• Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.

Announcement

Collapse

Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.

Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 1/26/16)
See more
See less

Canadians? Did you get your facial?

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Canadians? Did you get your facial?

    I'm asking because on RD's world there was a cheery post about how nice it was that Dressage Canada gave all the WEG riders...which is great...and all the chefs, vets and TECHNICAL ADVISERS spa packages at their hotels in Kentucky.

    SPA PACKAGES.

    Don't bother to look for that part of the post, but Google Cache is a wonderful thing....

    Guess who paid for all of this?

    You and I.

    Now, please tell me...When was the last time Dressage Canada did anything for you, the AA? (And, I stress the AA part...) The last time there was a clinic held for you to watch or ride in nearby? A symposium? A learning opportunity? So, where ARE those levy dollars going?

    I wish our team the best, but I sure think it is time that we started stanidng up on our hind legs and asking some tough questions of DC.

    Cinder

  • #2
    Just curious...How much are these packages worth? Which company? Are these sponsored or some sort? (I'm Canadian so I'm entitled to know!!!)
    ~ Enjoying some guac and boxed wine at the Blue Saddle inn. ~

    Originally posted by LauraKY
    I'm sorry, but this has "eau de hoarder" smell all over it.
    HORSING mobile training app

    Comment


    • #3
      Another Canadian here. I don't know who paid, but quite often with large block bookings hotels will throw those packages in.

      Comment

      • Original Poster

        #4
        Bronte, that could certainly be true. If it were, and it was just a "bonus" then why did the information suddenly disappear off of the other site?

        It may seem that I don't trust what DC does with its Members money.

        I don't.

        I also think that DC members should be asking for an accountng of how much it cost us to send our Dressage team to WEG, as opposed to how much it cost to send, perhaps, our jumping team, endurance team, whatever team?

        I'd like to see those numbers when they all roll in.

        I'm not holding my breath.

        Cinder

        Comment


        • #5
          Oh boy. Who knows what is going on at DC?? It seems like quite the scenario. They are always talking about these programs that they have and how money will go to support up and coming talent. They talk about (and we read about it in Horse Sport magazine ect) the "talent search" that went on earlier this year where RD did some clinics. They make it sound like those who were talented enough would be identified and supported. However, the reality is that each rider paid close to 1500$ for the two day clinic and all of the riders were given the same advice "get out of Canada and go train with an Olympian". At your own cost.

          All of the riders that did so paid out of their own pockets as I know there were multiple fundraisers going on here for one member who made the WEG team as well as others who went to florida and Cali to train. DC didn't pay for a cent.

          Don't get me wrong, I think RD is doing a super job as coach, no doubt about it. I am so excited for the riders and for our country. But I don't think DC has any interest in developing programs or supporting our future talent.
          www.svhanoverians.com

          "Simple: Breeding,Training, Riding". Wolfram Wittig.

          Comment


          • #6
            Robert's Cdn team contract not renewed for 2011

            It was just announced that Robert Dover will no longer be the Technical advisor for the Canadian Team, so who knows what the strategy will be for the Pan Ams and 2012.

            I thought he did an incredible job and I'm sorry to see him go.

            http://www.barnmice.com/group/horsej...t-returning-as

            Comment


            • #7
              he's gone? thats a good thing. I am tired of reading about his italian sofa shopping trips and how his "little canadian riders" try so hard but obviously aren't up to his exalted standards. And its a shame because I know some of the riders did enjoy his teaching, but then he talks like that about them on his blog.

              I only fear what might replace him.
              "The Threat of Internet Ignorance: ... we are witnessing the rise of an age of equestrian disinformation, one where a trusting public can graze on nonsense packaged to look like fact."-LRG-AF

              Comment


              • #8
                Definitly did not receive my facial.
                Fillys By Vibank - 2017 Road to RRP
                https://www.youtube.com/user/jealoushe

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by CatOnLap View Post
                  he's gone? thats a good thing. I am tired of reading about his italian sofa shopping trips and how his "little canadian riders" try so hard but obviously aren't up to his exalted standards. And its a shame because I know some of the riders did enjoy his teaching, but then he talks like that about them on his blog.

                  I only fear what might replace him.
                  I got a totally different feeling from reading his blog? I felt his pride and admiration for the Canadians riding and efforts.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I wrote this on the Off Course thread but thought I would also add it here...

                    My Dear Canadian Friends,

                    Below is the official statement prepared and agreed upon between Equine Canada and myself. regarding the future I would only like to add that it has been an enormous pleasure and honour working with and for you all!
                    That RD felt the need to put this comment in front of the "official" statement is interesting, don't you think?

