- $50,000
                        1994 -- $20,000
                        1995 -- $44,000
                        1996 -- $46,000
                        1997 -- $62,500
                        1998 -- $67,500
                        1999 -- $75,000

                        DAD donations to DVCTA
                        1994 -- $4,000
                        1995 -- $4,000
                        1996 -- $4,000
                        1997 -- $4,000
                        1998 -- $6,000
                        1999 -- $6,000
                        What is stunning here is the membership total. Currently I believe the membership is under 200.

                        Comment


                        • #52
                          Originally posted by Warmblooded707 View Post
                          Basically I agree with you. However, let's add some context. Keeping with the parent/child relationship it goes like this:

                          Do a bit of research and you'll discover that any DVCTA president that had the 'go along to get along' additude toward the overgrown, spoiled brat of a child had a splendid term in office. I seem to recall that the one in office during the 'split' was even rewarded by the DAD'ers with a basket of wine at the annual meeting; talk about a 'handful of silver'.

                          Any president that took the reins of responsibility seriously and dared to confront the, as you put it, wayward child, was put through hell in its various incarnations. Suffice it to say, it was never a pleasant experience. For a volunteer position with NO salary it was simply not worth the resultant stress.

                          So in fairness to the entirety of DVCTA officers, past and present, understand that there were those who tried. And as I said in a previous post, the membership was MIA in fighting for what was rightfully their show.
                          Well.....the Prez was not alone....the Board sat there like deer in the head lights....clueless.....and did nothing.

                          There was no concept of "corporate governance" or "fiduciary responsibility"....even when the treasurer at the time was an attorney (for an insurance company, if I recall).

                          Can't lay the blame just at the feet of the Prez. The entire BOD refused to stand up and take a stand.

                          The membership was MIA because the BOD did nothing to inform them. And those members who did care enough to get involved, got no support from their BOD.....you can take a horse to water, but ya can't make it drink.

                          Could not figure out how they could just sit there.
                          Do not confuse motion and progress. A rocking horse keeps moving but does not make any progress.
                          Alfred A. Montapert

                          Comment


                          • #53
                            Originally posted by Warmblooded707 View Post
                            What is stunning here is the membership total. Currently I believe the membership is under 200.
                            Based on mining old newsletters, this is some data I had compiled.

                            DVCTA Membership throughout the years...some history

                            Date -- Total
                            Jun-88 -- 670
                            Mar-90 -- 621
                            Apr-91 -- 555
                            Apr-92 -- 475
                            May-92 -- 481
                            Jun-93 -- 476
                            Apr-94 -- 456
                            Jun-95 -- 507
                            Jan-96 -- 365
                            Feb-96 -- 386
                            Last edited by pluvinel; Dec. 24, 2011, 06:08 AM.
                            Do not confuse motion and progress. A rocking horse keeps moving but does not make any progress.
                            Alfred A. Montapert

                            Comment


                            • #54
                              Originally posted by pluvinel View Post
                              Well.....the Prez was not alone....the Board sat there like deer in the head lights....clueless.....and did nothing.

                              There was no concept of "corporate governance" or "fiduciary responsibility"....even when the treasurer at the time was an attorney (for an insurance company, if I recall).

                              Can't lay the blame just at the feet of the Prez. The entire BOD refused to stand up and take a stand.

                              The membership was MIA because the BOD did nothing to inform them. And those members who did care enough to get involved, got no support from their BOD.....you can take a horse to water, but ya can't make it drink.

                              Could not figure out how they could just sit there.
                              Won't get any argument from me on that score.

                              Comment


                              • #55
                                Originally posted by ASB Stars View Post
                                DAD hired a "consultant" to bring in sponsorship monies. There was a disagreement about whether or not he should have been paid for certain sponsorships. He got cranky. Initially, DAD did not take him at all seriously, and had an attorney who was essentially a "friend to DAD" helping them handle it- gratis. Then, they realized that they were in this a bit too deep-- but, still did not report back in a transparent way to the "Mother Ship"- DVCTA.

