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Andalusian Contact/Mouth issue about to lose my mind. Help!

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  • Original Poster

    #41
    I had not even thought about checking the bridle. So thank you for that suggestion.

    I am trying to figure out where within a reasonable distance I can find a professional to at least evaluate her. I have gone down the wrong road way too many times with other horses with physical issues and have only so many dollars and none to waste.

    At least my vet is honest that this is out of her skill set and offered to try and help me find someone to evaluate my mare.

    Comment


    • #42
      I have dealt with a couple of horses who were this way. The first was a mare who had been ridden by a timid rider who would hang on her mouth when she got scared. This mare was a doll, but if you touched her mouth she would go totally upside down. Big under neck, hollow on top. I took a month to teach her to work totally off my seat on a loose rein. We could walk, trot, canter, and turn with the buckle on her withers. I then started taking a very soft contact but not really using the bit, just being there. When she was OK with that I started using the bit a little, just playing with my fingers, always staying very light. She now easily goes round and through even with inexperienced students.

      I'm now training a young Friesian mare who will get round, soft, and connected in walk, but as soon as we'd trot and canter she'd go hollow. I longed her in side reins, running side reins adjusted low, and a chambon to no avail. It just didn't bother her to feel pressure when she was hollow - she was quite fine with it. Then I remembered the Trakehner mare. I taught this girl to work from my seat on a loose rein in only two rides, and now she's round and connected most of the time in trot and coming along in the canter. With her I don't need much leg at all - she's forward and sensitive and I was tending to over drive her - and light, soft contact. I can hold for an instant if she starts to get quik, but right back to light. She works almost entirely off my seat.

      Hope that helps!

      Comment

      • Original Poster

        #43
        Originally posted by Galloping Granny View Post
        I have dealt with a couple of horses who were this way. The first was a mare who had been ridden by a timid rider who would hang on her mouth when she got scared. This mare was a doll, but if you touched her mouth she would go totally upside down. Big under neck, hollow on top. I took a month to teach her to work totally off my seat on a loose rein. We could walk, trot, canter, and turn with the buckle on her withers. I then started taking a very soft contact but not really using the bit, just being there. When she was OK with that I started using the bit a little, just playing with my fingers, always staying very light. She now easily goes round and through even with inexperienced students.

        I'm now training a young Friesian mare who will get round, soft, and connected in walk, but as soon as we'd trot and canter she'd go hollow. I longed her in side reins, running side reins adjusted low, and a chambon to no avail. It just didn't bother her to feel pressure when she was hollow - she was quite fine with it. Then I remembered the Trakehner mare. I taught this girl to work from my seat on a loose rein in only two rides, and now she's round and connected most of the time in trot and coming along in the canter. With her I don't need much leg at all - she's forward and sensitive and I was tending to over drive her - and light, soft contact. I can hold for an instant if she starts to get quik, but right back to light. She works almost entirely off my seat.

        Hope that helps!
        Yes it does help because what you describe are things I feel I can manage myself. Right now my plan is to keep riding my mare out on trail rides as my farm backs up to a few thousand acres of state forest with trails and continue to work on conditioning her and raising her confidence and mine.

        In the meantime my regular vet is just going to take a look inside her mouth (do a teeth count, etc.) week after next and then she is going to try and help me find someone to evaluate my mares mouth and neck. My biggest concern at this point is finding a professional who can actually help evaluate the situation as I have either been taken or gone down the wrong road way too many times in trying to figure out a lameness or soreness issue with a horse.

        A friend who is a professional and rides FEI rode my mare yesterday and my mare did the same thing with her she does with me on the lunge and under saddle.

        I am sure if I can figure this out and get my mare some help with what appears to be some physical issues then I will have training issues to work with as well. Thanks so much for everyone's input.

        Comment


        • #44
          Originally posted by Baroquecoco View Post
          My biggest concern at this point is finding a professional who can actually help evaluate the situation as I have either been taken or gone down the wrong road way too many times in trying to figure out a lameness or soreness issue with a horse.
          May I ask where you are located? Is there a vet school nearby?

          Again, for the diagnostics (not necessarily the treatment), I would try to go to a vet school, or a large clinic.

          If you post your area, (I would start a new thread), you might be surprised what other COTHers can dig up.

          And maybe take a whole day or two for this...driving 5 hours one way with an overnight stay might be well worth it to find the issue -- then you can discuss treatment and find someone local.

          I just know (like you, I'm guessing), that many chiros & such (including vets & horse pros) have given me wrong info on issues. I was trying to save $$, but, in the end, it took me much longer and cost more $$ to sort it all out.

          I should have just bit the bullet and spent the $$ correctly in the first place!

          Of course, I also understand that many of us don't have an extra $1000-1500 just sitting around...

          Comment

          • Original Poster

            #45
            Ah, but so often the first thing you try that doesn't give you the answer leads to the second, then to the third and hopefully finally to the answer.