                    I agree with CatonLap that our riders were well on their way with their current coaches long before and will do well long after.

                    As to how much the raise was that was requested? Have a quick look at what is mentioned here...
                    There are currently efforts underway to maintain Dover on a consultant basis, which is welcomed by riders given the forthcoming 2011 Pan American Games and 2012 Olympics.
                    Hmmm.....a good showing at WEG, which a lot of people will (mistakenly IMO), completely attribute to RD, a contract coming due for renegotiation, two World-class shows coming up in the next two years?

                    Do you really think he just asked for a cost of living raise when so much is at stake in the near future?

                    And now we are looking at paying him as a Consultant?

                    If Mr. Dover didn't care to take the position at what EC felt it could offer, (and IMO they've known that he was unlikely to take their offer for quite some time...), then I for one suggest that EC gets off its collective ass and find the best full-time coach it can for the money we have available.

                    None of this Consultant stuff.

                    Our Team deserves a coach that is focused and engaged with them, not taking them on as a side project.

                    Just my opnion, as always.

                    NJR
                    Your beliefs don't make you a better person, your behaviour does.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      he's gone? thats a good thing. I am tired of reading about his italian sofa shopping trips and how his "little canadian riders" try so hard but obviously aren't up to his exalted standards. And its a shame because I know some of the riders did enjoy his teaching, but then he talks like that about them on his blog

                      Who cares whether he is interesting or not. Or wether he rubs you the wrong way or not. His job was to promote dressage in Canada, to develope a vision ect as well at to develope our best riders for international competitions. He did that very , very well.

                      Dressage Canada seems to care nothing for our sport. They FINALLY decided to hire someone but only because they had to in order to get their hands on that Own The Podium money. Of course, now that they have it, it's just back to square one where we all pay them fee's and they do shit all for us and for our sport.
                      www.svhanoverians.com

                      "Simple: Breeding,Training, Riding". Wolfram Wittig.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Dressage Canada seems to care nothing for our sport. They FINALLY decided to hire someone but only because they had to in order to get their hands on that Own The Podium money. Of course, now that they have it, it's just back to square one where we all pay them fee's and they do shit all for us and for our sport.
                        I think it may be EC you mean, but if DC also fits the bill...

                        I'm also getting a bit tired of asking..."What have you done for me lately?"

                        I swear I get more e-mails asking for money from our Fearless Leader than I do from our gov't politicians.

                        I'd still love an accounting to be made available to the members of how much it cost each team to go to WEG.

                        The accounting dept. doesn't even have to break it down for us.

                        Just give us general numbers for each team, ie: Dressage, Jumpers, Eventer. Basic expenses like Transportation = $ Hotels = $ etc. Let's actually see some of that "transparency" we always hear about...

                        WHile I'm at it, does anyone else shudder when they hear the word "Consultant"? In my experience, a Consultant is someone who gets paid twice as much as a regular employee.

                        We don't need a consultant. We need a Coach.

                        NJR
                        Your beliefs don't make you a better person, your behaviour does.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          We don't need a consultant. We need a Coach.
                          Ditto

                          I only fear what might replace him.
                          Double Ditto

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            If indeed, as Canadian dressage riders, we represent 3 different schools that are so different and so at odds that they shall never talk to each other, then not even the exalted RD could've brought it together. But that is a silly thing to imagine. RD came upon the scene with a team of really great, motivated and well supported riders. He was fortunate. And yes, the blogspots he wrote sometimes, which he has since edited, I might point out, were dismissive of the riders' talents and the quality of their horses. He was simply not committed in heart to being a Canadian team coach.

                            Indeed, most of the riders on the current Team have made a real effort to get along and help each other, and yes, they did 99% of it without the RD. Doubtless they would've done as well with any other competent coach.

                            Now, where I come from, consultants are very highly paid. Are we going to be paying this *unmentionable/unprintable* person MORE for doing LESS?
                            "The Threat of Internet Ignorance: ... we are witnessing the rise of an age of equestrian disinformation, one where a trusting public can graze on nonsense packaged to look like fact."-LRG-AF

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              If EC is planning to go the Consultant route, why is it that it has to be RD?

                              If indeed, EC is planning on going the Consultant route, then in the name of getting the BEST possible person for the job, EC should Tender that Consultant position out to anyone who might fill the bill, just as any company would do.

                              I'd be willing to bet that there are many Big Names in the Dressage world who, though unable to commit to be a full-time Coach for the Canadian Team, would be thrilled to act as a Consultant and could bring incredible amounts of International experience, insight and contacts to the Canadian Team.