                                DVCTA was bearing a huge amount of liability for decisions made outside of their actual control. Of course, DAD's attitude was "how dare you question our ability to make these decisions!". This was during the Dr. Jim Hall era.
                                On that note - first DAD e-comm. mtg. attended by the new DVCTA pres. and VP went thusly: the paid attorney representing DAD had arrived and was in the last five minutes of his presentation bringing the committee up to speed on the progress, or lack thereof, on the ongoing litigation when the Pres. and VP arrived. No member of the committee saw fit, right or proper to say 'oh by the way, these are the folks being sued....'no introduction, zip, zero, nada. The attorney blew out the door doing a steller impersonation of the rabbit's "I'm late, I'm late, I'm late for a very important date..." and everyone adjourned to another room to begin the balance of the meeting. The hostess for the shindig came half way around the corner of the up stairs, looked at the VP and said "what are you doing here?" Truly, ya can't make this stuff up. That was the tone set right out of the gate towards the new club officers. Somewhere in the middle of this festive gathering one of the senior members of the committee (senior in age, not position) was literally reduced to tears and ran from the room - why? She was committing the heresy of advocating for the beneficiary.

                                Comment


                                • #56
                                  Oh, those were the days....

                                  The President who quit abruptly, stating that he felt like that little cartoon character (Yosemite Sam), trying to control the run-away stage coach (DAD), was the best example of how utterly frustrating it was dealing with the DAD committee. There was some 'flap' about something going wrong at the show, and his exclamation that "You can't run a show that big with half-baked volunteers", really set off the DAD'ers, and it was downhill from there. EVERY DVCTA President who tried to rein them in came up against such opposition: stone-walling, disrespect and just plain sneakiness, so that it became a losing proposition for a volunteer who accepted a Board Position.
                                  I think that TEC is just TIRED of all the BS from the DADers, who just want to fling the money around, to make the show more glitzy, and the heck with any beneficiaries. Don't hold your breath for a new one to come outta the woodwork....
                                  Last edited by puddytat; Dec. 23, 2011, 07:16 PM. Reason: spelink LOL

                                  Comment


                                  • #57
                                    Any beneficiary will need to provide dozens of volunteers just to man the show - the pre-show prep has a steep learning curve and a limited time frame not to mention take down. As I recall one of the main reasons to keep TEC as beneficiary was the numbers of people they could provide and the good will they have in the area when it comes to donations for food booths, and other necessary items.

                                    Comment


                                    • #58
                                      Originally posted by JMurray View Post
                                      I have seen nothing official or unofficial about this except from the OP. After donating a horse to them this year I have some contact and nothing has been said.
                                      It's official - copied from TEC's website:

                                      December 16, 2011

                                      Dear Friends,

                                      At a meeting of our Board of Directors and management team last night we came to the joint conclusion that this is the time for Thorncroft to step down as the beneficiary of Dressage at Devon.

                                      YOU our most special friends have been an amazing group.... Saunders and I cannot express to you how much your help and commitment to the Farm over the past 25 years of Dressage at Devon has meant to us. We take your commitment personally and are forever grateful.

                                      Out of respect to our friendships and in an effort to make sure you don’t “hear news thru the grape vine” we are sending this email. Please excuse the impersonal announcement but being time sensitive we wanted you to get notice as quickly as possible.

                                      We would also like to let you know that Thorncroft has launched a capital campaign to cover the north paddock and make some other great improvements. The paddock will enable us to do more of our work with our students AND special events on the Farm! We hope we can count on you to come to a planning meeting in the near future... to see what we can organize for a fall event.

                                      Trust me... we are still in need of your help... and together we will plan a GREAT Fall Festival. We encourage you to give a call and answer any questions you may have.

                                      As always, we remain gratefully yours,

                                      Saunders & Sallie


                                      The end of an era - I wish TEC nothing but the best.

                                      Comment


                                      • #59
                                        Let's think...who should be the next beneficiary of DAD's largess? There MUST be some program somewhere that is desperate enough-- hungry enough-- and doesn't know do-do about the history of this conflagration-- er-- group!
                                        When someone shows you who they are, BELIEVE them- Maya Angelou
                                        www.americansaddlebredsporthorse.net
                                        http://www.asbsporthorse.blogspot.com/

                                        Comment


                                        • #60
                                          Sheer conjecture on my part but December is usually the month TEC receives their gift from DAD. Also TEC is responsible to their BOD and perhaps, with 30K pledged or gifted for state of the art warm up dirt, a hot commodity in these tough financial times, (tongue firmly planted in cheek here) this year's gift may have been less than expected OR next year's anticipated gift could well be the straw that broke the back.

                                          Regardless of TEC's reason I wish them all the best and am certain they will thrive beyond their wildest expectations. Over the years I believe they've proven themselves to be the better players in a oft times difficult game.

                                          By the way, the mad scrambling, heavy breathing, and tinkling sound of bladders emptying may be the big show muckety-mucks searching for a dollar to by a clue as to what to do now!

                                          Merry Christmas to All and to All a GOOOOD- Night!

                                          Comment

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