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draft horse/dressage

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  • #161
    Originally posted by Cielo Azure View Post

    I think I may get out there I do some videoing of our Perchs and dressage.
    I sure wish you would! My guy definitely takes after the perch half of his breeding

    Comment

    • Original Poster
      #162
      You guys are the BOMB!!! These horses are so much cuter and seem to have way more personality than the typical overpriced warmblood. I'm hooked.

      Comment

      • #163
        Originally posted by oldschool View Post
        You guys are the BOMB!!! These horses are so much cuter and seem to have way more personality than the typical overpriced warmblood. I'm hooked.

        Amen

        Comment

        • #164
          my dressage draft cross

          http://i287.photobucket.com/albums/l...ow2007009.jpg:

          Belgium Draft dad, TB mom

          8 yo, 17 hh
          Professional Training- $$$
          Attitude- Priceless

          Does Recog. Dressage, Eventing, Trail Rides....for my AA aspirations/goals he's perfect. First season out last year,(TL, 1st, BN) always in the top spots.

          Great training + great attitude + hard work= fun, successful horse!

          Comment

          • #165
            my draft cross




            Trying again for picture! sorry!

            Comment

            • #166
              Originally posted by RC&W View Post
              http://i287.photobucket.com/albums/l...ow2007009.jpg:

              Belgium Draft dad, TB mom

              8 yo, 17 hh
              Professional Training- $$$
              Attitude- Priceless

              Does Recog. Dressage, Eventing, Trail Rides....for my AA aspirations/goals he's perfect. First season out last year,(TL, 1st, BN) always in the top spots.

              Great training + great attitude + hard work= fun, successful horse!

              He looks awesome and a lot like mine - here is a link to her - she is 6 and belgian tb - although she is my alpha mare - she is really sweet with me.

              http://www.hotelfun4kids.com/images/horses/asper.jpg

              Comment

              • #167
                Originally posted by Ambrey View Post
                The OP stated that it was a light 16.2 hh horse. My horse is 16.3hh, same height as Lewin's.

                Maybe you should speak with these people breeding the 17hh+ warmbloods? There's one at my barn who is 17.2hh. He towers over my draft cross.
                I realized that. The general rule though, when speaking of "drafts" we are talking larger horses in general. That is what I was getting at. No need to get upset. In general, drafts - as in the typical 17h and up, massive animal used for draft purposes, they are not going to fare well in rigorous dressage workouts. There is always the exception, but physiologically, it's not a good match. Which is why 300 pound men typically do shot-put and not track and field.

                Comment

                • #168
                  I find it interesting the need of some to 'attack' anything that is different than what they have or do. I've ridden QHs, APHAs, Fjords and Arabs in dressage. In each breed, I found *an individual* who was quite exceptional. Had they had a better rider (rather than ME who does is for love) they would have gone very far. I've seen a couple of them under a great rider, and they were amazing. I've brought some to 2nd level, but never made it past the 2nd level ceiling (until now--knocking wood madly) because of ME, not them.

                  Few horses have Olympic/WEG attributes. A few more can do FEI levels internationally. A *LOT* more than that can do the movements, correctly. Perhaps not flashy, but CORRECT. Correct enough even to score competitively, provided they have the MIND AND TEMPERAMENT to do well at shows.

                  Temperament will get an amateur's horse sooo much further than flashy gaits and fancy bloodlines.

                  I'm not saying it might not be easier for some horses--but it's the INDIVIDUAL. Of course if a breed has been purpose bred for a couple of decades or more, there are more likely to be more individuals who are suited to the discipline...

                  But that doesn't mean there cannot be exceptional individuals out there who mightn't conform to *your* idea of what is perfect.

                  I've known some very fancy draft crosses. A friend breeds Spanish Normans. Her percheron mares are to DIE for. Beautiful movers, whose hocks come well under, free in the shoulder, lovely necks and stunning heads. Of course, they were chosen for all that, and are complimented by a PRE stallion. The offspring are amazingly athletic, sane, sound and healthy.

                  There is a super cute full draft perchie mare at a barn I teach at. She is a very nice mover, and I expect she'll get to 2nd no trouble. May not have the real strength or sit for collection, but it's hard to say, really, until she gets stronger. Very pure gaits. Light and forward.

