Stallion Spotlight

BushyGeneology copy

Real Estate Spotlight

untitled (115 of 123)-Edit
  • Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.

Announcement

Collapse

Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You�re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the Forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it�details of personal disputes may be better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts, though are not legally obligated to do so, regardless of content.

Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting. Moderators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts unless they have been alerted and have determined that a post, thread or user has violated the Forums� policies. Moderators do not regularly independently monitor the Forums for such violations.

Profanity, outright vulgarity, blatant personal insults or otherwise inappropriate statements will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

Users may provide their positive or negative experiences with or opinions of companies, products, individuals, etc.; however, accounts involving allegations of criminal behavior against named individuals or companies MUST be first-hand accounts and may NOT be made anonymously.

If a situation has been reported upon by a reputable news source or addressed by law enforcement or the legal system it is open for discussion, but if an individual wants to make their own claims of criminal behavior against a named party in the course of that discussion, they too must identify themselves by first and last name and the account must be first-person.

Criminal allegations that do not satisfy these requirements, when brought to our attention, may be removed pending satisfaction of these criteria, and we reserve the right to err on the side of caution when making these determinations.

Credible threats of suicide will be reported to the police along with identifying user information at our disposal, in addition to referring the user to suicide helpline resources such as 1-800-SUICIDE or 1-800-273-TALK.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it�s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users� profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses � Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it�s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who�s selling it, it doesn�t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions � Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services � Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products � While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements � Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be �bumped� excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues � Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators� discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the �alert� button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your �Ignore� list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you�d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user�s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 5/9/18)
See more
See less

Difference Wintec Isabell vs Bates Isabell for the horse?

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Difference Wintec Isabell vs Bates Isabell for the horse?

    What would be the difference for the horse between these two saddles?

    Does anyone know whether the channel/gullet on the Bates might be wider vs the Wintec?

    Thank you

  • #2
    It's my understanding (at least it used to be this way) that the difference is in the materials. The Wintec Isabell doesn't typically have wool flocking (it is synthetic that can't be flocked), but the bates does (with/without CAIR panels). The Wintec has synthetic leather, the Bates has real leather. Technically, the Bates is the leather version of the Wintec and that's it.

    They changed the model specs through the years. I had an older Wintec Isabell many years ago and loved loved loved it. I sold it, and my next saddle fitter mentioned the changes in the model since my old model - wider twist and larger seat and wider panels. So the difference might be more dependent on the year made rather than the Wintec versus Bates differences.
    Proud member of the Colbert Dressage Nation

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by J-Lu View Post
      It's my understanding (at least it used to be this way) that the difference is in the materials. The Wintec Isabell doesn't typically have wool flocking (it is synthetic that can't be flocked), but the bates does (with/without CAIR panels). The Wintec has synthetic leather, the Bates has real leather. Technically, the Bates is the leather version of the Wintec and that's it.

      They changed the model specs through the years. I had an older Wintec Isabell many years ago and loved loved loved it. I sold it, and my next saddle fitter mentioned the changes in the model since my old model - wider twist and larger seat and wider panels. So the difference might be more dependent on the year made rather than the Wintec versus Bates differences.
      At least at one point, it was possible to get a wool flocked Wintec Isabell. I know this for a fact, as I have one. I bought it as a sort of utility saddle that could be adjusted to fit new horses, those with changing backs etc. It is pre-CAIR and so it's just the gullet plate that can be changed, but I've found it a useful and surprisingly comfortable saddle, which is why I've kept it all this time.
      **********
      We move pretty fast for some rabid garden snails.
      -PaulaEdwina

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Lucassb View Post

        At least at one point, it was possible to get a wool flocked Wintec Isabell. I know this for a fact, as I have one. I bought it as a sort of utility saddle that could be adjusted to fit new horses, those with changing backs etc. It is pre-CAIR and so it's just the gullet plate that can be changed, but I've found it a useful and surprisingly comfortable saddle, which is why I've kept it all this time.
        I've never had a Bates so cannot comment on that other than to say my understanding is the same as the poster above - it was just the materials that were different. I'd expect them to feel quite similar to the horse.
        **********
        We move pretty fast for some rabid garden snails.
        -PaulaEdwina

        Comment

        • Original Poster

          #5
          Thank you.
          I'm not sure what to do. I have a horse I had in both a Custom Advantage Mono and Icon Flight. He developed really bad granulomas, we had to inject.
          Used 2 different saddlefitters who told me the saddles fitted and did not know why this happened.

