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Baby/Green Horse Thread

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  • #61
    On Monday I took the green fresian/saddlebred 4 yr old on her first "outing". This is all part of my training that I do (as well as training horses to self load in the trailer!). Took them to another farm just about 10 miles from me and spend an hour and a half doing ground work, lunging with tack, working thru obstacles, ground driving etc while another horse was working and the horses in the pasture were running up to see what was going on etc. Gets them prepared for the eventual show atmosphere without being TOO overwhelming. We will go back next week and I will ride her there. I like to not ride the first time, let them just do the same exact routine as we do at home, without the riding. Then when we go back, will do the routine plus riding. What is VERY important with youngsters going away from home, is to give them something "familiar" that will make them feel confident. And that is to do the same routine which they have become familiar with at home. In no time, they are relazed and happy as they realize that the only thing that has changed is the surroundings but NOT what they have come to expect to have to do! When I take a horse in for training, these are the things that I do, not JUST riding/lunging etc, but the ENTIRE training process. Probably will haul her to a small schooling show in January.
    www.shawneeacres.net

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    • #62
      Originally posted by Keg-A-Bacchus View Post
      ... I've always had a ground person to assist in starting horses but since moving I lost my training partner So usually I start by lunging and teaching them voice cues that mean walk, trot, canter, easy (slow down), big (bigger gait but don't switch), relax (drop head and stretch) and whoa. After getting them spot on to verbal cues only I back them and have my assistant lunge me on them. The first session I just passenger...no assistance. Second session I allow the lunger to give all the verbal cues at the same time I give the leg/seat cues in the saddle. Third ride, or when they get that down pat, I take over all verbal/seat/leg cues and the lunge person is only there to reinforce with the whip if I get stuck or slow us down if something goes haywire. After 4-5 lunge sessions and fading out the lunger we go off the lunge but have a person on the ground to back us up with the whip if need be.

      I like this method because it keeps the horse calm and in his comfort zone. When I tried it with Willa with no ground person she got frustrated and was frozen to my leg. And I had even done in-hand work with her to teach her to move forward to pressure on her side. But it just didn't quite translate and I got on her twice and just didn't like the confusion/resistance I was feeling underneath me. So I finally found a good ground person to come over and help and after 2 lunge sessions we were right on track and I was completely in charge! She was so much more relaxed and happy as she understood now what I wanted. I was glad to not start off our under saddle relationship with fear/resistance as I want her to have FUN! Something to think about as it sounds like we have the exact same issue and this worked great for Willa! Just slowly fade out your ground person so your horse doesn't get nervous or confused.

      Good luck!!
      This is the exact method we use, and I described it in my earlier post. Everything in training MUST build upon prior work with the horse. They have to use "association" to learn new skills, that is, associate the leg with the verbal cues and lunge whip that they have already leearned, and then gradually remove the first cue and replace the second one. They don't "forget" the first cue, they just learn that the second one means the same thing. Too many people don't realize that the horse INHERENTLY and INSTINCTIVELY moves INTO pressure not away from it. So one must teach the horse that pressure, which can be in the form of presure from the leg, "pressure" from the whip, pressure from the rein means to "give" or move away. So you replace one instinctive response, with a different response, which needs to become equally instinctive to the horse. Also remember, the horse learns not from the pressure but from the RELEASE of the pressure, which is the reward. So moving forward from leg pressue must be rewarding by releasing the pressure as soon as the horse takes a step. You may have to reappply the presssure intially for more forward motion, but don't keep the pressure "on" when the horse responds in the correct way.
      www.shawneeacres.net

      Comment


      • #63
        OMG, Willa looks like a Thellwell pony. SO Frickin' CUTE!
        On the Internet, nobody knows you're a dog