                  Just because some drafts would be horrible in dressage doesn't mean a couple mightn't be brilliant.
                  InnisFailte Pinto Sporthorses & Coloured Cobs
                  ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

                  Bits are like cats, what's one more? (Petstorejunkie)

                  Comment

                  • #169
                    If you were referring to my post - I am hardly "attacking something that is different". I am commenting on the fact that draft breeds *may* not hold up as well as a lighter breed to a strenuous workout. Again - there's always the exception and in that case it still doesn't change the fact that draft horses are not bred for dressage, barrel racing, etc., etc. It's a matter of physics. As lovely as they are - I hate to see them break down just like I hate to see badly bred TB's break down, QH's with itty-bitty leg bones with leg problems, any horse experiencing road founder (because most horses aren't bred for running on asphalt) - get the idea? It has nothing to do with the the discipline, it has to do with what their comformationally suitable for.

                    I'm 130 pounds. Sumo-wrestling isn't in my future. If people laughed at me for trying, I'd hardly accuse them of "attacking something different"....I may get hurt and maybe sumo wrestling isn't for people with my, er, conformation. .

                    Comment

                    • #170
                      Originally posted by hundredacres View Post
                      It's a matter of physics. As lovely as they are - I hate to see them break down just like I hate to see badly bred TB's break down, QH's with itty-bitty leg bones with leg problems, any horse experiencing road founder (because most horses aren't bred for running on asphalt) - get the idea? It has nothing to do with the the discipline, it has to do with what their comformationally suitable for.
                      But if physics were the issue, that wouldn't be so either. True drafts have the extra weight, it's true- but they have the bone and hooves to manage it as well.

                      A 1400 lb halter bred QH with tiny little hooves is not the same as a 1400 lb percheron with hooves the size of turkey platters and cannon bones to match! They were bred to seriously do the job.

                      If some break down, I'd call that poor breeding, as much as I consider it poor breeding when QHs break down because their bulk isn't matched by the supporting structure. I don't know as much about the Perch breeding process as Lewin and Cielo Azure do, but I do know that there are good and bad percherons as much as there are good and bad anything else, and there are different types within the breed- just as with quarter horses you have racing lines, cow lines, halter lines, HUS lines, etc.

                      I am betting that you could look at the breeding of a particular percheron and make a pretty good guess as to how it would do in dressage (and I still want to see videos of Cielo Azure's!).

                      Comment

                      • #171
                        RC&W and Prodomus, thank you for pictures of your beautiful horses. I LOFF THEM! more power to you ~ have a blast out there

                        Comment

                        • #172
                          woops. double posted
                          Last edited by TropicalStorm; Apr. 12, 2008, 05:43 PM.
                          In my opinion, a horse is the animal to have. 1300 pounds of raw muscle, power, grace, and sweat between your legs - it's something you just can't get from a pet hamster.

                          Comment

                          • #173
                            Here is something I've never seen before. He seems to have something for everyone!

                            http://www.gypsyhorsesource.com/uk14/dudley.htm
                            Kathy Johnson

                            Comment

                            • #174
                              Originally posted by Kathy Johnson View Post
                              Here is something I've never seen before. He seems to have something for everyone!

                              http://www.gypsyhorsesource.com/uk14/dudley.htm

                              LOL, when I was shopping for a horse for my daughter, a friend gave me that link knowing how I love spots. He is so cute!

                              Comment

                              • #175
                                I've been following this thread with some interest, seeing as I just bought a draft x TB.

                                He is a little on the heavier side, but as a package, has what I would call a more TB-type body, on light draft-type legs and feet. TB neck, drafty head (well, you can't have EVERYTHING, can you?). I'll warn you, he's VERY unkempt looking and for those eagle eyes, he has a bad crack in that RH foot.

                                seen here: http://img.photobucket.com/albums/10...100_1804-1.jpg

                                I wish I had some actual conformation shots of him standing square...he presents a much nicer picture. In that photo, he looks small - in reality, he is a good 16.2+ and substantial. The following photo shows the amount of bone he has, but as opposed to the above, actually makes him look a bit stocky and VERY long backed (thank you, camera angle!). He still has winter hair on his legs, and is much leggier in person.

