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Showing a horse you do not own... best way for paperwork?

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  • Showing a horse you do not own... best way for paperwork?

    I have the opportunity to possibly show a horse that is trained to 3rd level next year. I would be half-sharing with the owner. At the most, it would be a 2-3 shows next spring. Horse is currently a jumper, not shown at all in dressage currently. Owners are not USDF or USEF members. So non-member fees per show are $50. A 2 day show that is 2 shows would be $100.

    The lease paperwork is $80 for both assoc. The horse can get a HID for $20 from the USDF. I guess lease paperwork is the best way to go?

    If I lease a horse, can the owner show the horse in a a USEF rated show or does the lease mean only I can show horse? She goes to a few jumper shows, pays non-member fees.
    Thanks!
    "The sea was angry that day, my friends - like an old man trying to send back soup in a deli"

  • #2
    In your shoes, I'd have the owner become a USEF member and register the horse, also. That way, owner can avoid non-member fees for the times you show the horse in dressage, and I think you can pay an out-of-discipline fee instead of a non-member fee for the horse. Of course, you're still stuck with the rider non-member fee when you show, but maybe you'd go ahead and join anyway?

    I think that USEF wouldn't have an opinion one way or another about the lease. And anyway, you're showing a different discipline than the owner.
    In loving memory of Laura Jahnke.
    A life lived by example, done too soon.
    www.caringbridge.org/page/laurajahnke/

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    • Original Poster

      #3
      I am a member of both anyway so no non-member fees for me...it really make it prohibitive, doesn't it? The non member fees alone are not much less than the assoc memberships. I guess I was thinking if I lease, then the owner memberships are NA. I have not shown in a rated show in several years. I have always shown my own horse.
      My only purpose is to TRY to get the 2 scores I need to do the L program. I already have one plus all the scribing hours. The Program will be within driving distance next year, so worth a shot.
      "The sea was angry that day, my friends - like an old man trying to send back soup in a deli"

      Comment


      • #4
        Yes, but if the owner isn't a member, then you end up paying non-member fees for trainer, rider (both you, so only one fee) and owner. Unless the owner joins, you're going to be paying non-member fees for her.

        Also, you may want to check that the horse doesn't have to be lifetime registered with USDF to have your scores count for the "L" program. I know that, in order to compete in a USDF regional championship, the horse has to have been lifetime registered with USDF before the qualifying scores are earned, in order to compete. I'd be asking USDF to be sure your scores would count.
        In loving memory of Laura Jahnke.
        A life lived by example, done too soon.
        www.caringbridge.org/page/laurajahnke/

        Comment

        • Original Poster

          #5
          So if you lease a horse, the Owner still has to be a member? Don't see any point at all in a lease... I guess I will call and check.
          The USDF has a non-member HID like the USEF does, so that is fine. Don't need Lifetime reg unless qualifying for YE awards or Regionals.
          The whole thing is really a PITA....too bad my little guy is not a little older, would be cheaper/easier to train him to 2nd level than do all this! Ugh...
          Thanks!
          "The sea was angry that day, my friends - like an old man trying to send back soup in a deli"

          Comment


          • #6
            I think that if you were doing a formal, full lease, as registered with USEF, that you probably wouldn't have to pay non-member fees for the owner. But since you're sharing the horse with the owner, that rule doesn't apply. Sucks, I know.
            In loving memory of Laura Jahnke.
            A life lived by example, done too soon.
            www.caringbridge.org/page/laurajahnke/

            Comment


            • #7
              Assuming that you wouldn't have to pay non-member fees for the owner if you had a formal USEF lease, you would probably come out ahead with the lease. Not sure about the owner as she would get dinged for a rider non-member fee and then possibly a discipline owner fee if you aren't a HJ member. Not sure how that would work.

              Wonder if it's possible for two unrelated people to co-own a horse? You could change the horse's ownership to both of you (which, IIRC, is free if the horse only has a USEF ID) and then you could list yourself as owner when you show (and pay no fees) and she could list herself when she shows and pay what she would have paid before you entered the picture. You might have to come up with a bill of sale for that to work. I know that multiple owners are illegal in the AO hunters for good reason, but not sure about other areas.
              The Evil Chem Prof

              Comment


              • #8
                That's a very interesting suggestion, Peggy. Since there are no A/O divisions in dressage, I would imagine that co-ownership wouldn't be the problem that it is in the hunter ring. Definitely worth exploring.
                In loving memory of Laura Jahnke.
                A life lived by example, done too soon.
                www.caringbridge.org/page/laurajahnke/

                Comment


                • #9
                  I've done a lease before, where the owner had no intentions of showing. The lease fee was then $25. We did reg. the horse lifetime with USDF. If you renew your lease in writing each year before it expires, you pay nothing! Seemed the least expensive way to go. All I had to do was, keeping my memberships up.

                  (And the USEF doesn't care about the lease if the owner wants to show, as long as they get their non- member fees.)

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Discipline fees no longer apply for USEF.

                    If you do a formal lease, you must do it with both USEF and USDF, but then you become the person able to sign the owner blank as the owner, and no non-member fees apply since you are already a member of both. I don't think it matters whether it's a full or partial lease, as long as it is recorded with the associations.

                    Comment

                    • Original Poster

                      #11
                      Originally posted by yaya View Post
                      Discipline fees no longer apply for USEF.

                      If you do a formal lease, you must do it with both USEF and USDF, but then you become the person able to sign the owner blank as the owner, and no non-member fees apply since you are already a member of both. I don't think it matters whether it's a full or partial lease, as long as it is recorded with the associations.
                      Yup! Thanks. I did check with the USDF/USEF and this is true. So it does sound like a lease is the best way to go as far as being simple and not being dinged on fees at every show.
                      I will say I really like the Live Chat option on the USEF, easy to get questions answered and you have documentation of the transcript.
                      "The sea was angry that day, my friends - like an old man trying to send back soup in a deli"

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