        Comment


        • #64
          Shawnee Acres-

          Originally posted by shawneeAcres View Post
          Here are two green horses we are working right now. This one is a 4 yr old fresian/saddlebred mare we are starting for a client. WE do things maybe a bit differently than some trainers. LOTS of groundwork and desensitization, take the horse over taprs, poles, other obstacles right from the beginning in hand and on lungeline. Ground drive, teach horse to move away from pressure. WE start all of the youngsters in western saddle and then change over, its good for them to feel things flopping and gives the rider a bit more security if needed I use a combination of traditional training techniques, dressage and NH with my youngsters. I want them to go quietly and balanced on a loose rein before really taking any contact. I want them to repsond to whoa, backing and be happy to walk and trot forwardly (cantering on lunge, will do undersaddle once the walk/trot is confirmed) but not VERY forward at this point. I think too many trainers ask for too much forward to early and the young horse cannot balance and can get scared.

          groundwork: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-WfHl3CJAuQ
          under saddle: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s_35PdtEmFM

          Here is a 2 1/2 year old TB gelding. We will just ride him a handful of times and then he gets winter off and more training later next year. Being ridden on the lungeline, sorry I was lunging and filming at same time!

          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LjZe--y235U
          Wow, i love how you start 'em. Wish you were near me.
          "There is no fundamental difference between man and animals in their ability to feel pleasure and pain, happiness, and misery." - Charles Darwin

          Comment


          • #65
            Today was pedicure day for my Bella, so I got there early to catch her and scrape off some of the mud*. I decided I had enough time to lunge her lightly, so I tied her up to go get the lunge line. Before I got 20 feet away, the little brat had grabbed the lead rope and was working on untying herself!

            She behaved herself for the farrier. I think she prefers men. (She's all lovey with my husband as well.)

            She is picking up lunging quickly. Of course, all I'm working on right now is walking and whoa. Baby steps.

            * I refuse to bitch about the mud we have from the rain we finally gotten!

            Comment

            • Original Poster

              #66
              Originally posted by janiemerle View Post
              Today was pedicure day for my Bella, so I got there early to catch her and scrape off some of the mud*. I decided I had enough time to lunge her lightly, so I tied her up to go get the lunge line. Before I got 20 feet away, the little brat had grabbed the lead rope and was working on untying herself! [/I]
              Gotta love Morgans. I swear they are half Human. Well, ok, how about half Toddler? Mine is unlike any horse I have ever owned.

              I keep wavering between being super psyched about my mare and being depressed. Sometimes I feel like I've been spinning my wheels for so long that I'll never actually get back to riding for real. While I'm not super serious, I do like consistency, and the last three years have been nothing but stops and starts. Not exactly conducive to bringing a young horse along and I sometimes wonder if I made a mistake in buying her this summer, despite really thinking it through.

              I think I need to just accept that that's how it is when you are an adult, with a job, family, kids, etc. and get over it already. And realize that she's young, I have A LOT of years to do all kinds of fun things with her. There is no timetable.

              Anyway I *am* looking forward to seeing her tonight and I think I am going to get rid of the long mane. I'm not a fan and have been preserving it due to her breed standards... but... time to pull it!
              We couldn't all be cowboys, so some of us are clowns.

              Comment


              • #67
                Originally posted by FlashGordon View Post
                Anyway I *am* looking forward to seeing her tonight and I think I am going to get rid of the long mane. I'm not a fan and have been preserving it due to her breed standards... but... time to pull it!
                I remember trying to keep Mac's mane long but I just hated it and so off it went - he looks soooooo much better. I really don't like long manes.

                Post before and after pictures!
                My Mustang Adventures - Mac, my mustang | Annwylid D'Lite - my Cob filly

                "A horse's face always conveys clearly whether it is loved by its owner or simply used." - Anja Beran

                Comment


                • #68
                  Originally posted by FlashGordon View Post
                  Gotta love Morgans. I swear they are half Human. Well, ok, how about half Toddler? Mine is unlike any horse I have ever owned.

                  I keep wavering between being super psyched about my mare and being depressed. Sometimes I feel like I've been spinning my wheels for so long that I'll never actually get back to riding for real. While I'm not super serious, I do like consistency, and the last three years have been nothing but stops and starts. Not exactly conducive to bringing a young horse along and I sometimes wonder if I made a mistake in buying her this summer, despite really thinking it through.

                  I think I need to just accept that that's how it is when you are an adult, with a job, family, kids, etc. and get over it already. And realize that she's young, I have A LOT of years to do all kinds of fun things with her. There is no timetable.

