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Price this horse...

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  • Price this horse...

    2000 16.3 hand chestnut TB Gelding. Never raced. USDF scores to 69% at 2nd level. Schooled to 3rd-changes willing but not confirmed. Great basic gaits and is easy to sit. Has always been sound but does have partial paralysis in his larynx that makes noise when he breathes but doesn't affect performance. Can be a difficult ride- tricky to get round and through and keep him there while keeping suppleness and a light feel. Can have an athletic spook but is not dangerous; doesn't buck or rear. Is athletic enough to go up the levels with the right rider.
    Where would you price this horse given the market?

  • #2
    With the scores around 69% - are they that high due to accuracy or movement?

    As in, is he a 7 mover? 8 mover?

    Lower end based on what I've seen advertised around here for that age, TB, that training, not necessarily a great mover or schoolmaster, but with potential, has been about $20k. Depending on movement, even with the breathing issue (assuming a vet oks him) if he gets matched with the correct rider could be a LOT higher.

    This is what I see *advertised* though, as opposed to what's selling - I don't know anyone buying or selling horses at that level of training, so don't know what anyone's paying.
    Originally posted by Silverbridge
    If you get anything on your Facebook feed about who is going to the Olympics in 2012 or guessing the outcome of Bush v Gore please start threads about those, too.

    Comment


    • #3
      I would say 5-10k, he has a lot of issues. For 20k plus you could get a horse without the issues.
      On the Internet, nobody knows you're a dog

      Comment

      • Original Poster

        #4
        Scores to 69% is with an amateur rider and a few bobbles during the tests. For instance... test going really well (8's on mediums... etc) then horse has a "moment" during a transition or something and gets a 3. 7 or 8 mover given the day and the warmup. Breathing was assessed when younger and didn't cause a problem when horse was doing eventing years ago.
        Judges have said horse is excellent quality and there is no reason FEI is not attainable.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Perfect Pony View Post
          I would say 5-10k, he has a lot of issues. For 20k plus you could get a horse without the issues.
          If the horse were advertised this way, he'd be listed at a lot more, I think:
          Beautiful and sensitive 16.3hh sport-bred TB gelding. 10/11 (depending on birthday) year old, showing 2nd level with an amateur scores up to 69%, schooling third level and starting with willing changes. Easy to sit, fantastic gaits with potential to continue advancing up the levels.
          I wouldn't expect an ad to mention a breathing sound which doesn't affect the horse's performance any more than I would expect an ad for Warum Nicht to mention floppy ears.
          Originally posted by Silverbridge
          If you get anything on your Facebook feed about who is going to the Olympics in 2012 or guessing the outcome of Bush v Gore please start threads about those, too.

          Comment


          • #6
            If he was a 6 yo at 2nd, I'd say 8-12k, but as an 11 yo it makes me wonder what his real potential is. Even if he's physically able to do upper level work, is he such a tense horse that he won't be able to relax (hint: "tricky to get round and through"). So if we're looking at a tense 11 yo who doesn't like to go on the bit and is spooky -- that does eliminate the schoolmaster option for a beginning rider, I'd say 5 -7 k max, with the 2nd level scores being the saving grace, and you gottta be lucky to find JUST the right person for him. Also, the breathing issue might be ok for dressage only, but can he go out for a gallop? That would drop the price again.
            "Reite dein Pferd vorwärts und richte es gerade.” Gustav Steinbrecht

            Comment

            • Original Poster

              #7
              Insideleg2outsiderein: Him being 11 and only 2nd/3rd is a function of him being owned by a young amateur that was learning as he was learning and not any reflection on his capability. He has since been leased by an older amateur and while his spookiness was calmed down he is now significantly harder to get round (though from what I hear it is not really due to him being tense per se either). He did event to Training in the past but only that far due to his jumping form and not his breathing issue.

              Ad does sound similar to what was posted above by the other poster with no mention of breathing issue and wording such as "looking for a quiet, confident rider".

              Would $10-15k be the right ballpark?

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by n2dressage View Post
                Judges have said horse is excellent quality and there is no reason FEI is not attainable.
                The problem is, you can find really nice 4-7 year old horses showing at first level that are well bred WBs, 7-8 movers, scoring high or winning at 1st level, that don't have breathing or tension or "spooky" issues in the 20-30k range that would be a much better investment for someone truly looking to go up the levels.