                              EC needs to put on its Big Girl and Boy Panties, say "Thanks for the Memories", to RD and Tender the Contract of Consultant like a REAL Board of Directors would for any other large national entity.

                              Maybe RD will be the correct choice in the end, but for Pete's sake don't just hand it to him without investigating the alternatives.

                              Oh, you say....We're running out of time, we have to do something quickly!!!! The sky is falling, the sky is falling!!??

                              You honestly didn't see this coming a year ago?

                              NJR
                              Your beliefs don't make you a better person, your behaviour does.

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Like I said, DC hired an advisor/coach because that is what was required in order to recieve the Own the Podium cash (I believe it was 350,000.00). Now that they have it they have no desire to hire anyone. Canadian Eventing and Show Jumping have had functional and competant advisors/coaches for years and years now. They actually seem to function well and as a result do well on the world stage.

                                Unfortunately Canadian dressage riders don't get anything from Dressage Canada. We pay them a levy fee at every single show that is EC sanctioned and yet there is nothing to show for it. What is their purpose? Does anyone even know? Does anyone here have any idea where that money even goes??

                                I think life would be better without them, and while it did appear for a while that the sport was going in the right direction, yet again it becomes blatantly obvious that if our riders what to get anywhere in international sport they are going to have to go at it alone.

                                So to me this isn't really even about RD. It's just another reminder of the complete uselessness of DC.
                                www.svhanoverians.com

                                "Simple: Breeding,Training, Riding". Wolfram Wittig.

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Originally posted by Donella View Post
                                  Like I said, DC hired an advisor/coach because that is what was required in order to recieve the Own the Podium cash (I believe it was 350,000.00). Now that they have it they have no desire to hire anyone. Canadian Eventing and Show Jumping have had functional and competant advisors/coaches for years and years now. They actually seem to function well and as a result do well on the world stage.
                                  I think perhaps you are being a little inaccurate here. DC tried very hard to come to an agreement with RD to continue his role with Canada's dressage team. But he did ask for a LOT more money, and Own The Podium has very distinct rules about how the money they give can be used, and there is a salary cap for coach/adviser. DC cannot simply keep the $ for it's own purposes! But if there isn't enough in the pot to pay the coach/adviser his requested salary, there is not much DC can do about it except look for another qualified individual to fill the role within the budget. Please keep in mind that these are OTP's rules, not DC's. Every cent that DC gets from OTP has to be spent and accounted for as indicated in the funding request and within certain categories as described in the OTP funding documents.

                                  I won't comment on what DC has done for you lately, because I also have some issues about how the levy $ is being spent and where the domestic programs are and what DC is doing to support and grow the sport at the local levels.

                                  But I do know (because I used to be part of the process!) that the OTP money is very strictly controlled by OTP (not DC!!!).

                                  Robert Dover made a very large contribution to Canadian dressage, without a doubt, but Dressage Canada IS financially strapped (mainly due to the fact that it relies almost entirely on government funding), and surrounded by regulatory process (as it should be if the $ comes from tax payers, which is DOES!). If they couldn't come up with the money that RD felt he needed to continue in his role, then the inevitable would have to happen. Many people feel that Robert's contribution was extremely valuable, and there were huge efforts to try to find the $ to keep him on. I believe that we will lose more than you can imagine by our inability to retain his services. And I know that many on the Board and within the committees (to say nothing of the riders) feel the same way. Even the people at OTP are disappointed, since I believe that they also feel that a coach/adviser of Robert's caliber is essential if we are to become a strong force on the international stage.

                                  To solve the problem, DC needs new blood on the Board and in Committees, and needs people who can bring funding sources (private!!!) to the table. If you really want to try to change things, you must get involved, you must be prepared to slog through many documents that explain the funding process, and you MUST be prepared to stand up for your convictions - otherwise the same old-same old will always happen.

                                  I volunteered with DC in a variety of roles over the last 10 years, and finally resigned earlier this year, due mainly to family and work commitments, but also a little bit to the hidebound (lack of) policies and procedures, and the shortsightedness of the Board. One of the biggest problems (in my experience) is that the Board does not always bring a business viewpoint to the table, relying instead on emotional reaction and the old "we've always done it this way" attitude. There is also, sometimes, a lack of transparency at the Board level, and that can only be addressed by people who are willing and able to take a stand, fight for what they believe is right and get information into the public domain, so that the greater dressage community will understand the issues.

                                  Zero budget forecasting, financial management, communications, long term planning, personnel management (including things like job descriptions, contractual agreements which include performance metrics) and the relationship DC has with EC are issues that the Board seems reluctant to address, and are failures that impede, in my opinion, the Board's ability to actually get things done, move forward with confidence and foster the growth of the sport.