                  Anyway I *am* looking forward to seeing her tonight and I think I am going to get rid of the long mane. I'm not a fan and have been preserving it due to her breed standards... but... time to pull it!
                  Please don't take this as an insult FG, but sometimes I swear we were separated at birth

                  I could say the same thing about the Connemara, and my attitude towards this whole thing.

                  Bugzy is just...weird. I have a 4'x6" tack room attached to my stall, and now that it is cold I lock myself in it with my heater while I am changing or whatever (last night it was 32 degrees at the barn when I was there!). She just sits there in her stall with her nose up to the crack in the door like, "what on earth are you doing?!". My last mare would be eating, then run away from me when I went to tack her up. Miss B gets all upset if I go anywhere, she wants attention and wants it now. She seems to enjoy being tacked up for work. She literally puts the bridle on her own head.

                  Have you had a chance to read Scott Hassler's young horse training articles in the USDF magazines? I read them and they make me feel better about what I am doing. He is preparing horses for the top of the sport, and he says at this age it needs to be positive and fun, more about fitness and work ethic than training. And he says he does not work them much over 30 minutes, even in the 5 yer old year.

                  So keep it simple and fun, and progress will come faster than you know it
                  On the Internet, nobody knows you're a dog

                  Comment


                  • #69
                    Half toddler! Yep, that's it!

                    Of course, in today's mail I *finally* got the DNA from AMHA. I could have been out there pulling the 20-30 hairs from her tail that they need to identify her.

                    Originally posted by Perfect Pony View Post
                    ...and he says at this age it needs to be positive and fun, more about fitness and work ethic than training. And he says he does not work them much over 30 minutes, even in the 5 yer old year.

                    So keep it simple and fun, and progress will come faster than you know it
                    Good to know because it seems that's all the time I have these days!

                    Comment


                    • #70
                      And Flashy, I've found that sometimes things just "click" and the horse will get it just when you think it will never happen. For instance, Mac has all of a sudden decided that he loves to canter and would rather canter than trot. I spent a lot of time w/t only and we really struggled with the canter. Now he's like "can we canter now? how about now? let me canter and show you my moves!" It really is quite funny and he had me laughing during today's ride.

                      I agree about keeping it fun. In my lessons I do spend a lot of time on the 20-m circle, but on my own I try to mix it up. Today we did Big Boy cavaletti exercises and I think he really enjoyed the challenge and doing something fresh and different. We only worked for 30 minutes, but we got a lot accomplished. A nice 15-minute trail ride was his reward and we called it a day!
                      My Mustang Adventures - Mac, my mustang | Annwylid D'Lite - my Cob filly

                      "A horse's face always conveys clearly whether it is loved by its owner or simply used." - Anja Beran

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        Ooh, what a fun thread. I'm the very proud owner (or perhaps he owns me, I'm not quite sure) of a four year old morgan gelding. He too is like no other horse I've ever owned. I'm a para rider and he puts up with me, my wheelchair, my service dog and almost everything else with no fuss. He certainly has his moments, but they are few and far between. We showed intro this summer just to get our feet wet and had a blast. Here is Copper all dudded up for the ride to his first show. http://i1136.photobucket.com/albums/...irstShow-1.jpg
                        And here he is from this spring. http://i1136.photobucket.com/albums/...ring2011-1.jpg
                        We have such a long way to go, but are having so much fun with the journey. He is just such a blast and I love him to pieces.

                        Comment


                        • #72
                          I have a coming 3 (April) Oldenburg
                          Quaterback gelding


                          The next Totilas? Just kidding..

                          There, thats a little more relaxed

                          He got the wrong lead at first, then immediately did a flying change :shock:

                          I like how under himself he is here for an unbalanced young horse

                          Is it obvious I'm in LOVE with this horse??









                          Comment


                          • #73
                            Love your morgan Copper. And student your guy is really nice!



                            I was able to have Dean Graham, Mr Trainer, come over and school Rex for me tonight. BTW we had a cold front move through right as he came over to ride (see photo of front here: http://a1.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphot...24925376_n.jpg). It was 74 around 2pm. By 5pm it was 54 and raining with high gusts of wind. Tonight it will be 34. So needless to say, I was fine letting him get on and me just watch.