          One fitter suggested I tried CAIR. I didn't want to go all out on a Bates without selling at the least the Advantage, so I bought a Wintec Isabell CAIR. Against my expectations, this saddle turned out to be very stable on his back and very comfortable for me to ride in. And no more additional granulomas 2 months+ into the Wintec.

          Now I really don't know what to do, try to have the Custom refitted once more (seems like a stupid idea), just stay with the Wintec and take a break of saddlefit woes or buy a Bates Isabell.
          The reason I'm considering the Bates, would only be if it were to be better for the horse, myself I'm pretty okay in this grippy Wintec. I do feel to my eye the channel on those Wintec is rather narrow when you compare that to other saddles, especially the Customs hence I wondered if the Bates makes sense.

          And of course I also worry about the CAIR, so many negative reviews about that, but again surprisingly enough the horse is a lot happier in it and the stability is perfect, no slipping, no uneven feel.

          Comment


          • #6
            Can you do a saddle trial with the Bates through any of the major retailers? Quite a few offer that service (SmartPak, Dover, VTO, etc.).

            I’ve been quite happy with my CAIR saddles.
            Don't fall for a girl who fell for a horse just to be number two in her world... ~EFO

            Comment


            • #7
              I suggest staying with the Wintec if you like the feel. Alternatively, my saddle fitter said she removed many CAIR panels and reflocked with wool. You can ask your fitter about this. I think it is easier to remove those panels in the Bates saddle, but don't quote me-ask your fitter. You can also ask your fitter about the gullet. I've not found this to be a problem on multiple horses.

              With my old Wintec Isabell, I had the fit assessed by an Albion fitter, a County fitter and an independent fitter, all of whom said the fit was actually quite good for my horse. A good fitter will tell it like it is and answer your questions.

              Lucassb , thanks for that reminder. I think my old Wintec Isabell had wool in it now that I think about it, and my ancient but every saddle fitter says fits my horses great wintec jump saddle is also wool flocked. As I recall there is something about them that makes them a challenge to flock (neither have CAIR panels). I can't remember. I still own the jumping saddle and ride in it very occasionally.
              Proud member of the Colbert Dressage Nation

              Comment


              • #8
                Stick with the Wintec and CAIR. It's a magical combination. If you're dead set on having a leather saddle, see if you can get the Bates on trial.

                I would love to not ride in CAIR, but the horses I've used it on say otherwise. For the price you initially pay for the saddle, it's worth fixing, replacing, or buying new as needed.
                Ahhhh, spring is here. The birds are singing, the trees are budding and the paddocks are making their annual transformation from cake mix to cookie dough.

                Comment

                • Original Poster

                  #9
                  Thank you all.

                  Originally posted by sascha View Post
                  I would love to not ride in CAIR, but the horses I've used it on say otherwise.
                  That seems to be what I am having with this horse. CAIR doesn't make sense to me, but it doesn't cause more granulomas and it's more stable on his back, because I don't have that uneven stirrup length feeling I've been running into with all other saddles, that need repeated flocking/shimming which doesn't solve the issue. Strangely enough this Wintec only requires a thin square pad and all feels well.

                  No clue what longterm issues CAIR might bring along but in the short term I have used it, it has fixed many problems.

                  I'll see if I can trial a Bates thru SmartPak or Dover, to allow me to compare. For myself I don't care so much, if anything, I like the grippy suede. But kind of assumed a Bates had more advantages for the horse, but from what I read so far, seems there aren't really much difference for the horse.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I love the grippy suede, too! I've become a total Wintec convert. I was a little dismayed a few years ago when I rode in my trainer's Bates jump saddle; it wasn't anywhere near as comfortable as my similar model Wintec jump saddle. But I do think it's worth trying the Bates Isabell for the reasons you mentioned above, especially if you can do it for free/cheap through one of the retailers.
                    Don't fall for a girl who fell for a horse just to be number two in her world... ~EFO

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I had ridden in a Wintec and hated it. I rode in my trainers Bates and ended up buying my own. I like the seat, and the ability to change the gullet on a growing pony is a bonus.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I have the Wintec Isabell with Cair and I like the grippy seat’. When my horse gets bodywork done her back is never an issue’. She’s moved up to an extra wide so hopefully she doesn’t get wider and I have to switch to a different saddle’. I don’t want to fix what’s not broken at this pojnt

                        Comment

                        Working...
                        X