                                  So if you believe in some of those things, maybe you should get out and volunteer! The biggest problem DC has is that only a handful of people are actually prepared to do the work that needs to be done! Trying to fill committees is a nightmare - lots of people take the attitude that "someone else will do it", when in fact, no-one else IS doing it ...

                                  If you have an interest in the role of the coach/adviser, then call up the Chair of High Performance and volunteer to be a member of the committee! If you want things to happen in Domestic Development, call up the Chair of Domestic Development and volunteer. Then you can have your say and present your ideas and monitor the goings-on at DC!!!!

                                  Maybe if more people asked what THEY can do for DC instead of what DC has done for them, DC would be a more functional, progressive and enlightened sport governing body.

                                  Not sure that posting this is the right thing to do. But if even one person volunteers, it will help :-)

                                  Liz
                                  Liz Steacie
                                  Porcupine Hill Dressage
                                  Maitland, Ontario

                                  http://www.porcupinehill.com

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    Ms. Steazie...it is always so nice to see such a recognizable name in Canadian dressage come on to CotH and speak in such a down to earth manner about the problems in our sport from someone who has actually BTDT at the higher levels of both competiton and administration. This shows real Class, in my books!

                                    It also shows that you care so deeply about Dressage in Canada that you are willing to say some perhaps uncomfortable things in public about the direction that we are going.

                                    You must have much more fortitude than I! Even my years of volunteering at just regional/provincial level showed me that I don't have the stomach for the politics and answers of "But that's just the way it's DONE...".

                                    The stone-walling, the outdated thinking and the cliques... I don't know the answer and although I tried, I was not able to be part of the solution, so like many I've spoken to, I stepped back and become less and less involved. In return, it seems that I've recieved less and less for my $'s. I'm now at the point where I don;t show at all and am actually thinking of taking up reining!

                                    They do say that a people get the gov't they deserve, so perhaps that is what the dressage community in Canada has?

                                    Generally concerning the coaching and Team issues....

                                    The fact that Mr. Dover and EC weren't able to come to an agreement, and I'm sure that they both knew what EC's bottom line was quite some time ago, tells me that RD believes he is worth more than we could pay him. Fair enough.

                                    But then to talk about taking him on as a Consultant and, (very likely), paying him the same amount for less time spent with our team, is no incentive for him to come to an agreement is it?

                                    He is well aware that the Canadian Team is in a tough spot going into a very important next two years. He's a businessman. It's time EC began to act as if it were a business as well, and not be held hostage because of a deadline they knew was coming.

                                    In any other large business they would have already begun to look at other options as soon as they had any hint that this re-negotiation wasn't going to go well.

                                    Mr. Dover is a charming, well-known, extremely good coach for our team.

                                    Sadly, we can't afford him. Get over it.

                                    EC needs to find a full-time coach we can afford. NOW.

                                    Or Tender the postion of Consultant. NOW.

                                    On another note, perhaps someone might comment on this for me:
                                    Even the people at OTP are disappointed, since I believe that they also feel that a coach/adviser of Robert's caliber is essential if we are to become a strong force on the international stage.
                                    Given that the average dressage rider in Canada likely doesn't make it past the lower levels, yet pays 95% of the freight, why do we pay so much for us to HAVE a strong force on an Int'l stage and seemingly so LITTLE given back to those riders who are paying for it?

                                    I can tell you without a doubt that the last clinic we had in my area that we had financial help with from our Associations (ANY of them!) was over 5 years ago.

                                    Is it that important to the 95% that we pay for the 5% to show internationally? Perhaps it's time to change our focus?

                                    Thanks again, NJR
                                    Your beliefs don't make you a better person, your behaviour does.

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      My opinion for what it's worth

                                      Spa packages: I hope the grooms got them. Riders...okay. Chefs, consultants and vets. Nope. Sorry.

                                      Robert Dover: I don't swim in those circles but I have to say I don't understand the negativity about him. Maybe he rubs people the wrong way on a personal level, I have never met him and I don't read his blog. But he sure seems to have delivered hasn't he? Ashley Holzer probably would have done as well without him. I'm not sure you can say the same as the others.

                                      It is not just the WEG performance but the whole season before, Canadian riders got int'l scores of the likes we have not seen for a long time (except for Ashley).

                                      They now have cred. Maybe he got them to the right places and gave them cred? I don't know. If you believe what the riders have publicly stated they benefited from the coaching, not just the PR.