                            And he does just that. Just gets on. w/t/c. flying changes across the diagonal. Once he warmed up, Rex was really floating along, he was letting him out and stretching in the canter and he was just gliding. At one point Dean says "You have got yourself a really beautiful horse here!" and he always talks about how wonderful his canter is every time he rides him.

                            I was able to video some on my cell but didnt have the settings right so the video isnt as clear as the long lining ones but oh well. This is from the last part of the ride. He was talking about not fighting him when he falls in through his shoulder or acts like hes going to run into the wall. Find out where he wants to go and when you go there, work his butt, and then when you leave, make life easy. So with him wanting to drift to the barn, every time he came by the barn, he had to work, and then soft and easy away from the barn.

                            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8GZvKOZAxY
                            ~~~~~~~~~

                            Member of the ILMD[FN]HP Clique, The Florida Clique, OMGiH I loff my mares, and the Bareback Riders clique!

                            Comment

                            • Original Poster

                              #74
                              KrazyTB, Rex is just... droolworthy. He does have a gorgeous canter. And can I borrow your trainer?!

                              PP & PP... I wish I was on the same coast as you two. We could have loads of fun with your ponies. It helps to see you guys a year ahead of me... gives me some hope that Bella and I will get there too.

                              Copper, your guy is adorable! I love that we have a few Morgans on this thread. And Student your guy is stunning as well.

                              Well Bella was a Spicy Baby on the longe again... I'm not sure what is up with that, you clip the line on and all she wants to do is play, prop, buck, bolt, and generally be a freak. I'd had enough of it tonight so it turned into a rather long longing session. Then MiasPal got on and she was AMAAAAZING! She's steering off seat/leg, accepting light contact, bending, and just generally looking good. Her balance and rhythm at the trot is getting better. We are a loooong way off cantering, but I'm encouraged that she's doing so well W/T. She's all business under saddle despite the playfulness on the line... which I think can be attributed to her being turned out alone, and with all the rain/mud we've had, she doesn't do much out there.

                              I didn't get on her-- I don't feel like my fitness/reaction time is there, and at this point, I don't want her to have any bad experiences. So I guess I will wait it out a bit longer. And maybe try to find some made horses to get on so I can regain my footing after all the time off.
                              We couldn't all be cowboys, so some of us are clowns.

                              Comment


                              • #75
                                So many people on this thread with Morgans!

                                I need to get some stealth video of a new Morgan that just shipped in from New York a couple months ago, he is a cool horse. It's 2 guys that own him and they bought a 3 or 4 year old as their first horse! But, they are doing great, riding western, taking lessons. He is a super horse and a nice mover and fancy, I would love to see him in dressage tack.
                                On the Internet, nobody knows you're a dog

                                Comment


                                • #76
                                  Student - I really quite think I love your horse too - his face/markings are priceless, and, well.. I've drooled over every Quaterback I've seen, so... it's no surprise if my keyboard shorts out now ;-)

                                  I'll play. 3yo OTTB, picked up at the beginning of September, started working with mid October ... Thus far the trainer has lunged him 3 or 4 handfuls of times, ridden him a couple handfuls of times, and I've ridden him ... 7 times now?

                                  Right lead canter is.. interesting. He really throws his body through my left leg and avoids picking up the right lead. 2 rides ago this was corrected with a whip on the shoulder, and right-lead-canter turned into right-lead-gallop-with-gumby-neck-and-no-steering he got 3 days off due to lack of time on my part, and then rode him again and right lead canter was much more obtainable (by significant counter bend and jamming him through a corner, but it worked, and then we let go, hung loose, and cruised in a forward canter (not gallop) WITH steering (albeit somewhat rudimentary) and brakes.

                                  He's a smart cookie and actually surprisingly very, very well balanced for a young horse. His canter is about the most to die for thing I've ever rode, and I think as he lightens up in the face, and to leg, he will be a lot like riding a high end sports car.