                                http://img.photobucket.com/albums/10...4/100_1810.jpg

                                I have no clue what sort of draft blood he has. I'm not naive enough to really think that he's going to be some great FEI dressage horse, but mostly because that is not and probably will never be my aspiration. My aspirations lie more in eventing, and as much as I do dearly love dressage, would be happy at 2nd/3rd level. I think he will make a nice prelim horse, if not more. Hell, maybe we'll even venture over to hunterland if he's got the knees for it!

                                He has great presence - but without the earth-shaking, heavy footed gaits and knee action you sometimes get with draft blood. He's a big, powerful, fancy mover. "Bold" is an excellent descriptor of his movement, but with a very low-key personality. If such a type existed, he would make a nice heavy hunter.

                                Carry on!

                                Comment

                                • #176
                                  I like your pink halter bearcombs.

                                  Comment

                                  • #177
                                    Ha! poor guy. I'm hoping I can bring him home tomorrow, and you can bet the pink halter won't last long. For one thing, it doesn't fit his big ol' head - the tie at the poll just barely tied - only the little metal tip on the rope sticks out of the knot.

                                    I was perusing Quillin's the other day, but didn't want to buy anything until I can measure his head.

                                    Comment

                                    • #178
                                      Originally posted by bearcombs View Post
                                      Ha! poor guy. I'm hoping I can bring him home tomorrow, and you can bet the pink halter won't last long. For one thing, it doesn't fit his big ol' head - the tie at the poll just barely tied - only the little metal tip on the rope sticks out of the knot.

                                      I was perusing Quillin's the other day, but didn't want to buy anything until I can measure his head.
                                      Buying new tack is fun My horse wears a large horse/WB size halter, but he's on the small side comparatively (16.3hh) and doesn't quite have the percheron head to body ratio.

                                      He's really cute! I think my horse would love eventing, unfortunately he bought himself a chicken rider who doesn't jump!

                                      Comment

                                      • #179
                                        well,,,

                                        I have 2 draft crosses now, shire cross mare, who does everything, novice eventing, will move up to training, training level dressage (just because I don't pursue it much), trail, foxhunting, h/j.

                                        She will be 9 this year, and her canter has been slow to develop. Her conf. is 'cross' heavy - if that makes sense. She is 16.1, and lighter in front, than behind.

                                        Not too sure how to post a picture, but she is soooo cool, everywhere I go, people try to buy her, seriously. I was in 2 h/j clinics this past winter, and both clinicians LOVED her.

                                        My second is a 4 y.o 3/4 TB, 1/4 Perch. Chestnut, big blaze - 2 high back socks, and very nice. Very different than my mare. We'll see, he's off to the trainer's now.

                                        I don't mean to be unkind, but this discussion strikes me as rather funny. The friends I have who ride only 'dressage' will NEVER get to upper levels of the sport no matter what horse they ride. Some diamonds in the rough (draft crosses, TB, WB, etc) will never amount to upper level horses because their riders cannot take them there.

                                        If you check out the eventing board with all the hula-baloo going on re safety, deaths, ULR, etc., the bulk of the sport is supported by lower level riders. Sure, we all aspire to be the best we can be, but the truth is that very few people, let alone horses are "conformationally, emotionally, financially, politically" correct to get there.

                                        My hat is off to any and all who get up off the couch, no matter your age, and give it a go. I don't care if you ride a stick horse, at least we are pursuing our passion, and to each his own!!! Happy trails, gina

                                        Comment

                                        • #180
                                          I'm still waiting for evidence of all the broken-down draft horses, unsung victims of dressage! The ones I know tend to be pretty sound, and dressage has only helped them. Why the unfounded speculation about drafts when there are horses already accepted in the dressage community with known soundness issues? Why do we let them slide, but then create problems where there are none?

                                          So far none of the doomsday prophecies surrounding draft horses have come true. They hold up as well as any other breed or type of horse. Their riders are having a blast, and everyone is happy. Good luck convincing them that they have made a mistake!

                                          Comment

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