                                      So, anti RD's...enlighten me. Why the RD negativity? If it just his personal style that bugs you? Do you know something the riders don't (or won't say)?

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        Originally posted by Nojacketrequired View Post
                                        On another note, perhaps someone might comment on this for me:

                                        (OTP seeming disapointed that we were not able to retain Robert)

                                        Given that the average dressage rider in Canada likely doesn't make it past the lower levels, yet pays 95% of the freight, why do we pay so much for us to HAVE a strong force on an Int'l stage and seemingly so LITTLE given back to those riders who are paying for it?

                                        Thanks again, NJR
                                        Remember that OTP stands for "Own The Podium". Their mandate and concern is ONLY with international standing, rankings, and, ultimately, medals. They have no concern whatsoever for the recreational rider, the grass roots or local and national showings. Except in the belief that strength at the top will inspire and motivate.

                                        I am not sure how you calculate that the a lower level rider "pays 95% of the freight" in dressage. Entry fees are higher at the upper levels (ie: $45 for Training Level, $200 for the Grand Prix), upper level riders also have to pay stabling, transportation, the levy, the FEI drug test fee at $40 instead of $7, all the same memberships (although the Platinum membership is WAY more expensive than a Silver or Bronze) plus FEI registration fees annually, passports for FEI horses are over $300, as opposed to $78, CDI competitions generally run 3-5 days, with all the additional expense, team hopefuls are often encouraged to attend high profile (read: expensive) clinics with either the Team coach or another BNT (ie: the last clinic I was invited to would have cost me over $300/lesson). The previous Team coach, even with slightly subsidized clinic fees cost over $200 a lesson. So, if you would, explain to me where a lower level rider is "paying" for the international strength?

                                        If you mean that our funding from Sport Canada seems to be devoted in the most part to High Performance, then I urge you again to read the funding documents. Funds are paid out to sports governing bodies BASED on results at international competitions and major games. If we don't have strong international results, we get NO funding, and believe me, the funds generated by memberships (much of which pays for the administrative costs at EC - again, if you read the budget materials made available to all EC members, you would see exactly how much of the money is eaten up in the EC office - did you think our delegation got to Taipei on their own ticket???) won't pay for much.

                                        So I really do fail to see where your argument has validity. You are not paying the freight - in some ways you are getting quite a bit for your membership fees and the levy (you could be getting more if there were better fiscal policies and more productive planning in place). But the cost to campaign at the international level is astonishing, and mostly riders and their owners pay for 90% of the costs if not more. The "Team" or High Performance pays for things like shipping to major games (sometimes), and sometimes costs associated with major games, but really, not much else. Riders and owners of international horses mostly pay their own way. In the years I was a listed rider, I don't recall any handouts :-). The OTP funding is unbelievably generous, in that it has paid for one year of a coach! And part of the costs of the European tour for 6 of the WEG declared horse and rider combinations. Those combinations had enormous expenses that were NOT covered, each ended up paying something around $40K over and above the funding from OTP.

                                        Mostly members pay their annual memberships, sometimes the levy (if they show) and make perhaps some donations to the Team. So where are you "paying the freight"? Sorry, I don't mean to sound critical, but I would really like to know what it is that you think you are paying for, and what you expect to get in return.

                                        I agree that there is a need for more programs and opportunities for riders at the lower levels to advance and learn. But honestly, would you participate if the opportunities were there? Would you pay a (subsidized) fee of even $50 a lesson to train with a high profile coach in a program brought to you by DC? What do YOU want to see in terms of "more" from DC? How can we "give back"? Do you expect FEI riders to give free clinics? After they already pay more for everything? Seriously, I am very interested, because I know that when I was Chair of Domestic Development, we would put programs in place and then not have any participants. Now it is possible that we just put in place the wrong programs, but I know that a symposium (and everybody loves those, right?) had to be canceled for lack of participation. And where are the auditors at big time clinics?

                                        So seriously, tell me what you expect as a member of DC. I will guarantee you if you do, I will get that information to members of the DC Board, and to the chairs of committees. But please don't claim that you are paying for the FEI and high performance riders! I haven't received a cent from DC or EC in over 10 years of riding at that level - nobody paid my way! And if I got some small subsidy on my lessons with the TEAM COACH, I still had to pay quite a bit myself! Mostly what you are paying for is administration costs at EC. And I am not even going to go there. Read the budgets, look at what EC does, and then decide what you are paying for.

                                        So, let's hear it!

                                        Liz
                                        Liz Steacie
                                        Porcupine Hill Dressage
                                        Maitland, Ontario

                                        http://www.porcupinehill.com

                                        Comment

                                        Working...
                                        X