                                  I have to admit, I was/am apprehensive about life as I am once again down to two 3 year olds - a 3 1/2 yo warmblood (sire: Case [ComeBack II], dam, a Secretariat Granddaughter) who isn't broke yet (he's going to a friend up north for bush riding in the spring. Don't mind him sitting til 4 as he is very, very physically immature and TINY...about 15.1h) , and then this TB... seems like everytime I get something nice and broke and having fun, they die So hopefully luck will change with these two. I was pretty dreading starting over the whole "green" process but this TB is such a joy that, well, we've a long way to go and still aren't operating without trainer help, but he's a pretty darned "sweet ride".

                                  Registered name is Paddys Road. Barn name officially Rascal (unless I go and change my mind)

                                  Pedigree: http://www.pedigreequery.com/paddys+road

                                  Conformation (kinda): http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fb...type=3&theater

                                  and undersaddle, 1st time I rode him off the lunge line. Disclaimer: Rider looks like hell - hate western tack, plus haven't really ridden in 9ish months. It's a work in progress.
                                  Disclaimer 2: Don't really care all that much where his head is. It's just natural!
                                  Disclaimer 3: Rider needs to lose weight and gain tone. That not riding for 9ish months really screwed me over. Note to self: RIDE!

                                  http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fb...e=3&permPage=1

                                  http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fb...e=3&permPage=1

                                  http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fb...e=3&permPage=1

                                  http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fb...e=3&permPage=1

                                  http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fb...e=3&permPage=1

                                  He's kind of a rockstar. I really am quite smitten

                                  Hopefully he'll suit the dressage ring, because I am chickenshit and thus don't jump anything bigger than a mounting block ... and he's a keeper!
                                  *&*&*&*&*&*&*&*&*&*&*&*&*&*&*&
                                  "Show me the back of a thoroughbred horse, and I will show you my wings."
                                  &*&*&*&*&*&*&*&*&*&*&*&*&*&*&*&

                                  Comment


                                  • #77
                                    Here is our photo album of the last ride before her winter vacation. We're going to pick back up in the spring. She was really stiff/resistant today...when I got off her I found a big crack in her heel that was sore to the touch. Poor girl, she was awesome all things considered.

                                    https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?...9107775&type=1

                                    Comment


                                    • #78
                                      So proud!

                                      My pretty girl Foxy (aka Flashdance) is coming along so well, she is a very willing and quiet girl. She is still in Texas and comes home in a few weeks, she has been under saddle since mid/late October and I just got a new video of her today.

                                      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IqdPsr4Wtdo

                                      I feel like a little girl I am so in love with her!!!!

                                      Comment


                                      • #79
                                        I am considering a 4 year old Morgan. Seems really sensible, w/t/c undersaddle and a bit of lateral work started. I am an AA (schooled up to
                                        3rd level). I was thrown violently off a 4 year old last spring. We think now it was a saddle fit issue. Anyway, I am not keen on that happening again and it has zapped my confidence a bit. Many poeple said to me "well he's a young horse, that's a young horse thing", etc. So, is it? Should I not get a young horse unless I am prepared to possibly be tossed? I know any horse can get you off his back, but is there really an adolescent 4-5-6 year old phase where they are more prone to temper tantrums, etc??
                                        Those who say it cannot be done should not interrupt the person doing it.

                                        Comment


                                        • #80
                                          Definitely not all young horses are that way. ESPECIALLY if they are started by a professional. My mom and I both have young horses that we bought unbroken and sent out for training for 30 days, and have done all the work ourselves. I have yet to fall off mine (well except for one time she spooked and i lost a stirrup...not a bad one)...my mom has been dumped once by a bad spook and got a concussion. Neither of them have had a spook since.

                                          I absolutely love riding my 3 year old. She is quiet and easy going and cares about me. She tries hard and works hard and enjoys her work. If she is stiff or resistant, i can be sure it is because she's uncomfortable, not because she is being a brat. I gallop her through fields and take her trail riding, in addition to dressage (not a lot of trails, but a little here and there). I ride her exclusively in a huge open field and she is super trustworthy.

                                          They both throw small bucks occasionally going into the canter. My horse used to throw bigger bucks going into the canter, but has outgrown them (when they buck, get after them!).

                                          I don't think a young horse who is handled kindly growing up is any more dangerous than an older horse. I would want to know how they were raised though. I would rather see a horse wild and unhandled than mistreated.

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