            Because of this process I can now short circuit the discovery process on issues such as wound infections that don't heal, shoulder injuries, when it is not a hock issue that needs to be injected, summer sores, muscle spasms caused by poke berry ingestion, navicular, fractured coffin bones, and on and on.

            Also thanks to a wonderful state vet in Virginia who has necropsied several of our old guys through many years I have a way better understanding of what really goes on inside a horses body. Although, of course, I am still learning.

            Seems that when it comes to horses and things that can happen to them there never is a direct line between two points to finding an answer.

            Comment


            • #46
              Originally posted by Baroquecoco View Post
              Ah, but so often the first thing you try that doesn't give you the answer

              Seems that when it comes to horses and things that can happen to them there never is a direct line between two points to finding an answer.
              Yes, but the first thing you need to do is find the problem. Rads of the jaw and an exam by a really good vet is not complicated....and vet schools are always on the cutting edge of new stuff -- they are not as likely to pooh-pooh stuff like the older vets might.

              So rads of the jaw will immediately rule out teeth issues. TMJ is not so rare in horses that it can't be diagnosed at a vet school or larger/better clinic.

              Then you can listen to their recommendations for treatment, talk to chiros/massage therapists, etc. Also DO try some of the jaw limbering exercises (they are very simple) and also investigate doing some massage and T-Touch yourself....these things will come in handy many times in the future.

              As a nurse, I know there is usually a systematic way medical conditions are diagnosed, and there is a reason for this. Does this system ALWAYS work -- nah....

              But usually/often it does.

              So start by ruling out the simple stuff -- and teeth/jaw abnormalities are simple to diagnose via xray.

              Comment


              • #47
                Originally posted by Baroquecoco View Post
                Y

                A friend who is a professional and rides FEI rode my mare yesterday and my mare did the same thing with her she does with me on the lunge and under saddle.

                I am sure if I can figure this out and get my mare some help with what appears to be some physical issues then I will have training issues to work with as well. Thanks so much for everyone's input.
                It certainly sounds like pain and I hope you find out what's bothering her soon as she sounds like a lovely and kind mare.
                Equine Ink - My soapbox for equestrian writings & reviews.
                EquestrianHow2 - Operating instructions for your horse.

                Comment

                • Original Poster

                  #48
                  Originally posted by Bogie View Post
                  It certainly sounds like pain and I hope you find out what's bothering her soon as she sounds like a lovely and kind mare.
                  Thank you for saying that.....see is both lovely and kind!

                  I have a couple of good leads on help for her. Thanks to everyone who PM'd me with suggestions of people they had worked with!

                  Comment


                  • #49
                    Originally posted by Baroquecoco View Post
                    I had not even thought about checking the bridle. So thank you for that suggestion.

                    I am trying to figure out where within a reasonable distance I can find a professional to at least evaluate her. I have gone down the wrong road way too many times with other horses with physical issues and have only so many dollars and none to waste.

                    At least my vet is honest that this is out of her skill set and offered to try and help me find someone to evaluate my mare.
                    page 1 on my helpful links pages previously posted 1st article
                    how to fit a bridle

                    Comment

                    • Original Poster

                      #50
                      [QUOTE=Kyzteke;5032920]Yes, but the first thing you need to do is find the problem. Rads of the jaw and an exam by a really good vet is not complicated....and vet schools are always on the cutting edge of new stuff -- they are not as likely to pooh-pooh stuff like the older vets might.

                      Ah, the really hard thing is finding the really good vet or rather the one with the experience to evaluate my horse. The second challenge will be finding one who has either a radiograph powerful enough to take useful films of the jaw or an MRI. Based on my, granted, small sample of only two vet schools I don't share the optimism for taking her to a vet school for evaluation or at least not to the two I have experience with.

                      I am only considering referrals from people who have actually used the vet or service for jaw, neck, poll issues. So far I have one good lead about five hours from here.

                      I truly don't mind spending the money to figure this out. I mind wasting it. If I had all of the money I have wasted chasing the wrong issue with a horse I could have every inch of this horse MRI'd, biopsied, etc and have her feet dipped in gold.

                      I am trying to be responsible and careful. So that when I find someone who can help I still have the money to pay them.

                      Comment


                      • #51
                        I am trying to be responsible and careful. So that when I find someone who can help I still have the money to pay them.
                        Last edited by BaroquePony; Aug. 14, 2010, 10:08 PM.

                        Comment

                        • Original Poster

                          #52
                          Originally posted by goeslikestink View Post
                          page 1 on my helpful links pages previously posted 1st article
                          how to fit a bridle
                          Yes, and thank you. I printed that out. Also some of the diagram on bend.

                          Comment

                          • Original Poster

                            #53
                            Originally posted by BaroquePony View Post
                            Baroque Pony is Mr. Smiley face laughing or crying?

                            Comment

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