                People just don't buy the OPs type of horse to move up the levels with, you have to find someone who wants to stick with 2nd level on a quirky horse, and maybe move up to third, and they are going to pay significantly less than 15-20k. Unless you get really really lucky and find someone that just has to have him. I would prepare to sell for less than 10k and be happy to find him a good home. Unless of course he is really spectacular. To really assess people need to see the horse.
                On the Internet, nobody knows you're a dog

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by n2dressage View Post
                  Insideleg2outsiderein: Him being 11 and only 2nd/3rd is a function of him being owned by a young amateur that was learning as he was learning and not any reflection on his capability. He has since been leased by an older amateur and while his spookiness was calmed down he is now significantly harder to get round (though from what I hear it is not really due to him being tense per se either). He did event to Training in the past but only that far due to his jumping form and not his breathing issue.

                  Ad does sound similar to what was posted above by the other poster with no mention of breathing issue and wording such as "looking for a quiet, confident rider".

                  Would $10-15k be the right ballpark?
                  That is where I would price him if he was mine. However, I would also keep in mind that this is potentially a more difficult horse to sell do to rideability and possible vet issues (breathing). If a great rider came along that was a match I would seriously consider just about anything they offered.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I'm always shocked how low people on BBs price horses. I can't figure out if these posters just won't spend more than a few thousand on any horse or if they have an knack for finding bargains that I lack.

                    Without the breathing issue, I would say $15-20k. (On the east coast. Location is always a factor.)

                    I'm not sure how the breathing issue should affect price. For me personally as a buyer, no discount in price would convince me to take such a horse. Other buyers will have no objection.

                    Comment

                    • Original Poster

                      #11
                      Originally posted by Perfect Pony View Post
                      To really assess people need to see the horse.
                      There is a video... I just don't want this thread to turn taboo and be locked by the mods.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by InsideLeg2OutsideRein View Post
                        5 -7 k max
                        This is what I thought too.
                        I LOVE my Chickens!

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by mjrtango93 View Post
                          If a great rider came along that was a match I would seriously consider just about anything they offered.
                          This is what I am thinking in this market. Sure, price him at 10-15k, but I would be more concerned with finding a great home for such a horse, and getting out from under the monthly expenses. I have been horse shopping pretty actively in the last year, the market is really bifurcated right now with the lower (less than 12k) and higher (over 25k) end moving (given a good deal and a nice horse) and a no-mans-land in between.
                          On the Internet, nobody knows you're a dog

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by n2dressage View Post
                            There is a video... I just don't want this thread to turn taboo and be locked by the mods.
                            Could you pm me the link to the video? I'd love to see.
                            "Reite dein Pferd vorwärts und richte es gerade.” Gustav Steinbrecht

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Perfect Pony View Post
                              I would say 5-10k, he has a lot of issues. For 20k plus you could get a horse without the issues.
                              agree, altho i was going to say 10k

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                I'd happily pay 10-15k for that. your clientele will need to be someone with talent on a budget.
                                5-7k... really people?
                                www.destinationconsensusequus.com
                                chaque pas est fait ensemble

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  This is so hard to say without seeing him move and hearing the breathing. I know you said it doesn't affect performance, but there are lots of people out there who will rule him out based on it, regardless. I probably would, after seeing a person struggle with a horse that the vet in the PPE said wouldn't have performance affected. Boy was that wrong in the long-run.

                                  The TB and age factors are also going to hit the price. Also chestnut isn't the best color to sell, unless he has lots of bling.

                                  But maybe the movement makes up for it--I have no idea. There is really no way to give a true answer without video.

                                  In our area, based on the info provided, I would list around $7,500-$10,000.
                                  DIY Journey of Remodeling the Farmette: http://weownblackacre.blogspot.com/

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    yeah, for me it isnt breathing, or color or breed - it is the "needs sensitive rider" "tends be a challenge to get round" etc.

                                    *that* will be a hard sell.

                                    why would someone buy an older, non school master that is "tricky" for the same price they could get a nice young, non tricky horse?

                                    maybe he is fab, and if that is the case - then sure ask more.... but......

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      hard sell, less than $6000

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        You guys are on crack!

                                        Originally posted by mickeydoodle View Post
                                        hard sell, less than $6000
                                        With 2nd level scores of 69%, there is no way this horse is worth less than $20K, UNLESS he won't vet.

                                        The breathing issue is really only a problem in upper-level eventing. The surgery is no big deal if he needs it, but in dressage, it is highly unlikely.

                                        If the horse is sound (except for the wind) he should NOT be sold for under $20K. Otherwise, get him jumping and sell him as a lower-level event horse who will win the dressage, then he'd be worth $30K !!!
                                        \"I refuse to engage in a battle of wits with someone who is unarmed.\"--Pogo

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